Male righteous anger over potential sexual abuse charges

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PJH_74

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I’m curious about some of the increased male indignation over a perceived chance that an inaccurate sexual abuse accusation might cause you a job. Are any of you males will to consider women have dealt with similar career retarding/ending things for years? We wore the wrong thing (too sexy or not), we were too aggressive, we failed to accept a sexual quid pro quo, we didn’t act like one of the boys, etc. Now I will not claim this is a true experience for every woman, though some could have had realizing this socialized out of them, but this is an experience a great number of women have and/or navigate their careers around. I think this is uncomfortable because men have not had to think about this much before and it’s scary.
 
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Even assuming all that is true, the answer to women having to walk on eggshells in their professional life is not “let’s subject men to something similar to even it out.” Let’s try to build a culture where no one loses their job without good cause.*

*Im not saying a substantiated allegation of sexual misconduct isn’t “good cause.” Just making a general “two wrongs don’t make a right” point.
 
BoomBoomMancini said:
Let’s try to build a culture where no one loses their job without good cause.
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Exactly, but I’m seeing a large sentiment from men that this was just sprung on them by “feminazis” as Rush likes to call them. This is really a challenge here for to men to think about more than me and move onto we.
 
I’m a female and if someone made a false accusation towards me with no proof and it cost me a job, I’d be really righteously blowing my stack.

It might even be call-my-lawyer time.
 
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Sure, drop the slave-morality and the collective-revenge mindset.
 
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We also need to drop this assumption that women never abuse people who work under them, sexually, or in other ways.
Just because the boss is a woman doesn’t mean she isn’t messed up.
 
PJH_74 said:
I’m curious about some of the increased male indignation over a perceived chance that an inaccurate sexual abuse accusation might cause you a job. Are any of you males will to consider women have dealt with similar career retarding/ending things for years? We wore the wrong thing (too sexy or not), we were too aggressive, we failed to accept a sexual quid pro quo, we didn’t act like one of the boys, etc. Now I will not claim this is a true experience for every woman, though some could have had realizing this socialized out of them, but this is an experience a great number of women have and/or navigate their careers around. I think this is uncomfortable because men have not had to think about this much before and it’s scary.
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I don’t think that there is any “male righteous anger” over sexual harassment or abuse allegations. I would say, rather, that there is some of the following in the reactions we’re seeing:
  • Male self-righteous anger — When some men, used to being able to get away with wrongful conduct, find themselves finally losing their “right” (and this group does believe it’s their right) to abuse the vulnerable. Part of this may be defensive because they know the abuse is wrong; but I think part of it also lies in resentment of women no longer playing by the rule that they’re supposed to accept the abuse and not make waves.
  • Male fear of actually being in the wrong — When some men who have been abusive and know they’ve been abusive learn that their victims are starting to stand up for themselves.
  • Male fear of a false accusation — When men hear of sexual abuse allegations and worry that they might face a false accusation some day. Although false accusations are rare, they demonstrably exist, and they get LOTS of publicity.
  • And probably many other things, such as a lack of caring whether abuse occurred and being willing to allow it if other goals are met; reflexive defensiveness in which “My side must win no matter what!” even when it’s in the wrong; and maybe, just maybe, a little sexism thrown in.
But here’s the thing: most men agree that sexual abuse is wrong, should be punished when it occurs, and should (or at least understandably may) result in adverse consequences when it happens. The “Oh, no! Now no man is safe!” crowd is a distinct minority among men, largely composed of perpetrators and friends of perpetrators who want to continue the “Women don’t complain about these things” paradigm do they can perpetuate the abuse.

Frankly, having to occasionally respond to a false claim is not as much of a burden as having to fend off handsy bosses and customers who don’t believe you have any right to exist other than to please them.
 
Yes, it is the question at hand because you used the royal “We” like all women agree with you.

I’m a woman and I don’t.

Include me out of your narrative please. I haven’t spent my career walking on eggshells for being a woman either, and I was in a male dominated profession decades ago.
 
I’m a woman and I’m also angry that a man can easily lose his job over a mere allegation. It is not only unjust, but it makes me worried that we are headed towards a world in which the sexes can’t trust each other.
 
Tis_Bearself said:
Yes, it is the question at hand because you used the royal “We” like all women agree with you.

I’m a woman and I don’t.
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PJH_74 said:
Now I will not claim this is a true experience for every woman, though some could have had realizing this socialized out of them, but this is an experience a great number of women have and/or navigate their careers around.
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I already covered that one.
 
Ever been falsely accused yourself? I have, it was not sex related, but it was just as serious if not more so. It was also less fun than basic military training.
 
redbetta said:
I’m a woman and I’m also angry that a man can easily lose his job over a mere allegation. It is not only unjust, but it makes me worried that we are headed towards a world in which the sexes can’t trust each other.
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No one of course wants to see such a thing happen. This problem stems from mistrust, abusers have been allowed to operate and that makes the actions of others suspect.
 
Tis_Bearself said:
We also need to drop this assumption that women never abuse people who work under them, sexually, or in other ways.
Just because the boss is a woman doesn’t mean she isn’t messed up.
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Amen to that! My husband’s boss is a woman AND a toxic manager! Boy do we have stories! :roll_eyes:
 
Salmonslayer said:
And the idea that we’re supposed to immediately believe any unsubstantiated claim with no physical evidence or corroborating witness statements in any case is a terrible precedent to set
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Exactly. As someone else has already mentioned on other threads, the whole “Satanic panic” in the 80s and 90s in USA that resulted in a whole lot of wrongful convictions of day-care operators who were supposedly doing “Satanic ritual abuse” on children is Exhibit A in that scenario.

Unfortunately, when we spend decades not believing any victim, there is a tendency to overcompensate for that by the pendulum swinging the other way and believing every victim, including those for whom the evidence is simply not there to support their claim, those who have false memories, and those who lie or embellish for whatever reason.

Asking for evidence is not a personal insult to victims, it’s how a fair justice system works. It also helps make more certain that you convict the right people who are actually the ones committing the crimes.
 
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It refers to the school of thought that exalts victimhood-qua-victimhood as the superior moral state.
 
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