Marital debt duty to have sex

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FCS said:
It is possible for anyone (male or female, married or not) to stay chaste with God’s help…nobody NEEDS sex
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I believe you mean it is possible to live ones station in life without committing personal mortal sin.
Which is different from never engaging in masturbation, killing, adultery, drinking or eating to excess, stealing, being a traditore etc etc.

I have not infrequently met some males who clearly “need sex” by the usual meaning of that phrase. They live wretched lives without. Just like alcoholics. Whether they are able to change or not I do not pretend to know, just as I do not for long term alcoholics.
 
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Being addicted to sex is real. Being addicted to porn is real. I was addicted to masturbation and pornographic images for 8 years, I know how painful it is and I know how hard it was to quit. Saying the addiction is fine and sex is the answer is wrong (not saying you are saying this, but multiple posts from others clearly have)
 
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My experience is that sex can be the answer for some as I explained above. But its not about the issues you speak of.
 
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Sex heals some wounds I believe but doesn’t heal wounds like those. It would only exacerbate them. I think it’s best (IMO) if couples know if each other have struggled with porn or impurity just because then each other can help each other in the struggles. But that’s just my view, everyone is entitled to their own view on that
 
My own struggles over similar issues has led me to discover different resolutions and therefore contrary insights than yourself.
I think what is clear is that such issues are varied and it is dangerous to conclude that just because struggles over purity look the same that they are the same. Therefore the analysis that works for one cannot be be applied universally to all. Therefore the resolution advice that works for one type of struggle cannot be extrapolated to work for all. Aetiologies are clearly different. Human beings are complex in the area of sexuality and a one size fits all approach, in my experience, simply doesnt work.
 
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GospelOfMatthew said:
Imagine saying to a future kid, “hey we conceived you because I wanted to masturbate so bad and decided sex was the answer to my lustful need to release.” Honestly that’s so wrong
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All children from a loving marriage are loved even when they are unintended accidents or one partner was not in the mood at the actual time but freely sacrificed him or her self to “relieve” the concupiscence of the other. I have no problem with that. What parents would discuss such things with their children!

You reminded me that my father used to joke I had the same red hair as the early morning milkman (dad worked nightshift).
 
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Yes of course the children are loved just as much and they wouldn’t say that to their children. But still, procreation and sex resemble Christ’s love for the Church. Why make it all “lusty” for lack of a better word? The issue is that sex isn’t a solution to (name removed by moderator)urity and infidelity. Prayer, conversion, and counciling are
 
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GospelOfMatthew said:
The issue is that sex isn’t a solution to (name removed by moderator)urity and infidelity. Prayer, conversion, and counciling are
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Well we have different life experiences then and must agree to disagree.

I think you too quickly confuse concupiscence and lust in marriage (more often a Protestant tendancy). Strictly speaking the Catholic Church teaches concupiscence is not itself impurity.

Which is why she teaches marriage can be acceptably understood as a remedy for concupiscence (but not for lust). Obviously it should be much more than that and it is an imperfection…but not always sin.

Marriage can be a solution for healing sexual compulsion, though not all types.

It is better to marry than burn is inspired and means something afterall.
God bless.
 
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The words are unfortunate but in the end its the same as “being faithful to ones promise”.
However if one has to be constantly “asked” to keep ones promise then something seems to be amiss on both sides.
 
QwertyGirl said:
I really don’t believe there is anything in the Catholic marriage vows about this. Maybe I take things too literally, but if it isn’t specifically in the vows then I don’t think it exists. Very specific things are promised in the vows, and some broader things are, too. This seems like a very specific thing that isn’t included.
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I suppose the “marital debt” (which I think is better put as “a freely given marital promise”) is intrinsic to the marriage vows of a Christian. It is found in the NT:
1 Corinthians 6:2-4
The husband should fulfill his marital duty to his wife, and likewise the wife to her husband. The wife does not have authority over her own body but yields it to her husband. In the same way, the husband does not have authority over his own body but yields it to his wife.
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I think that’s a fundamentally wrong analogy to use for a healthy sexuality between spouses.
 
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FCS said:
It is possible for anyone (male or female, married or not) to stay chaste with God’s help…nobody NEEDS sex
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Chastity in marriage INCLUDES sexual intercourse.

If you mean abstinent, then while it is possible, for most married people it is not desirable. Desire for your spouse is a natural part of marriage. Repeated rejection by your spouse for that which is a natural end of marriage can be damaging to the rejected spouse. It can disorder the natural desire one spouse has for the other.
 
BoomBoomMancini said:
I think that’s a fundamentally wrong analogy to use for a healthy sexuality between spouses.
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I agree, that when one spouse falls flat on their obligations, it does not contribute to a healthy sexuality between spouses. However, that does not take away from the obligations that spouses have sexually to one another. When the sexual relationship between spouses goes into the ditch, it is probably impossible to get out of that ditch without some serious sacrifice on the part of both parties. Too often in marriage one party (an it is increasingly more the man) will basically tell the other party “you get nothing, take it or leave it”. These people do need to be reminded of the fact that by getting married, that is not a moral alternative they have.
 
I honestly think that this idea of the marital debt is seen as so old-fashioned, that it is a bit shocking to people like the OP. I think it was more commonly thought of in these terms before women’s lib, feminist movement, etc. I think this is why it used to be so much more popular for women to go into convents, it was either that or get married and basically expect to have 8, 9, 10 children (assuming you were Catholic and not using ABC ever).
 
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I agree that the spouses are sexually obligated to each other, but I don’t think that means you are obligated to have sex on any particular night. It’s not like a financial debt where someone can legitimately stay, “I don’t care if you don’t want to pay right now, i insist.”
 
I agree that one does not necessarily have an obligation to have sex on a particular night if there is a good reason for abstaining. The Church teaches as much.
 
Right. What we always come back to is the question “does ‘I don’t feel like it right now’” qualify?”

I say it does, provided the spouse doesn’t “not feel like it” for a prolonged period.
 
The reality is that there is a huge difference in the levels of libido for men and women. So, guess what, it’s not “one night” here and there where the woman probably doesn’t want to, and the man probably does. I think this is an issue for a high percentage of married couples, I bet.
 
GospelOfMatthew said:
Holiness is no place to be reached. It is not a destination that X amount of prayers will let us enter. Holiness is a lifestyle.
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Be perfect as your Heavenly Father is perfect.

Holiness is perfection. We all fall short of it. We will not enter Heaven until we have been made perfect.
 
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