Marriage Annulment problem

[God_Seeker_1]

Hello everyone,

I have a quick question. I was married a long time ago. We got married and then we got baptized in a Baptist church. I was baptized and raised Catholic. A few years later we got divorced and now I have no contact with her. I got remarried in the state a couple of years ago, and now my wife and I wish to become Catholic, how would I go about doing an annulment if I cannot contact my former wife?

Erick Ybarra

 

[CatholicRaven]

Speak to your priest. This is a problem to be handled through the Tribunal, and I seriously doubt that they have never dealt with this situation before.

God bless!

 

[Trishie]

Welcome to CAF, Erick.

Have you spoken to a priest yet?

May God bless you both
Kind wishes,
Trishie

 

[God_Seeker_1]

Yes I did speak to a priest. I told him I was previously married in a Baptist church. I made it clear she was also baptized into the Baptist church. And once I told him she was baptized he said that it was a valid sacramental marriage, and therefore requires an annulment.

 

[Trishie]

Did you explain to the priest that you were raised and baptized Catholic?
That does raise a question as to the validity of your first marriage.
For Catholic to marry outside the Church without dispensation does mean that the first marriage may be invalid.

 

[1ke]

Yes I did speak to a priest. I told him I was previously married in a Baptist church. I made it clear she was also baptized into the Baptist church. And once I told him she was baptized he said that it was a valid sacramental marriage, and therefore requires an annulment.

You need to make an appointment with the priest and explain ALL the facts.

I am confused because you say you want to become Catholic, but you also state that you were baptized Catholic. That means you are a Catholic. And that is a VERY important detail.

Contact your parish of baptism and request a copy of your sacramental records be sent to you or to your priest.

 

[Trishie]

From the Catholic Code of Canon Law:
Can. 1086 §1. “A marriage between two persons, one of whom has been baptized in the Catholic Church or received into it and has not defected from it by a formal act and the other of whom is not baptized, is invalid.”

can. 1124 of the Code of Canon Law :

“Marriage between two baptized persons, one of whom was baptized in the Catholic Church or received into it after baptism, and the other a member of a Church or ecclesial community not in full communion with the Catholic Church, cannot be celebrated without the express permission of the competent authority”.

In late August 2010, the Holy See confirmed that it was no longer possible to defect formally from the Catholic Church. ’

dublindiocese.ie/content/121010-statement-formal-defections

 

[dcrowmik]

how would I go about doing an annulment if I cannot contact my former wife?

Erick Ybarra

The annulment process can still proceed (and even be completed) even if the other spouse cannot be located or refuses to participate. You simply have to start the process and that usually means talking to your parish priest to start the paperwork that your diocese would require.

 

[runningdude]

Yes I did speak to a priest. I told him I was previously married in a Baptist church. I made it clear she was also baptized into the Baptist church. And once I told him she was baptized he said that it was a valid sacramental marriage, and therefore requires an annulment.

It sounds to me that the priest either did not understand that you were already baptized as a Catholic, or he simply meant that the formality of the annulment procedure must be followed.

Being baptized as a Catholic would require you to be married according to Catholic rules. As such a marriage in a Baptist church would be invalid and easily declared null.

A possible complication may be if you made a formal act of defection*, which up until 2009 would allow you to marry outside the church. The marriage tribunal must investigate to rule out such possibilities. Assuming you haven’t made such a statement to your bishop, it should be a straight forward process.

*Writing to the bishop, stating your intent to leave the church.

 

[elizaveta01]

The best thing to do is make an appointment to speak with someone at the local tribunal office. They have the experience and expertise to answer all your question.

I was told a number of years ago by a priest, who sat on the marriage tribunal, that, unfortunately, your average parish priest isn’t really able to help much with annulments since the laws are very complicated.

 

[hsmomforlife]

The best thing to do is make an appointment to speak with someone at the local tribunal office. They have the experience and expertise to answer all your question.

I was told a number of years ago by a priest, who sat on the marriage tribunal, that, unfortunately, your average parish priest isn’t really able to help much with annulments since the laws are very complicated.

It’s sort of like going to a family doctor when you have cancer…he has the knowledge and experience to say that you need treatment (probably to include either radiation and/or chemo) but he doesn’t have the experience or training to know all of the nuances of your particular form of the ‘disease’ which you have to be able to give you an exact, and effective treatment plan.
You need a Church lawyer (tribunal) and while some parish priests may help and guide, the decision about the Church’s laws should be left to the ‘Church’s Lawyers’ in the tribunal.
I’m not an expert, but I’m going through this and explaining to DH as we go!

 

[quiet52]

I have a quick question. I was married a long time ago. We got married and then we got baptized in a Baptist church. I was baptized and raised Catholic. A few years later we got divorced and now I have no contact with her. I got remarried in the state a couple of years ago, and now my wife and I wish to become Catholic, how would I go about doing an annulment if I cannot contact my former wife?

Were you and your first wife married in the Catholic Church?

• If not, and if you didn’t first receive permission (called a “dispensation”) from the bishop to marry outside of the Catholic Church, then your first marriage was not valid. You would need to petition for a declaration that the marriage was not binding due to a Lack of Canonical of Form. Catholics are required to marry in the Catholic Church. If this is the case, then you need to submit the lack of form petition with documentation showing where you were married and who officiated at the wedding ceremony, the divorce papers, your baptismal record (which you can easily obtain from the Catholic parish where you were baptized), and possibly a witness statement. The process, which is begun in the parish but which is judged and completed by the diocesan Tribunal, is relatively quick.

A possible complicating factor in your case might be if you formally rejected your Catholic faith before you married your first wife. You would need to discuss this more fully with your pastor.

• If you did marry in the Catholic Church, then the process will be more complicated and lengthier. You would petition for a decree of nullity based on defect of consent. You need to provide evidence that at the time you married, one or both of you lacked full consent to the marriage. Your pastor, or his designate, will help you to explore the possible grounds for lack of consent. The process is much longer than a petitioning for lack of form, and there is no guarantee that the Tribunal will grant your nullity.

You need to make every effort to find your ex-wife’s location. You can try to contact her relatives, your former friends and neighbors. Some dioceses (maybe all of them) might assist by providing a detective service, at an extra charge to you. She has a right to respond to your petition, although the process can proceed without the Respondent’s cooperation or participation.

You are not required to contact your ex-wife. The Tribunal does that. They won’t proceed with the process unless you have proved you’ve made reasonable efforts to track down her current location.

Yes I did speak to a priest. I told him I was previously married in a Baptist church. I made it clear she was also baptized into the Baptist church. And once I told him she was baptized he said that it was a valid sacramental marriage, and therefore requires an annulment.

In your first post you wrote that you were baptized and raised Catholic – do you realize that no one can be baptized twice? Did you tell your priest you were baptized in and raised in the Catholic faith?

Sorry to repeat info, I just now read the other posts in this thread.

 

[CatholicRaven]

The annulment process can still proceed (and even be completed) even if the other spouse cannot be located or refuses to participate. You simply have to start the process and that usually means talking to your parish priest to start the paperwork that your diocese would require.

This is what I was getting at. Thank you for explaining it better than I did.

 

[God_Seeker_1]

Were you and your first wife married in the Catholic Church?

• If not, and if you didn’t first receive permission (called a “dispensation”) from the bishop to marry outside of the Catholic Church, then your first marriage was not valid. You would need to petition for a declaration that the marriage was not binding due to a Lack of Canonical of Form. Catholics are required to marry in the Catholic Church. If this is the case, then you need to submit the lack of form petition with documentation showing where you were married and who officiated at the wedding ceremony, the divorce papers, your baptismal record (which you can easily obtain from the Catholic parish where you were baptized), and possibly a witness statement. The process, which is begun in the parish but which is judged and completed by the diocesan Tribunal, is relatively quick.

A possible complicating factor in your case might be if you formally rejected your Catholic faith before you married your first wife. You would need to discuss this more fully with your pastor.

• If you did marry in the Catholic Church, then the process will be more complicated and lengthier. You would petition for a decree of nullity based on defect of consent. You need to provide evidence that at the time you married, one or both of you lacked full consent to the marriage. Your pastor, or his designate, will help you to explore the possible grounds for lack of consent. The process is much longer than a petitioning for lack of form, and there is no guarantee that the Tribunal will grant your nullity.

You need to make every effort to find your ex-wife’s location. You can try to contact her relatives, your former friends and neighbors. Some dioceses (maybe all of them) might assist by providing a detective service, at an extra charge to you. She has a right to respond to your petition, although the process can proceed without the Respondent’s cooperation or participation.

You are not required to contact your ex-wife. The Tribunal does that. They won’t proceed with the process unless you have proved you’ve made reasonable efforts to track down her current location.

In your first post you wrote that you were baptized and raised Catholic – do you realize that no one can be baptized twice? Did you tell your priest you were baptized in and raised in the Catholic faith?

Sorry to repeat info, I just now read the other posts in this thread.

Hi!

I should explain a bit more.

I was born, baptized, and raised Catholic. However, I was raised in one of the “nominal” catholic houses where spirituality is not important at all. In fact, I only go to Holy Communion, and after that I did not receive confirmation. When I hit 18 years old and went to college, I had a radical conversion experience into a baptist church. I brought my girlfriend at the time (who was not raised catholic, but that doesn’t mean she was not baptized as an infant as a catholic. I no longer have communication with her but as far as I know she could have been infant baptized and I just never knew since she grew up in a very cuban catholic area in miami, FL) and both myself and my girlfriend had a radical conversion experience into a baptist church.

Now we got married by a baptist minister before our baptism (I got baptized a 2nd time by water as an adult, which I know is not valid). We got baptized like 6 months after our wedding.

Then 5 years later in September or November of 2009, we got divorced.

Then in 2012 I got re-married by a pentecostal minister.

My current wife was baptized as an adult in the pentecostal church. But now we both wish to become catholic.

 

[TheWarriorMonk]

I was born, baptized, and raised Catholic.

The fact that you were baptized in a Catholic Church is all that matters. You are Catholic…period. You cannot “become Catholic” because you are already Catholic.

A Catholic (which you are) marrying outside of a Catholic Church requires permission (dispensation), which it appears you do not have. As a result, your marriages are considered invalid. This is referred to as a “lack of form” case, and is simple and straightforward.

My current wife was baptized as an adult in the pentecostal church. But now we both wish to become catholic.

As noted earlier you are already Catholic. In order to convalidate your currently invalid marriage, you will both need to demonstrate that you are free to marry. That should be straightforward provided your current wife has not been previously married.

 

[God_Seeker_1]

TheWarriorMonk,

Yes I understand that. I was just concerned about my previous marriage. My priest said because she was baptized it was a sacrament.

 

[TheWarriorMonk]

TheWarriorMonk,

Yes I understand that. I was just concerned about my previous marriage. My priest said because she was baptized it was a sacrament.

The only way that is possible is if you were married in Catholic form. At a bare minimum, that means you had to be married in a Catholic Church, or a non-Catholic Church with the appropriate dispensation from the Bishop (along with all of the other requirements: demonstrate freedom to marry, attend pre-Cana or equivalent, etc.). If you did neither of these, then your prior marriage is invalid. Describing the prior attempt at marriage as sacramental is nonsensical, since no marriage nor sacrament occurred.

 

[1ke]

TheWarriorMonk,

Yes I understand that. I was just concerned about my previous marriage. My priest said because she was baptized it was a sacrament.

if you represented yourself as a Baptist wanting to convert to Catholicism, then your priest would have been giving you an accurate answer based on the facts as he knew them.

You must set an appointment and give him all the facts including your baptismal status in the Catholic Church, with documentation.

 

[Cojuanco]

Hello everyone,

I have a quick question. I was married a long time ago. We got married and then we got baptized in a Baptist church. I was baptized and raised Catholic. A few years later we got divorced and now I have no contact with her. I got remarried in the state a couple of years ago, and now my wife and I wish to become Catholic, how would I go about doing an annulment if I cannot contact my former wife?

Erick Ybarra

See your priest, but if you mean you were married in a Baptist ceremony without dispensation from the bishop, it’s a routing lack-of-form case.

 

[quiet52]

See your priest, but if you mean you were married in a Baptist ceremony without dispensation from the bishop, it’s a routing lack-of-form case.

It looks like your next steps would be to:

• Write or phone your Catholic parish of baptism, and ask that your sacramental records be sent to you. Many parishes charge a small fee for this, like $10 (to prove that you are Catholic)
• Obtain a certified copy of your marriage license or other documentation which shows when/where you married, and by whom* (to prove you were not married in the Catholic Church).*
• Obtain your divorce papers (to prove you’re not planning to engage in bigamy).
• Meet with your pastor to begin the lack of form process – bring a check (the fee is usually $25 or so). Depending on the diocese, he may require a witness statement.
• The diocese might still require that you make every concerted effort to find your ex-wife’s address. She has a right to know. Who knows, maybe she’s in the same boat as you, if she re-married and wants to return to the Catholic faith! Anyway, discuss this with your pastor, and if he isn’t sure, ask him if he wants to phone the diocesan Tribunal office, or if he wants you to.

So because you are Catholic, you could participate with your current wife in the RCIA catechetical sessions, but you would not be in RCIA. You would be preparing for the sacrament of Confirmation, and of course for the convalidation of your marriage, which would include the Rite of Marriage. You should fully understand the sacrament of Reconciliation (Confession) before returning to that sacrament.

Enjoy the journey!