Marital debt duty to have sex

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Lea101 said:
A simple definition of ‘disturb’ can mean interfering with a normal arrangement/routine or interrupting someone.
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Yes, and that is the way I meant the use of that word in my post. Thank you.
 
Few married couples understand what marriage is, what rights are exchanged and what debts are created.

When we marry, we give our spouses certain rights over our bodies, the husband to the wife and the wife to the husband.

But rights are always connected to duties or obligations. In the case of a spouse who requests marital intimacy with the other, a moral obligation on the part of the other is created.

It is perfectly just because public consent before a priest and two (or more) witnesses was given during the wedding ceremony.
 
She made public vows, giving her husband certain rights over her body. That’s what natural marriage is.
 
No, the marital debt is what is created by the marriage vows. It is part of the natural law, and so pertains to all valid marriages between a man and a woman. To exclude it is to have a different kind of contract. Call it what you like, it isn’t marriage.
 
This is close to unbelievable, and it got 4 likes.
Oh well, I will answer, a fun wife. You people actually see something wrong with the scenario of completely surprising your spouse with a proposition of sex when they least expect it.
 
tafan2 said:
This is close to unbelievable, and it got 4 likes.
Oh well, I will answer, a fun wife. You people actually see something wrong with the scenario of completely surprising your spouse with a proposition of sex when they least expect it.
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I think what @QWERTYGirl is saying is that, whether you intend it or not, what you are implying is that it’s perfectly fine to expect your spouse to drop everything and have sex with you at the exact moment you want them to and whatever else they’re doing automatically takes a backseat to your desire to have sex at that moment. The reality is, sex can wait until after the football game, or after the exciting chapter of the book has been read. If you love your spouse, you will allow them to finish the activity they are enjoying rather than demand that they stop and fulfill your own sexual need.

Once again, that may not be what you are trying to convey, but it’s a way to interpret it.
 
I have been very clear about what I am saying, if I refuse my wife for a trivial reason, I am sinning. Somehow that turned into, my wife sinning for simply requesting sex at a convienuent time and then qwertgirl actually saying there is something wrong with a wife (or husband) who would interrupt anything at all with the idea of having sex. It’s somehow wrong to surprise your spouse with such a request.
Yes, the first part I used to be surprised people disagreed. The second part actually makes me feel sorry for these couple’s.
That is a just of the conversation.
 
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tafan2 said:
qwertgirl actually saying there is something wrong with a wife (or husband) who interrupt anything at all with the idea of having sex.
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That’s what I’m trying to clarify. I think what she means is not that it’s wrong for a spouse to suggest the idea of sex at any particular time, but rather that it would be wrong to expect your spouse to drop everything and have sex at that very moment when it can wait (i.e until after the football game or book reading).
 
Ryan1 said:
She made public vows, giving her husband certain rights over her body. That’s what natural marriage is.
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Please tell me where this is said in the vows. I have been to many Catholic weddings and I have never heard this , or anything even close to it, spoken during the vows exchange.
 
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Asking your spouse to drop everything you are doing for sex is sinful, because they are not at your beck and whim. Marriage isn’t slavery. This would be asking for sex out of lust in theory, because the requester has no love for what their spouse may currently be enjoying, assuming their urges are the priority all the time. How is this in line with Matthew 5:28?
 
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GospelOfMatthew said:
And apparently saying this is sinful? According to some on this thread
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Are you saying that the Church teaches that it is morally acceptable to refuse your spouse sex for any reason whatsoever? If so, please cite some Church teaching. Your opinion on the matter is not very helpful, because that is all it is, your opinion.
 
tafan2 said:
and then qwertgirl actually saying there is something wrong with a wife (or husband) who would interrupt anything at all with the idea of having sex. It’s somehow wrong to surprise your spouse with such a request.
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Please don’t put words in my mouth. I said nothing of the kind. My post is about respecting that your spouse may have interests other than dropping and having sex with you whenever you propose.

You seem to think that sex-on-demand with a spouse leads to a happy, healthy marriage. If that works for you in your marriage, more power to you. However, you make a mistake if you think that is the way all happy and healthy marriages work.

Letting your spouse know you desire them in always a good thing, by the way. I am not suggesting otherwise. Expecting them to drop whenever you ask (or putting that requirement on yourself when you are asked) seems ridiculous to most.

As a final note, there is nothing in the Catholic wedding vows that even implies this is promised by one spouse to the other. There is a whole lot of personal interpretation that has gone on in this thread.
 
No one seems to take into account that having sex can have very serious consequences for women while for men, sex is risk-free.
Let’s face it: if conception happens, the woman is the only person who has to deal with it and she has to do it alone. She is the one who has to carry it for the next nine months and she is the one who has to somehow get it out of her body, most likely in a very painful way. She is the one who has to carry all the risks and suffer from all possible injuries for the rest of her life.
And usually it’s the mother who has to take responsibility for the baby and stay at home for months or even a year which can damage her career. Men don’t have this problem, usually dads continue working as if they never had any children at all and are unwilling to make any career-related sacrifices.
So, sex is a game where men always win and women always lose.

//edit: In other words, if a husband requests sex from his wife, he’s asking her to do something that can be very harmful for her. But if a wife requests sex from her husband, it’s obviously a very different thing because having sex is safe for men.
 
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chasingcars said:
sex is risk-free.
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I get where you’re coming from, but a husband would experience the pressure of proving for one more person in the family. Assuming that he’s a decent guy, he would feel anxiety and concern for what his wife is going true, especially if she is facing complications. Of course it’s not the ‘same’ because women do experience a lot more regarding pregnancies.
chasingcars said:
Let’s face it: if conception happens, the woman is the only person who has to deal with it and she has to do it alone. She is the one who has to carry it for the next nine months and she is the one who has to somehow get it out of her body, most likely in a very painful way. She is the one who has to carry all the risks and suffer from all possible injuries for the rest of her life.
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Yup, that’s the curse of being a woman 😞 even women have the ‘burden’ of carrying out NFP lol.
chasingcars said:
And usually it’s the mother who has to take responsibility for the baby and stay at home for months or even a year which can damage her career. Men don’t have this problem, usually dads continue working as if they never had any children at all and are unwilling to make any career-related sacrifices.
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While I know of many dads who think spending 2 hours a day with their kid makes them a good dad, a lot of fathers do actually want to spend more time with their children. If you marry, this is something you need to look out for when dating.
chasingcars said:
So, sex is a game where men always win and women always lose.
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But no. Men do not always win. Poor families exist and there are plenty of suffering fathers out there.
 
You are putting words in my mouth. I have made a simple statement. Nothing about sex on demand ( denied that BTW )

I responded directly to your “what kind of wife” comment. It was very clear.
 
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BTW, I also said that it’s always ok to respond, honey how about later? That wasn’t well received by you guys either.
 
Because you followed up with the example of the husband saying yes and then coming back to ask her again. You said that after that, she shouldn’t refuse (or rather, refusing would be a sin) since her request to postpone was denied.
 
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