Man made good and evil?

[irom]

My agnostic friend thinks that good/evil are man made (not yet that gender is man made. In fact many discussions hit his ‘man made’ bottom line.What approach do you recommend, is the a resource I can read to better prepare myself ?

 

[vincent10395]

God in His very nature is Good! He gave us free will, and when we abused it evil entered the world.

For help on Morality:
reasonablefaith.org/can-we-be-good-without-god

For help on God’s goodness:
reasonablefaith.org/on-the-goodness-of-god

For free will you can go here:
reasonablefaith.org/free-will

Hope it helps! God Bless!

 

[irom]

But how to explain good and evil without references to God ?

 

[prodigalson2011]

Without God, the concepts of good and evil as moral absolutes are unintelligible. Materialism is inherently relativistic.

 

[CookieMaster123]

Very simple.People are social creatures and, for example, murder wouldn’t be good for survival of species.Thus murder is seen as wrong.So both of you are wrong, it wasn’t God nor human, it was just adaptation to human’s social life.

 

[inocente]

That’s the most sensible post I’ve read today.

 

[fhansen]

My agnostic friend thinks that good/evil are man made (not yet that gender is man made. In fact many discussions hit his ‘man made’ bottom line.What approach do you recommend, is the a resource I can read to better prepare myself ?

"Men-and angels- “make” evil by the abuse of their free will-by opposing God’s will.

 

[crochet_lady]

How to explain good and evil without referencing God? Well – One approach could be – Why do we get upset if someone steals from us? Or when someone lies to us? Or we hear about people killing each other? And what Makes something good or evil? There really is a ‘plumb-line’ in Society.
And these questions and the answer Does lead a person to think about a ‘Higher Power’ at work in the universe. And it takes us back to the Ten Commandments. And that takes us to Where the Ten Commandments Came from.
And – if we Didn’t consider stealing , murder Wrong, then Why do we try to solve the question of Who did that ‘deed’ and what their punishment should be?
And – Why do we congratulate people for their good grades / and we Support man/ woman marriages and have parties to celebrate an engagement / marriage. And people who go out of their way to Help others are congratulated. And those who graduate from HIgh School / college/ universities. We rejoice with the birth of a baby – well – we Try to – depending on the circumstances. And there are Still Lots of babies being born to loving men and women who are married
And – why Shouldn’t we be referencing God – after all – there are Lots of churches in every city/ town/ village – so God /‘god’ of Some sort Is being recognized / worshiped. So - we Should be able to reference God / of the Bible/ when talking about good / evil.

 

[irom]

Very simple.People are social creatures and, for example, murder wouldn’t be good for survival of species.Thus murder is seen as wrong.So both of you are wrong, it wasn’t God nor human, it was just adaptation to human’s social life.

But this answer assumes that man made himself I would rather agree with prodigalson2011 who says that without God, the concepts of good and evil as moral absolutes are unintelligible. Materialism is inherently relativistic.

 

[dshix]

Very simple.People are social creatures and, for example, murder wouldn’t be good for survival of species.Thus murder is seen as wrong.So both of you are wrong, it wasn’t God nor human, it was just adaptation to human’s social life.

This is incorrect.

Murder is seen as inherently wrong by humans because we possess natures which were created according to the natural law.

The natural law is in nature. It can be discovered and applied by man without God’s help, because He wove it into nature. This is not to say that it is not from God, but rather that it can be found without His direct intervention, which is why it appears to many that it is not from God.

 

[prodigalson2011]

This is incorrect.

Murder is seen as inherently wrong by humans because we possess natures which were created according to the natural law.

The natural law is in nature. It can be discovered and applied by man without God’s help, because He wove it into nature. This is not to say that it is not from God, but rather that it can be found without His direct intervention, which is why it appears to many that it is not from God.

But you must remember that the natural law philosophy itself assumes the existence of God. You’re not very likely to find many atheists who accept it.

Natural law is a teleological philosophy; that is, it assumes that we (and the universe) have an objective purpose. Without God, nothing has an objective purpose: everything is accidental. This is why it is impossible to find a logical ground for objective morality (good and evil) apart from God. There is no reason to assume that survival, health, happiness, etc. are preferable to non-existence or total destruction if everything exists for no ultimate reason.

 

[dshix]

But you must remember that the natural law philosophy itself assumes the existence of God. You’re not very likely to find many atheists who accept it.

Natural law is a teleological philosophy; that is, it assumes that we (and the universe) have an objective purpose. Without God, nothing has an objective purpose: everything is accidental. This is why it is impossible to find a logical ground for objective morality (good and evil) apart from God. There is no reason to assume that survival, health, happiness, etc. are preferable to non-existence or total destruction if everything exists for no ultimate reason.

You are right. However, I contend that it is possible, (albeit, difficult,) to prove the existence of the natural law without God.

Whether the exercise has any merit or not, is a good question, but I think it is possible because there are many things in the world which are self-evident. If I touch a hot stove, I feel pain. If I kill my mother, I feel remorse. Yes, the former is a physical truth which can be explained by science and the latter a truth of conscience, which is intangible, but I think that it is definitely possible to prove to any person that there is a natural order in the world, an inherent moral code in man.

The virtues of the natural law are, of course, different from those of the moral law. For the Greeks and Romans, strength, intelligence, stature, and courage were the foremost virtues. Why are these natural virtues? Why did every pagan culture which lacked a separate moral code which superseded these natural virtues consider them to be the fundamental virtues of man? Human nature.

I understand that going through this whole thought process is somewhat fruitless when there is no final spiritual end to look for (God) but nevertheless I think it is useful in proving to an atheist or agnostic that there is still a natural order to the world.