Many thoughts/questions

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I am sort of new to the forum, and I appreciate any helpful (name removed by moderator)ut to my ramblings. I am hoping this post will be cathartic since I seem to have a hard time finding people in my life that really understand what I am going through. I am somewhat new to my faith that I have had since birth. Religion was always something we “did”, church every Sunday- a spanking if I didn’t behave there, no real discussion about God/Jesus during the week- we pretty much left God at church on Sunday except for a generic prayer at dinner/ bedtime. My parents seemed to live a moral life as far as I could see, but I am not sure how devoted they were to God- but more so to following rules, rules, rules. I remember going to school with evangelicals that didn’t like Catholics much, and they did exhibit some vitriol at times, but for the most part their faith and love of God was pretty real and impressive unlike anything I had experienced at church. I knew one family in my church that seemed to really live their faith, and they seemed weird to everyone and sometimes, they would be the butt of our jokes.

Fast forward to adulthood- I am craving more God came into my life in a pretty profound way, but I have no idea what He wants me to do…and I have such a hard time finding peace or joy in the catholic church. If Paul wrote the we should use the Sword of the Spirit, the word of God as our offensive tool how do Catholics do this when they do not know scripture? I am over generalizing, but more so speaking from my own experience. I have no way to know God’s voice- I have very little knowledge of his Word.
I have gone to confession and spilled my guts and wanted to feel better, but felt a sadness, so unworthy and I cried so hard. My confessor told me to read St Faustina’s diary as penance and honestly I did read it and felt pretty terrible. Some people just love the church but to me it feels like everything is so sad in the church. The music is so somber and people just seem dead, like what are they here for- just so they don’t have a mortal sin on their souls? I just wish it didn’t always feel like a punishment, or that I am never really sure if I will have salvation because I may not have confessed all my sins properly or the confessor may have said “May God Absolve you” of your sin rather than “I absolve you”- it feels a little like being chained. Yet I confess them to God and that is not enough, I will go to hell if I haven’t confessed properly?
I don’t’ want to be disrespectful to anyone, but it appears to me that those in the protestant churches seem to truly love God. I use my evangelical SIL as an example- she, as far as I knew, did not have premarital sex before her marriage- she was someone that actually lived out her faith because she loved God. Now I may have been traveling in odd circles, but I never met Catholics like that- I went to Catholic school and there was no commitment to Christ what so ever. My son went to Catholic school and honestly, the same was true there, no one spoke of faith or displayed any real conviction. So when I had a pretty personal experience that led me to wanting more of God and Christ I did not turn to Catholics. I called my protestant friends and neighbors and they provided comfort to my soul as have been reading some non-catholic authors that use scripture in their everyday walk. I have read on the forums here and some are so harsh some do not listen to anything protestants say and go far as to say they might be heretics- but I think that is very unfair and sometimes it just adds to the loneliness I feel. Isn’t Jesus working through Protestants, too? I just wish I felt the same joy in the catholic church as a I do in some of the evangelical churches, I guess I got that “touchy feely” thing going on. Didn’t Ignatius of Loyola say that God spoke to him through emotions?
I do believe church should be reverent, but does it always have to be so somber and so hard to relate to especially for the younger generation, such as my own children? I just feel detached, and often the stories of the saints depress me a bit. Mary is wonderful, but I just can’t relate to her like some others do. I go to God and Jesus because that is who I want more of and all of the other stuff just seems to get in the way. I am sorry to offend anyone, including my God- as I said I am just looking for someone who might have or have had similar feelings and might have some advice on what helps them. PAX
 
Welcome! 👋

It is great that you are responding to God’s desire to be a bigger part of your life. That is something we all should strive to do every single day. 👍

I am sorry to hear of your relatively negative experience with Catholics. Unfortunately, your experience is not entirely uncommon. However, it is also not completely ubiquitous. There are many great and vibrant Catholics and Catholic parishes out there who take seriously the call to discipleship. I’ve seen them myself. It’s where I live! 🙂

I understand the hang-ups some have about confessing to a priest. For me, it is actually the opposite. If I only confessed my sins to God in my bedroom at home, I would always have that lingering doubt in my head as to whether or not it really “worked” or whether I did it “right.” With the Sacrament of Confession, I have confidence that my sins are really forgiven because Jesus gave that authority to his apostles who have passed it down to the bishops and priests down to our present day. Thus, even when my feelings of doubt bubble up, that inner conviction that I am forgiven remains. That is a precious gift to me. It makes me feel like Jesus instituted the sacrament just for me because he knows how my brain works. 😛

You’re absolutely right that we need more joy in more of our Catholic parishes. Sadly, many parishes simply do not know what to do with those of us who want to live out our faith in all its fullness.

However, the fact that many Catholics may be going through the motions without any sense of interior conversion does not negate the fact that the Catholic Church is who She says She is: the one, universal Church established by Christ. That is true regardless of the holiness of Her members.

Yes, there are things we can learn from our Protestant brothers and sisters who are joyful disciples. Yes, there is room for improvement in our Catholic parishes and amongst Catholics in general. But what it comes down to is either the Catholic Church is who She says She is, or She is not.

For me, the answer was clear the moment I accepted Jesus as my Lord and Savior. I trust Him when He gave the keys of the Kingdom to Peter that He was establishing the Catholic Church. It makes perfect sense to me that Jesus would establish a visible Church that was capable of safeguarding the Revelation He brought to the human race and that He would want that guarantee of Truth to be perpetuated throughout history. Otherwise, we’d never really be sure if we were following Jesus as He is or simply as we think He is.

I have certainly met my fair share of lackluster Catholics. But I simply pray for them. I pray that they will recognize the great treasure of inestimable value that is sitting right in front of their faces. I know that I, too, often fail to recognize the value of my faith and that I fail – often spectacularly so – in living out my faith. So often I do not do the good that I want to do but the evil that I do not want is what I do.

Keep praying. Keep reading the Scripture. I would also encourage you to look at the Catechism. It is online. It explains our Catholic faith very beautifully and is full of references to Scripture and the writings of the saints. And if you encounter anything that raises questions for you, you can always come here. Just try to ignore those of us who are a bit on the belligerent side. 😉

God bless. I will pray for you. Please pray for me, too.
 
Hey Buddy, I am in the exact same spot as you. So exact that I won’t even bother posting my own story (although I alredy posted it a few months ago).
I want to feel that closeness to god but so far find the Catholic Church as an institution somewhat unispiring. Most of the feedback I got did not really help. I was advised to pray to mary, pray the rosary, saint so and so (or some other person I have not heard of) says* we should feel a certain way so just do it. Lots of things that seemed to me to be “superficial” trapping of the catholic church that might be more of an endpoint than a starting point indeveloping a strong faith. Like going to a guitar teacher and saying I want to learn guitar and right away he hands you a crazy Yngwie Malmsteen song and says ok, just play this.
I too tend to go to protestant sources for inspiration and knowledge, and then try to fit that into the framework of the catholic faith that I have been apart of since birth pretty much on paper only.
I have tried going to catholic media sources, ETWN, various podcasts, etc and they just don’t grab me the way the protestant stuff. I am not just talking about being entertained and listening to guys like Joel Osteen. I am talking about more information oriented stuff. I like watching prophecy in the news and listen to a ton of great poscasts, and have found no catholic equivalent that really grabs my attention, inspires me to want to get close to christ and read the bible.
Catholic media feels like I am sitting through drivers ed class. It is always really dated feeling or two guys with beards having a very dry conversation.
 
Wow - There is a lot there to try to respond to…

It is obvious that your catechesis was poor growing up and I guess your home life wasn’t much encouragement. Sadly you are not alone in this.
All too often it seems that people are not moved past the “rules” and into the deeper understandings and joys of the faith. I liken it to where Paul spoke of feeding the new converts (spiritual infants) on milk because they were not ready for solid food (Cor 3:2).
There can be many reasons for this…which I won’t go into here…but it can definitely lead to the kind of outlook and problems you express in your post.

Now I will say here that the rules are right, proper and good. They are a very necessary foundation. As a counterpoint to this we see in certain protestant groups a great “love for Jesus” but then very little real structure - very few “rules”. Yes they have the bible - but then depending on who, or what group you talk to, the bible seems to say different things to each one of them.

So where you were raised on"rules" and now have trouble finding the joy - the flip side are those who have the “joy” of Jesus - - but seem to have no rules.

Of course, like you, I am painting with a very wide brush here and certainly there are many shades in all of this…but I’m trying to give you some perspective on where you are and how you might have gotten here. Just some food for thought.

As for how Catholics act in Church - and your own feelings - again this goes back to catechesis. The Mass is the most profound experience of our faith. The taking into our bodies of the very body, blood, soul and divinity of Jesus Christ. Not a symbol but the real thing.
Do people look somber? Yes they do - but consider that it might be because they are deep in prayer and profound gratitude for what they are there to receive. I have actually cried after having received communion. What might another person think of that???
It is important to understand what the mass is, and not to try to compare it to non-Catholic services.

Should we have more joy in our parishes? Yes probably so. But remember that joy can take many forms. Most parishes have ways to become involved in many good works and these can give great joy. Most parishes have various activities during the week - and around here the summer is packed full of parish festivals where everyone has a great time.

So - While I am glad that you have these wonderful Christian friends who are encouraging you, I would suggest that you owe it to yourself (and to them) to learn about the faith of your birth and your baptism. If you are tired of milk…go for the solid food. A wonderful author by the name of Scott Hahn (a minister convert) has written about the mass (The Lamb’s Supper) and about his own journey into the faith (Rome Sweet Home)

I am sure that others will be able to offer you other reading suggestions that hopefully won’t make you feel sad.

Hope this helps you some.

Peace
James
 
Thanks to all that took the time to post.
James, I agree wholeheartedly about my religious education- but that is either a pretty sad commentary about my church (or about my attention span) seeing how many children were in my ccd class as a child. Our priest was thoroughly disinterested in us as a congregation, we couldn’t understand him, he mumbled and spoke too fast and the only homily I remember was a scratchy recording of the pope he would play ever so often. It didn’t really inspire much. I cannot remember one instance when something a priest said touched my heart during mass or after, as a youngster and yet I hear story after story of people in other denominations giving their lives to Christ during an alter call when they were very young. Either people are lying or they are doing something right. I could have never seen that happening in my church and in fact if anyone professed this sort of thing, most would have thought they were just a little too much and weirdos. Maybe I feel a little robbed of that experience.
Now I have met many Catholics that followed few rules, but went to church- or maybe didn’t-( I was one of them for years)- but I have met far more non-Catholics who not just read the word but did what it says in most parts of their lives- that prayed out loud before they drove in a car, raised their arms during a song, or laid hands on a person crying. Why? I think it has to do with this deep appreciation and devotion for a God they love and know and they weren’t ashamed to express that to others. I never saw any of this in my churches my whole life, and quite honestly I want to be that kind of person, and have those kind of people in my life so we can lift each other. The only reason I bring any of this up is because it says in the word “by their fruits you will know them”. I sound very judgmental and I don’t mean to be- I am just simply attracted to those with a genuine “living it loud without saying a word” faith, and I just don’t see it much in the pews on Sunday.
In my church growing up it was a sad, somber place. There is no other way to say it- deep in prayer, lethargic, disengaged, uninterested -I don’t know- but it was pretty depressing. And, honestly so is the church I go to today- I see very few families or young people my age. I see very few fathers which is sad, only women with their kids (and these women are married) I see few teens, and they all look bored to tears- however the church down the street is rocking out, and I see youth on fire for God, that is what is awesome to me in this crazy culture we live in! Yes, that might not be the worship service that God has asked us to have with reverence and complete with the Eucharist- but shouldn’t we want to engage those who are thirsting for this sort of experience too, like me?
Thanks again for reading.
PAX
 
Oh and I read Scott and Kimberly Hahn- and it did give me great comfort- Kimberly said in her testimony that during the winter of her soul that God spoke to her through His word, because she had years and years of knowing and loving God- something I have never had and now yearn for. Where did she get that relationship as a youngster? How was it nurtured?
 
Of course I cannot speak to the parishes in your area but the parish I belong to is very supportive and has many families with children. So - I wonder if it might not be worth your while to visit different parishes and see if you sense a different vibe.

That said, I do not wish to denigrate our protestant brothers and sisters. Indeed many do have a wonderful faith that permeates their lives. There are just so many different ways to express that faith. I just would not wish you to make too hasty a judgement on the approach that many Catholics take.

You ask a good question about Kimberly Hahn’s comment. In reply I will only say this…
Yes there are many protestants who grow up in devout households. So do many Catholics.
Likewise there are many protestants who grow up in lukewarm households or non-practicing households…just as you relate that you did.
There isn’t any real panecea…

We each need to grow where we are…

Peace
James
 
I agree with James. There are people on every part of the spectrum from “on-fire-with-love-for-the-Lord” to “I-don’t-even-know-why-I’m-here” in both Catholic parishes and Protestant congregations.

As James suggested, trying other parishes is one idea. You might try that. Perhaps you will encounter something more dynamic.

Not every priest is an excellent preacher, though. I’ve known some who seemed to preach the same homily every single weekend who would drone on and on and on and on. But then I’ve also known some who are really great speakers. It is definitely a great blessing to have such priests. I probably wouldn’t be where I’m at if not for a few such priests that I knew who were able to preach so effectively about the Scriptures. When the spark of faith was first ignited, they helped fan it into flame.

Perhaps it would be good for you to pray and ask for God to send such priests into your life.

But – and not to dampen the mood – it is possible you will not find such a dynamic parish within a 20 mile radius of your home. Perhaps God is calling you to be that leaven in your parish, to help others come to a more vibrant faith life.

For me, my desire to receive the Eucharist more or less makes the tone and mood of the liturgy of secondary importance. But I know it does help when everything is firing on all cylinders.
 
I see a lot (in this thread and many others) the idea that many people had poor Catechesis, which led them to stray from the Church or not really be close to Jesus or their faith. I’ve thought a lot about this because I often wonder why I was so NOT Catholic after 17 years of Catholic schooling, and yet my children seem to be closer to their faith (for under-10-year-olds anyway), meanwhle they attend public school. I have come to the conclusion that Catholic schools are counterproductive. Religion just becomes another subject along with math and science, and in most cases ends up being nothing more than a history class. Also, because schools are built around rules, structure, and discipline, too many Catholic grow up just viewing the Church as this rigid organization telling them what they can and can’t do. How many stories do we have of being hit by nuns? It just becomes an organization of rules, as some have pointed out here. Also, Catholic schools are filled with non-Catholics and other bad influences. You have many students who attend just because their parents want them to have a better education, but they may be Jewish, Protestant, Budhist, Atheist, etc. Many of the kids come from Catholic households, but are not practicing Catholics in the least. In all honesty, it’s a VERY poor environment in which to understand and grow your faith. On the other hand, CCD class, which my children attend, is completely separate from school, and is not just a subject. It takes place in the church. They are with other kids, all of whom are Catholic, and all of whom are there for one reason and one reason only - to learn about God. Their religous education doesn’t get lost in the shuffle of daily school life.

I’ll even give one very specific example. As a senior in high school, a prestigous NYC Catholic high school, I had to present a paper on a controversial political subject and I chose abortion. My paper, naturally, presented a pro-life stance and I used both religous/moral and legal arguments. To my absolute shock, I found most of my fellow students to be combative, and ardently pro-choice. I handled myself just fine because I was confident in my position, but it was not a very supportive environment for a teenager trying to figure out his own spirituality. By the way, most of those combative, pro-choice students were “Catholic.”
 
Madtom,
Very interesting post. I hadn’t really thought of Catholic schools as “counterproductive” but then my experience of them was many many years ago.

The points you bring up are really interesting and I think most of them tend to spring from a single source - or problem. That is, not making the faith the center of one’s life. This applies at the family and parish level primarily - since we are talking about the formation of children here.

When I went to Catholic school we prayed before class, at least half of the teachers were religious - sisters in our case. Non-Catholic kids were a rarity - though not unknown. But most importantly - the faith was lived out at home. Sunday mass (and HDOs) - plus prayer at mealtimes and before bed - daily rosary during lent - participation in the parish - and parents who truly believed and practiced that belief.

I agree that too many “outside influences” have crept into the Schools and I suspect it started when public funds started to become available…over time there are always strings attached to such things. Then there was the reduction and eventual elimination of religious as teachers.

We could go on - - and many threads have…

Peace
James
 
madtom said:
I see a lot (in this thread and many others) the idea that many people had poor Catechesis, which led them to stray from the Church or not really be close to Jesus or their faith. I’ve thought a lot about this because I often wonder why I was so NOT Catholic after 17 years of Catholic schooling, and yet my children seem to be closer to their faith (for under-10-year-olds anyway), meanwhle they attend public school. I have come to the conclusion that Catholic schools are counterproductive. Religion just becomes another subject along with math and science, and in most cases ends up being nothing more than a history class. Also, because schools are built around rules, structure, and discipline, too many Catholic grow up just viewing the Church as this rigid organization telling them what they can and can’t do. How many stories do we have of being hit by nuns? It just becomes an organization of rules, as some have pointed out here. Also, Catholic schools are filled with non-Catholics and other bad influences. You have many students who attend just because their parents want them to have a better education, but they may be Jewish, Protestant, Budhist, Atheist, etc. Many of the kids come from Catholic households, but are not practicing Catholics in the least. In all honesty, it’s a VERY poor environment in which to understand and grow your faith. On the other hand, CCD class, which my children attend, is completely separate from school, and is not just a subject. It takes place in the church. They are with other kids, all of whom are Catholic, and all of whom are there for one reason and one reason only - to learn about God. Their religous education doesn’t get lost in the shuffle of daily school life.

I’ll even give one very specific example. As a senior in high school, a prestigous NYC Catholic high school, I had to present a paper on a controversial political subject and I chose abortion. My paper, naturally, presented a pro-life stance and I used both religous/moral and legal arguments. To my absolute shock, I found most of my fellow students to be combative, and ardently pro-choice. I handled myself just fine because I was confident in my position, but it was not a very supportive environment for a teenager trying to figure out his own spirituality. By the way, most of those combative, pro-choice students were “Catholic.”
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I wouldn’t necessarily frame the dearth of catechesis as CCD > Catholic schools. My wife went to public school (and thus CCD) and she had a similar experience around the abortion issue with the kids in her CCD class where she found herself as being pretty much the only voice that thought it was wrong. And that includes the teacher. Also, since it wasn’t a subject in school, my wife took it much less seriously. Why bother with homework or studying outside of class if you’re not even getting a grade? And there are plenty of kids in CCD at present who are only there because their parents (or, increasingly often, their grandparents) are making them go.

Not to denigrate CCD. I’m just illustrating that there have been shortcomings in every approach to catechesis.

There are lots of reasons we are where we are. The important thing for all of us now is to be part of the solution and to fervently seek to introduce others to Christ.
 
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