Mandatory Drug Testing For Welfare Recipients?

[That_one_guy]

I dont know if any of you have been on welfare, but my family has.

Yes. I have. To those who pride themselves on their work ethic it can be very embarrassing.

in 6 months my mother got her support back we left Welfare and in those 6 months we kept seeing the same people kicking and screaming wanting their way and unwilling to change and stand on their own two feet out of simple laziness. some however we stopped seeing, dont know what happened to them, but they stopped coming.

So i am saying take it from the people who are unwilling to change and unwilling to stand on their own feet, out of shear laziness and give it to the people who truly need it. Now if that sounds not compassionate i hope you realize that is what Jesus said to do. With the Parable of the Ruler and the servants. he gave some servants talents and they were expect to do thing with it, Better the rulers kingdom, better themselves and better the talents. one servant however did nothing with it and buried it. he later had the talent taken away was cast into outer darkness where there is weeping and Gnashing of teeth.

Maybe they should drug test these people:shrug:
just sayin’…

 

[jbrown0059]

I dont know if any of you have been on welfare, but my family has. My mother before she died, was a missionary for an organization called CEF. it a collection of people who try very hard to take the gospel to Children. Especially underprivileged and city kids. My mother lost all of her support from a church because of the Hypocrisy and actions of another in that church. (If you have not figured out i am protestant, at least until Easter.) So we had to apply to welfare. Now already technically my mother did not have a “Job” because the Government does not recognize missionary as a job. we were a shoe in. So we went to the welfare office to get our first check and that office was filled with mostly Fat white and black, lazy people( not being racist just telling it how it is. also not stating that is how it is all over the USA.) and these people would yell and scream to get their way in this office. there were people with Genuine need in that office and they got their help, but unfortunately those people received the stereo-type of fat and lazy, because they were in that office. Being on Welfare, is humiliating, and down right degrading and people take advantage of that system all the time.

Now of course if some one can not work for some reason, Injury or a disease, then of course not, don’t take it away, help them, the bible says stand up for those who can not stand up for themselves. in 6 months my mother got her support back we left Welfare and in those 6 months we kept seeing the same people kicking and screaming wanting their way and unwilling to change and stand on their own two feet out of simple laziness. some however we stopped seeing, dont know what happened to them, but they stopped coming.

So i am saying take it from the people who are unwilling to change and unwilling to stand on their own feet, out of shear laziness and give it to the people who truly need it. Now if that sounds not compassionate i hope you realize that is what Jesus said to do. With the Parable of the Ruler and the servants. he gave some servants talents and they were expect to do thing with it, Better the rulers kingdom, better themselves and better the talents. one servant however did nothing with it and buried it. he later had the talent taken away was cast into outer darkness where there is weeping and Gnashing of teeth.

The average American should not feel bad about taking from the state as the state has taken from them for years and sometimes generations.

However, when the average American goes to say the country hospital and it is loaded with Latin Americans and you know they haven’t payed into our system, then the outrage should be noted. Some Americans get turned away in favor of LAs being treated. I was once told that I would be put on a waiting list and have to wait a year before I could see a doctor at my town’s clinic that was loaded with Latin Americans and their children.

If they have no shame sucking up all that you worked for, why should you feel bad?

 

[st_lucy]

A job is not the government. Private drug testing (as is done by employers, like Rob Horn’s) and government drug testing aren’t remotely the same thing. **The government cannot invade your body **or home for any reason, unless they have some form of evidence that you are doing drugs. They cannot simply get you to take a pee test because you’re on welfare. It’s a gross invasion of privacy, and illegal search and seizure, violating your fourth amendment right. If you’re willing to give up some of your rights, you need to give them all up, that’s just my opinion.

And yet the government has made it legal to do just that with the passing of roe v wade.

Back OT I would be very against drug testing those one welfare, simply because of the cost, and invasion of privicy. We can not ask a single mother to take time off of her job and away from her children to take a very useless test that might turn out positive. Our government is already too much in our kitchen as it is. When our government does what they think is right as in the case stated above they tend to get all wrong,

 

[st_lucy]

The average American should not feel bad about taking from the state as the state has taken from them for years and sometimes generations.

However, when the average American goes to say the country hospital and it is loaded with Latin Americans and you know they haven’t payed into our system, then the outrage should be noted. Some Americans get turned away in favor of LAs being treated. I was once told that I would be put on a waiting list and have to wait a year before I could see a doctor at my town’s clinic that was loaded with Latin Americans and their children.

If they have no shame sucking up all that you worked for, why should you feel bad?

just to let you know not all of those “LA’s” are welshes.

 

[That_one_guy]

just to let you know not all of those “LA’s” are welshes.

They’ve probably never even heard of Wales!

 

[RobHom]

Only the drug addict has to worry about it. Drug testing is relatively easy nowadays. There isn’t as much shipping around as there was before. You can even get kits for home use!

Yes…I can buy a home test kit, but the efficacy of those kits is what… about as good as “Clyde” cared the day it was made. If one if to propose a mandatory drug evaluation for continuation or elimination of benefits…home kits are not going to cut it. Shucks, why not throw your money at a “cottage industry”… Afterall, panacea comes in many forms… You might want to read the following… rwjf.org/reports/grr/049207.htm Especially the part that involves the Supreme Court… and while it involves someone’s “rugrat”…imagine the furor if it involves an adult?

As long as the testee can provide proof of prescription for whatever is in their system there should be nothing to worry about.

Under standardized guidelines (Federal) this is already accounted for, but is not the primary issue.

The only people who would oppose mandatory drug testing would be people who condone recreational drug use.

Not necessarily so. Lets say Joe or Sally has a job interview, and some “bureau-cat” calls them or sends them a memo that says they have a “****-test” on such and such date and time, but whooooops… Joe or Sally has a job interview at the same time and date, and its a good job that will pull them back on their feet and get them off the rolls…but whoa, hey, get down… that piece of paper from the “Fed” or the “State” takes precedence, so Joe or Sally drops the ball, shows up to pee in the cup, and misses out on the interview…and someone else gets the job. Well…the “bureau-cats” have done their part…they did a good turn in protecting their job security…by keeping someone in the system.

Folks…if the so-called “Drug Czar” and the Attorney General of the US were to throw down the gauntlet and actually pursue killing the illegal trafficking of drugs in this country, it would be a non-issue. But when we have 1 out of 100 or more containers actually inspected in our ports…frankly, the very notion of drug interdiction on the Fed’s part serves almost as good a purpose as urinating on an electric fence.

 

[That_one_guy]

Yes…I can buy a home test kit, but the efficacy of those kits is what… about as good as “Clyde” cared the day it was made. If one if to propose a mandatory drug evaluation for continuation or elimination of benefits…home kits are not going to cut it. Shucks, why not throw your money at a “cottage industry”… Afterall, panacea comes in many forms… You might want to read the following… rwjf.org/reports/grr/049207.htm Especially the part that involves the Supreme Court… and while it involves someone’s “rugrat”…imagine the furor if it involves an adult?

First off, I was merely showing that it isn’t as expensive as TPBM stated. Second off, a minor isn’t going to receive benefits. The parent or guardian will. So, your post is not even relevent.

Under standardized guidelines (Federal) this is already accounted for, but is not the primary issue.

Not necessarily so. Lets say Joe or Sally has a job interview, and some “bureau-cat” calls them or sends them a memo that says they have a “****-test” on such and such date and time, but whooooops… Joe or Sally has a job interview at the same time and date, and its a good job that will pull them back on their feet and get them off the rolls…but whoa, hey, get down… that piece of paper from the “Fed” or the “State” takes precedence, so Joe or Sally drops the ball, shows up to pee in the cup, and misses out on the interview…and someone else gets the job. Well…the “bureau-cats” have done their part…they did a good turn in protecting their job security…by keeping someone in the system.

There was this really interesting device invented in the early 20th century. I bet you have one. It’s called , a telephone.

I agree that our government messes up everything they get their incompetent hands on. But, it’s the one we got. So, we may as well make the best of it.
What does import inspection have to do with it anyway? (r u on drugs? )

 

[RobHom]

First off, I was merely showing that it isn’t as expensive as TPBM stated. Second off, a minor isn’t going to receive benefits. The parent or guardian will. So, your post is not even relevent

But the problem is this…if the Supreme Court has weighed in on minors…what can you possibly think that they will not where adults are concerned.

Apparently you are not really well versed at this issue. I say that because… As a Professional Driver, CDL-A w/XT, if I am involved in an accident with you…I am subjected to both “drug and alcohol testing” and I must be tested for alcohol within two hours and cannot leave the site of the accident or it is considered a refusal which kills my CDL. Under the drug rule it must be accomplished within 32 hours or there are severe problems as well. You…you get to go on your merry way, not subjected to “jack”.,… You can be stoned or drunk…but you are not subject to any testing…because it would violate your right to privacy! Me, I think all drivers…regardless of level of license or vehicle should be subject to random testing for drugs and alcohol…

The “relevancy” of my post is significant…because you fail to understand the legal ramifications of the issue, much less the logistics.

.There was this really interesting device invented in the early 20th century. I bet you have one. It’s called , a telephone

WOW… really? And apparently you have had little personal experience in dealing with petty bureaucrats charged with “responsibilities”… LOLOLOL… !~!

Folks…if the so-called “Drug Czar” and the Attorney General of the US were to throw down the gauntlet and actually pursue killing the illegal trafficking of drugs in this country, it would be a non-issue. But when we have 1 out of 100 or more containers actually inspected in our ports…frankly, the very notion of drug interdiction on the Fed’s part serves almost as good a purpose as urinating on an electric fence.

Statement stands as fact.

I agree that our government messes up everything they get their incompetent hands on. But, it’s the one we got. So, we may as well make the best of it.

Yep, lets hire a bunch more people to load down the system…and accomplish little or nothing…

What does import inspection have to do with it anyway?

It has a great deal to do with it… Beyond the fact that marijuana can be grown domestically…and crack cocaine can be ginned up locally…the bottom line is that the majority of heavy drugs are imported into this country…not home grown.

(r u on drugs? )

That was either a “truly stoooopid question” or a “smart-***” one.
I carry several Federal certifications, and am subject to more testing than most. I do not use “drugs” and am bound by Federal Law to report my prescriptions to my employer…and even though Federal Laws permit me to operate with certain prescriptions in my bloodstream, if properly and legally prescribed, my employer does not. I am required to “stand down” and take time off…even without pay while taking said prescriptions. My occupation is considered “Safety Sensitive” and as such…there are a number of safeguards in place to protect both myself and the general public.

I am tempted to say something…but I won’t waste the sentiment.

 

[That_one_guy]

RobHom

I apologize for my flippancy.

I have to pass drug tests, too. For me it’s no problem and I don’t feel it violates my privacy at all. I think that only people who have something to hide would be worried about this.

 

[RobHom]

RobHom

I apologize for my flippancy.

Not a problem, really… my answers, or responses are generically intended…not personal, OK?

I have to pass drug tests, too. For me it’s no problem and I don’t feel it violates my privacy at all. I think that only people who have something to hide would be worried about this.

I’ve been dealing with this issue since 1968 when I was licensed as an Air Traffic Controller by the FAA…and later when I was stationed in situations involving “Nuclear Surety”…and I tend to agree that they who object have something to hide… I’ve been subject to the rules for 40 years now…

Beyond that, I think it would just be a logistical and legal nightmare when you are dealing with civilians in a system…

Its not that I would object to the recipients being tested, its just that I am a pragmatist at heart…

 

[That_one_guy]

Not a problem, really… my answers, or responses are generically intended…not personal, OK?

I’ve been dealing with this issue since 1968 when I was licensed as an Air Traffic Controller by the FAA…and later when I was stationed in situations involving “Nuclear Surety”…and I tend to agree that they who object have something to hide… I’ve been subject to the rules for 40 years now…

Beyond that, I think it would just be a logistical and legal nightmare when you are dealing with civilians in a system…

Its not that I would object to the recipients being tested, its just that I am a pragmatist at heart…

I helped to build ‘Intel’ fab 22,32 and 11x and worked at Palo Verde nuclear power plant.

for the record

 

[Eggnotz]

No one in America should be allowed to starve or suffer unduly. However, there should be a tiered system for receiving benefits. If a person does drugs, they have no natural rights to the money of others. God does not require me to give money to people in order for them to smoke it. I must feed them and clothe them.

There should also be a mechanism by which able-bodied people perform some type of work in order to receive benefits. You do no one a favor by handing them money, even if it pleases them and gives you a fuzzy. Working for what we get is how God created us. To short-circuit that reciprocity is not an act of love.

Everyone should be cared for. A person having kids and expecting society to pay for their choices is like Hamas using babies as a shield. You protect the baby because that’s what loving people do.

I have three committed Christian family members who work professionally with welfare recipients every day. I have as well along with doing prison ministry.

No one has the inherent right to use drugs and receive money. Being tested is a small price to pay in order to receive the benefits of someone else’s labor. Tax money doesn’t fall from the sky as many American politicians seem to think. Someone has to be responsible, get out of bed every day and exert effort to produce it.

No one should suffer hardship. But Carte Blanche for generations is not the way to go either.

 

[RobHom]

I helped to build ‘Intel’ fab 22,32 and 11x and worked at Palo Verde nuclear power plant.

for the record

Yes, you do know what its all about…

Oddly enough, though I was trained as an Air Traffic Controller for the Army many years ago… and we had heavy constraints…couldn’t work the tower even if we were taking antihistamines… for a cold, I was later assigned to USAREUR and worked Nuclear Surety in the Arty Grp S-3… NRAS Program, and I have to tell you… I spent more time in the can filling the cup than I care to remember…and was “monitored” the whole time…a definite “PIA”…

A friend of mine is an engineer and he just went to work at Turkey Point…LOL…he had to do the “drill”…LOL!!

 

[That_one_guy]

Yes, you do know what its all about…

Oddly enough, though I was trained as an Air Traffic Controller for the Army many years ago… and we had heavy constraints…couldn’t work the tower even if we were taking antihistamines… for a cold, I was later assigned to USAREUR and worked Nuclear Surety in the Arty Grp S-3… NRAS Program, and I have to tell you… I spent more time in the can filling the cup than I care to remember…and was “monitored” the whole time…a definite “PIA”…

A friend of mine is an engineer and he just went to work at Turkey Point…LOL…he had to do the “drill”…LOL!!

well, when we had to make our water offerings, it was done on sight. And I got paid for doing it. I don’t want to work with some dork on drugs. Very dangerous around all that heavy machinery.

 

[quiet52]

There should also be a mechanism by which able-bodied people perform some type of work in order to receive benefits. You do no one a favor by handing them money, even if it pleases them and gives you a fuzzy. Working for what we get is how God created us. To short-circuit that reciprocity is not an act of love.

Everyone should be cared for. A person having kids and expecting society to pay for their choices is like Hamas using babies as a shield. You protect the baby because that’s what loving people do.

QUOTE]

Most welfare recipients are “able-bodied” and many are employed part-time, if they are able to find someone else to care for their children. But many cannot work because they have young children to care for. A $6.00/hour job flipping hamburgers will not provide enough to support themselves and their children, let alone pay for childcare while they’re working.

Some welfare recipients have disabled family members needing constant care.

Your comparison of someone receiving government assistance to a terrorist group using children as a shield is ugly. To judge that someone purposely has children in order to sponge off the government is ugly. You do not know if their husbands have left them or have died; you do not know the secret suffering of so many of those who must ask for help, knowing they’re going to be judged. You have not walked in their shoes.

To demand that welfare recipients be tested for drugs is like twisting the knife that attacks their dignity as persons.

 

[vz71]

There are specific requirements as to where, when and how the testing is done. It involves solely certified personnel and requires a very sound and set chain of evidence. It is not an inexpensive operation…and it generally requires the “over-nighting” of the samples by air express to a limited number of laboratories that are certified.

A simple violation of the chain of evidence or a mixing of the samples can cause false positives or false negatives. It is far more cumbersome and expensive than one might imagine.

I think that if you were to invoke this type of testing…you would create both a financial and logistical nightmare.

I don’t know, the drug testing my employer uses is handled 100% in the doctor’s office, within minutes.
Of course, I doubt the test is nearly as extensive as the drug testing for CDL’s. But then, would such a test as the original post describes really need to be that extensive?

Consider for a moment, a simple urinalysis that takes about a minute. If a hit is registered, further testing is triggered, else the test is passed and the welfare recipient goes on their way.

I believe this would effectively diffuse the logistical nightmare described.

 

[goofyjim]

But why stop at welfare recipients. Everyone owes it to society to stay drug free. Everyone shoudl undergo mandatory drug testing. If you test positive you are required to go to a rehab or jail.

 

[That_one_guy]

But why stop at welfare recipients. Everyone owes it to society to stay drug free. Everyone shoudl undergo mandatory drug testing. If you test positive you are required to go to a rehab or jail.

And we should drug test our dogs and cats, too! Let’s drug test everybody! It’s the new craze! Haven’t been drug tested lately? Come on! Get with it man! All the cool kids are doing it!:jrbirdman:

yeah,…right.:takethat:

 

[vz71]

But why stop at welfare recipients. Everyone owes it to society to stay drug free.

But not everyone is being given money from the public treasury.

If we all were, then I see no problem in testing all.
But I see no problem in using drug testing as a minimum standard for welfare recipients.

 

[Eggnotz]

But why stop at welfare recipients. Everyone owes it to society to stay drug free.

No, only people who reap the benefits of someone else’s labor. And rightly they should reap those benefits because that’s what a civilized society does to help those in need. There is no inalienable right to opiates. Two different things.