Marriage annulments

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manudewan

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When Jesus says in Matt19:6. “So they are no longer two,but one in flesh. Therefore what God has joined together let no man separate”…Why then does the tribunal of an annulment procdure have the right to determine which marriages are valid and which ones are not?
 
A Roman Catholic Tribunal dissolves no marriage. It merely makes a judgment on whether a marriage is valid. Surely, you do not believe everyone who attempts marriage does do validly in the eyes of God and His Church. The authority for governance of the Holy Sacraments was granted by Christ to His Holy Church. We see Jesus, himself, and Saint Paul exercising such authority regarding matrimony in the New Testament.
 
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You are correct that a valid Christian marriage cannot be dissolved. The Church has always had the authority to determine the validity of putative marriages.
 
It’s not that a tribunal dissolves a marriage, but that it declares that it never existed, due to extenuating circumstances.
 
As stated above, the Marriage Tribunal doesn’t dissolve marriages.

For a marriage to be valid, certain conditions have to be in place. If the couple, later on down the road, discovers that one of these conditions might not have been in place, and thus the marriage was never valid.

If they think they have a case for the fact that their marriage wasn’t valid, they can present it to the Church (Marriage Tribunal), and it determines if the initial conditions weren’t or were present. If they find that there were certain conditions that weren’t present at the time of the marriage, they conclude that the marriage wasn’t valid and never happened before.

So they don’t dissolve anything, they just recognize the fact that the marriage never happened in the first place.

Hope this helps!
 
All Christian marriages such as catholics, orthodox and assyrians. are presumes to be valid.

However the declaration of nullity does not dissolve a marriage.

To explain it (it is not perfect this example but it will makes sense)
It is like a prexisting condition or situation.
That previously was not discovered and essential the lart and priest would have known He knows he could not have married the couple because one of the member does not have the intention nor does the member is capable.(i mean the list is something else, which the priest only knows this is just general information)

For instance lets say there is a man and a woman.
The woman she was a never married and the man was.

He lived in another country and lies and says he never was married and lies all about his facts to the priest and hia fiance.

If this man marries he commits adultery and sacrilege. No one wants to do that nor be there is is worse than mortal sin.
No one wants to do mortal sin.

Anyway the priest believes him did a search on the supposebly places he resided however this man never registered civil marriages nor is telling th priest the full truth.

So they get approved and proceed with the mass and the marriege ceremony. (What she and the priest did not know is that they never had a marriage ceremony just the mass but not a marriage)
Then suddenly years down the road it is discovered that the mans identity is not whe he says he is, he is someone else, and could find the reccord that he was married on another church.

So what can the girl do live with this married man and now commit adultery?!
Because she before did not commit since she did not know.
No of course not there was no marriage the evil deceived the priest and his fiance so he cannot be married twice.
The church after doing an extensive investigation and finally concludes that the marriaged was null since it never existed in the first place. The mans wife lives in another country etc etc etc.
She and the man are given the declaration of nullity and she now must seperate from him. Because under the eyes of God that man is already married to someone else.

The girl is free to marry because the church cannot marry nor will not marry someone else. The church since she is the bride of Christ makes no mistakes.
She always knew. The fiance and priest were deceived by the evil man but the church and Our Lord always knew since both cannot be deceived.
 
Divorce is never allowed. Divorce claims that yes there is a valid marriage both people married in the right conditions and intentions. However at one point in life they decide to seperate and try to lie themselves by saying they will cut the bond and blessing of God.
First off what happened with saint like, saint matthew and saint mark?
It cannot be disolved by any human. Thos who say except in fornication.
Nor even when it says …cannot divorce except in fornication… it means that the couple can seperate but it does not authorize them to remarry because you see even in saint luke it says he who marries her who was put away commits adultery.

No exceptions.
If someone was unfaithful to the other after being rightly married and there was no prexisting situations but the man or woman cheated on him they cannot divorce. But they can seperate until everything gets resolved and the offender makes amends to her/him.

That is why in church we have the words for better or for worse… for richer or for poorer…in sickness and in health… till death do we part…

The girl and the man has to think about those words in every single aspects. Not just say yes i feel so good.
It is yes I attest to this oath before God for all my life.
Or no I cannot.

It is a very serious commitment for life!
Annulment does not dissolve it only says that a marriage was null meaning it never existed, while divorce it declares that it no longer exists a marriage that is indeed evil in itself.
 
One little clarification: A valid natural marriage can be dissolved by the Holy See in very specific circumstances, and Christians can enter valid natural marriages if they marry an unbaptized person.
 
Define natural?

The holy see cannot dissolve any marriage.
Becuase our Lord said therefore what God has joined together let no man put asunder.
But the Vatican does.have authority in declaring of a christian marriage wether was valid or null.

Now if you mean civil union. Okay. Civil union does not have the effect of spiritual marriage.
Marriage is only contracted by Holy Mother Church. Whether in the Catholic or Orthodox in front of a priest.

If the person does not have a declaration of nullity they cannot date as the bishops say because their marriage is presumed to be valid. Even if they start the process of obtaining a declaration of nullity. Because it is not automatically guaranteed to have it. The church must first verify.

About the second part of what you say I am not quite sure. That is something that needs verification from a Catholic priest.
 
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Eliazer said:
Define natural?
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A natural marriage is a marriage involving one or two unbaptized parties.

Natural marriages can be dissolved whereas consummated sacramental marriages cannot. (Unconsummated sacramental marriages can also be dissolved).
Eliazer said:
Thr holy see cannot dissolve any marriage.
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Yes, the Pope can dissolve an unconsummated sacramental marriage, and he can also dissolve a valid natural marriage through the Pertrine Privilege.

Also, the Pauline Privilege dissolves a natural marriage involving two unbaptized people, but that is not an act of the Pope but rather the contracting of a new marriage itself that dissolves the natural marriage.
 
manudewan said:
When Jesus says in Matt19:6. “So they are no longer two,but one in flesh. Therefore what God has joined together let no man separate”…Why then does the tribunal of an annulment procdure have the right to determine which marriages are valid and which ones are not?
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two people give the sacrament to each other during the vow. The priest is a witness to that action. The priest is NOT a mind reader. He has no idea if both people at that moment are each able to give that sacrament to the other.

Example:

What if one of those people lied to the other in the vow.? The other is completely oblivious to that. Did a sacrament take place even though everything “LOOKED” right during the marriage ceremony?
 
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Negative. That is not what I meant. A tribunal dissolves no marriage ever. Then, neither does it dissolve the ones you mention. Since they are only attempts and no sacrament was achieved, there is no marriage. There is nothing that could be dissolved. There only needs to be a judgement that the parties are not bound.

Only the a Holy See hold the power to dissolve and under the rarest of circumstances. No tribunal does that. No tribunal has the power. These cases go to Rome. The pope must ratify the decision. I’ve assisted with two such cases.
 
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I beg to differ.

I believe the Petrine and Pauline privileges exercise the power to dissolve marriages precisely on the basis that those valid marriages were non sacramental (ie one of the parties was not baptised).

You appear to deny that Catholics can enter into valid non sacramental marriages.
 
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Negative. The P and P cases you mention ONLY go to Rome. Valid non-sacramental marriage are still binding and cannot be dissolved by a tribunal since they are valid. I think you’re having trouble keeping this straight in your mind. Trust me, you’re not the first. The experts devote years of study to this.

You might consider speaking to a Case Analyst at your local tribunal for an explanation. I’m sure they’d be kind enough to explain this and might even mail you a brochure or other documents.
 
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I really don’t know what you are suggesting.
But what is clear is that the Church can dissolve some types of marriages:
(a) Non consummated marriages
(b) those where one of the parties is baptised and the other is not.
That is why they are called dissolutions not annulments. Even the Old Catholic Encyclopedia acknowledges this:
Non-Christian marriage can be dissolved by absolute divorce under certain circumstances in favour of the Faith.
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  1. The Pauline Privilege
    The Magna Charta in favour of Christian faith is contained in the words of the Apostle, 1 Corinthians 7:12-15: “If any brother hath a wife that believeth not, and she consent to dwell with him, let him not put her away. And if any woman hath a husband that believeth not, and he consent to dwell with her, let her not put away her husband. For the unbelieving husband is sanctified by the believing wife, and the unbelieving wife is sanctified by the believing husband: otherwise your children should be unclean; but now they are holy. But if the unbeliever depart, let him depart. For a brother or sister is not under servitude in such cases. But God hath called us in peace.”
Christian marriage before consummation can be dissolved by solemn profession in a religious order, or by an act of papal authority.
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  1. Dissolution by Solemn Profession
    The fact that religious profession causes the dissolution of the marriage bond, provided the marriage has not been consummated, is distinctly taught in the Extrav. Joan. XXII (tit. VI, cap. unic.), and was solemnly defined by the Council of Trent (Sess, XXIV, can. vi). The reason why this dissolution takes place is a theological question. The definition reads: “If anyone shall say that a marriage contracted, but not consummated, is not dissolved by the solemn religious profession of either one of the parties to the marriage, let him be anathema.”
http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/05054c.htm

If you are quibbling over who in the Church actually makes that decision that is another matter.
For all intents and purposes if the paperwork is done by the Tribunal but does go to Rome for rubber stamping that doesn’t really matter to most people.
 
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You originally said that tribunals dissolve marriages. Again, I tell you that no tribunal does this. Any possible dissolution in privilege cases is handled by the Holy See, (rarely by a bishop; i.e Pauline) not the tribunal judges and is quite rare. Look at the criteria for Petrine and Pauline cases and you’ll see why so. I’m not sure why this is such a sticking point. If you doubt me, call the Holy See and ask.
 
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TheOldColonel said:
You originally said that tribunals dissolve marriages. Again, I tell you that no tribunal does this. Any possible dissolution in prove ledge cases is handled by the Holy See, not the tribunal and is quite rare. Look at the criteria for Petrine and Pauline cases and you’ll see why so. I’m not sure why this is such a sticking point. If you doubt me, call the Holy See and ask.
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See above
If you are quibbling over who in the Church actually makes that decision that is another matter.
For all intents and purposes if the paperwork is done by the Tribunal but does go to Rome for rubber stamping that doesn’t really matter to most people.
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Rome does not rubber stamp these cases as you suggest, they actually process, build and hear the case. This takes about five years. Tribunals simply lack competency to hear such cases.

Why don’t you ask them.
 
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TheOldColonel said:
Rome does not rubber stamp these cases as you suggest, they actually process, build and hear the case.
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The OP fairly clearly identifies the Tribunal with the Catholic Church. He/she doesn’t seem interested in a distinction between the Tribunal and the Pope but rather between the Church and God.

“Therefore what God has joined together let no man separate”…Why then does the tribunal of an annulment procedure have the right to determine which marriages are valid and which ones are not?”

To simply say Catholic Tribunals cannot dissolve any marriages isn’t as helpful as you could have been in communicating an apposite answer to the poster I suggest.
 
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