Marriage and abstinence

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Gems

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Hello everyone,

I am brand new here and must apologise for wading in with a huge issue as my very first post, but I would be very grateful for any advice on an issue as it has been weighing heavily on my mind and I’m finding it difficult to think straight about it. I feel I need to talk about it to more knowledgeable Catholics, I hope that’s OK. (And I also hope I’ve put this in the right section of the forum!)

I have a big problem with the physical side of my marriage. My husband and I have been married 2 and a half years now and in short, we have never had sex. When we decided to get married we did discuss the fact that children should be a central part of the marriage. However, a couple of weeks before the wedding, my husband asked if we could talk about it and said he didn’t think we should have a baby yet, for financial reasons. I had been under the impression we would pursue NFP, but it was a mess of crossed wires and we eventually determined it had to be ABC (not an option) or abstinence. And we couldn’t postpone the wedding.

2 and a half years down the line and we have barely even discussed the issue - it is the elephant in the room. I must admit that I have been sceptical about NFP in the past but now, the more I read, the more convinced I am. I would be willing to pursue it but I’m afraid my husband sees it as Russian roulette (although he is a Catholic too). I am not sure how to broach the subject again. I don’t even know where to start - would appropriate resources be the best way to go about it and if so, can anyone recommend where to find the best ones? He is very financially astute and I just think he would panic if I were to get pregnant - we aren’t in a great position financially, but I think we would manage.
Perhaps worse still, we have been using mutual masturbation, which I have just found out is a mortal sin. I feel terrible, although I admit ignorance as I thought that (effectively) “anything goes” in the marital bed. Is it a “lesser” sin because of the lack of knowledge?

(Just as an aside: we have just moved to a new town. As we were walking back from Mass last week we passed a building with a prominent sign saying “NATURAL FAMILY PLANNING CLINIC” on the side. Without wanting to stray into cliche territory, it almost felt like a sign to me. Geographically, it would just be so easy to go in and talk to them about it…I just feel at a loss as to where to start.)

Thanks for reading and I am very sorry if I haven’t explained anything well enough or if it seems melodramatic - I know it is small beer compared to the problems some people have. I just feel it’s a real moral obstacle for both of us and I need somewhere to talk about it.
 
This might be a good conversation to have with the priest that married you, but this forum should give you a good idea!

Personally I can only handle part of your query:

According to the Catechism of the Catholic Church (CCC 1860):
Unintentional ignorance can diminish or even remove the imputability of a grave offense …]
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You should mention it in your next confession, but your description seems to point to, at worst, a venial sin.

Good luck, and remember that God will provide! Trust in Him Who will give you your daily bread. 🙂
 
Not having properly consummated your marriage in this circumstance goes against your wedding promise of lovingly accepting children from God. And yes, the issue is compounded by substituting this act with a disordered one.

Please seek the counsel of a priest in this matter. Your marriage needs spiritual direction in addition to absolution. At the very least read up on some stuff by Christopher West. Google him and go to his website. Personally, his Good News… book and Heaven’s Song are great.

Best advice I ever got after getting married 17 years ago: don’t wait until you’re “ready” to have children. Just have them and trust in God to provide. Five kids later, during some tough times, we are great. God is good and He provides.
 
prstoessel said:
Not having properly consummated your marriage in this circumstance goes against your wedding promise of lovingly accepting children from God. And yes, the issue is compounded by substituting this act with a disordered one.

Please seek the counsel of a priest in this matter. Your marriage needs spiritual direction in addition to absolution. At the very least read up on some stuff by Christopher West. Google him and go to his website. Personally, his Good News… book and Heaven’s Song are great.

Best advice I ever got after getting married 17 years ago: don’t wait until you’re “ready” to have children. Just have them and trust in God to provide. Five kids later, during some tough times, we are great. God is good and He provides.
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👍

I agree.

I do think so natural family planning is in order - you should plan to have children naturally. 🙂

But on the whole, yes, talk to a priest, someone real, and not us creepsters on the internet.

Priests are very loving and understanding in general (the ones I have known - there are known to be crotchety ones out there too) and I’m sure that there is a good one who will discuss your issue, which you have every right to be concerned about, and help you and your husband.
 
I don’t think you are being melodramatic in the least. It’s a very real problem.

I think the best thing for you to do is learn everything you can about NFP. I would recommend Taking Charge of Your Fertility by Toni Weschler- it is not from a Catholic perspective, so you’ll have to weed out some things, but it is excellent for an overall understanding of fertility. Others on here can probably suggest other, more Catholic sources in addition. If you do this, you can start charting yourself.

Having a better understanding will help you, but it would be even better if your husband would agree to at least learn with you. It’s actually not as easy as people think to get pregnant. It sounds like he is very ignorant of the entire process.

As someone else pointed out, not consummating your marriage means you are not living your vows. It’s very concerning that you’re married and are afraid to even approach the subject of children with your husband, and it has been this long. I think you really need to bring it up with him, even if it is uncomfortable.

How long does your husband plan on living like this? At what point do you have “enough” money? Is he perhaps wary of children because he’s never been around them?

I think it’s time to say “enough is enough”. And it’s pretty clear that he’s not going to be the one to do it. Do you have conversations with him about other serious issues, or is it just this that you’ve been avoiding?
 
Gems said:
Hello 2 and a half years down the line and we have barely even discussed the issue - it is the elephant in the room. I it.
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this sounds like the real root of the problem, the failure to communicate, because there has been no basis for true intimacy in your relationship. That is where you should focus your efforts to heal your marriage. It is not about sex or the lack of it, that is the symptom.
 
I won’t be as much help on the theology part, there are many more well versed members than I. But I can say, as far as NFP, it DOES work, IF, IF, IF, you understand it, do it correctly and both parties are on board. I did NFP for 4 years and had 2 children when we intended. It does take a bit of understanding and paying attention to your body, but it is not the rhythm method. I did the sympto-thermal method and it worked beautifully.

As far as the issue of actually discussing it with your husband, the time is long overdue, this needs to be addressed, with the help of a priest possibly.

I will pray for you.🙂
 
Gems said:
I have a big problem with the physical side of my marriage. My husband and I have been married 2 and a half years now and in short, we have never had sex. When we decided to get married we did discuss the fact that children should be a central part of the marriage. However, a couple of weeks before the wedding, my husband asked if we could talk about it and said he didn’t think we should have a baby yet, for financial reasons. I had been under the impression we would pursue NFP, but it was a mess of crossed wires and we eventually determined it had to be ABC (not an option) or abstinence. And we couldn’t postpone the wedding.

2 and a half years down the line and we have barely even discussed the issue - it is the elephant in the room. I must admit that I have been sceptical about NFP in the past but now, the more I read, the more convinced I am. I would be willing to pursue it but I’m afraid my husband sees it as Russian roulette (although he is a Catholic too). I am not sure how to broach the subject again. I don’t even know where to start - would appropriate resources be the best way to go about it and if so, can anyone recommend where to find the best ones? He is very financially astute and I just think he would panic if I were to get pregnant - we aren’t in a great position financially, but I think we would manage.
Perhaps worse still, we have been using mutual masturbation, which I have just found out is a mortal sin. I feel terrible, although I admit ignorance as I thought that (effectively) “anything goes” in the marital bed. Is it a “lesser” sin because of the lack of knowledge?
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Welcome to the forum. Great people here and good information. Mostly 🙂

I work on an RCIA team and I can tell you from the church teaching, your marriage is not valid if you have not consumated it with the marital act. Your marriage is not valid if you are not open to life, children.

Communication is necessary, and it sounds like your husband is holding back from you. Marriage is about a total gift of self to the other and helping your spouse attain heaven. Can you approach the subject from that point of view with your husband? He is not giving all of himself to you. It is much more than lacking sex. You are lacking intimacy.

I will pray for you. God Bless
 
Thank you so much for all your replies in such a short time - it’s very much appreciated.

I know that everything you’re saying is true although it’s hard to read. I think we’ve been justifying it to ourselves by thinking that in some way, because we’re not using artificial contraception, it’s somehow a lesser evil.

I think I might have portrayed my husband a little badly and I’m sorry if I did - we do love each other very much and the odd thing is that we do talk about everything else very honestly. Somehow this issue, though, has just been avoided. Honestly, I think he’s afraid of the unknown when it comes to children. He has issues with anxiety in general and I don’t think he would feel 100% secure unless he knew that we would be consistently financially solvent. But of course, it’s impossible to say that we will, there will always be obstacles and all we can do is put ourselves in the hands of God. I just worry that if I can’t convince him that not having certain knowledge is OK, we won’t ever have children. 😦

Your replies have really made me wake up to the fact that we don’t have that special intimacy, and I am just as guilty of not giving myself completely to him. I think we have to start being completely honest with ourselves about what the Church teaches and start talking about it before things get worse. Thank you also for your reassurances and recommendations concerning NFP. I feel that if I do more research (and have him join in), the knowledge about how it works will compensate for his fears of the unknown somehow.

Thank you so much again for your help and prayers. I feel more certain about what needs to be done now. I hope I can return the favour at some point!
 
None of us here know all the details regarding your marriage and really you should confine such details to a conversation with your priest.

However, as a general remark, a marriage that has not been consummated is valid but not ratified. It can be dissolved.
 
thistle said:
However, as a general remark, a marriage that has not been consummated is valid but not ratified. It can be dissolved.
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Thank you for that point of clarification, valid but not ratified. The form and matter of the sacrament were present, from the information given.

I am always learning something new on this forum.
 
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