Marriage Issue - Lost and Confused

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LROH said:
Why would he blame you for his evaluation? Feeling like the blame is on you doesn’t make it so!

You’re allowed to be imperfect to make mistakes to have the quirks that make you, you…and so is he:)

Definitely no get out of jail cards to barter past hurts for future behaviors.
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I don’t know that he would blame me, just a thought. He’d probably blame the relationship and he considers a lot of the issues to be my fault. On the other hand, he did apologize on Sat for not bringing this stuff up earlier. Before he was saying that the only fault he had was not leaving years ago.
 
Bernadettefaith said:

“On the other hand, he did apologize on Sat for not bringing this stuff up earlier. Before he was saying that the only fault he had was not leaving years ago.”

That’s progress. I can’t believe your counselor was letting him get away with saying that his only fault was not leaving years ago–what a cop-out. (Apologies for the accidental pun.)

It’s a common phenomenon in relationship questions in advice columns.

Letter Writer says: My spouse is driving me crazy by doing XYZ! He’s been doing it for years!

Advice Giver: Have you mentioned this issue to him?

Letter Writer: No.

We only get to start the clock on resentment AFTER we’ve explained that XYZ drives us crazy. (And ideally, it’s better not to start the clock at all.)
 
At my house, my oldest daughter is a very commanding personality. She’s always got a bright idea for what little brother could be doing or what games they can play and she has a tendency to break him down with repeated suggestions until he agrees. Meanwhile, little brother has fewer ideas and tends to do what big sister says. Sometimes (often) he’s not crazy about her ideas, but mopes and sadly goes along with her plans.

My responsibility as their parent is to 1) get big sister to take no for an answer 2) make sure that little brother is not being taken advantage of BUT also 3) to get little brother to start standing up for himself and 4) not automatically assume that little brother is in the right.

You may need something very similar from your next counselor.
 
bernadettefaith said:
I don’t know that he would blame me, just a thought. He’d probably blame the relationship and he considers a lot of the issues to be my fault. On the other hand, he did apologize on Sat for not bringing this stuff up earlier. Before he was saying that the only fault he had was not leaving years ago.
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He’d blame you…he’d blame the relationship…is he able to make choices and act on his own and take credit good or bad for his choices? or does he only want the trophies and pay checks? (Sorry to sound cheeky but get the man a sticker chart …I’m not laughing at you, I’ve been there)

So he’s sorry for not bringing it up earlier? Still not accepting that he has made choices that got you where you are…beyond sticking it out after he wasn’t happy?
 
That’s the thing. I was never unhappy in the relationship - ever. Maybe I just have low standards. It’s hard to blame him for much because I never had an issue with him. Nothing major anyway. So when she wants us to complain about each other I just don’t have a lot to say. I don’t think it’s productive to gripe about each other anyway. For right now, the issues with him are letting go of the past and lack of commitment/negativity toward relationship. She doesn’t think commitment should keep him in an unhappy relationship so that argument doesn’t go over well with her.

He justifies bringing up the past because it still bothers him. He says that he should be able to keep talking about it because it’s still giving him panic.
 
bernadettefaith said:

“He justifies bringing up the past because it still bothers him. He says that he should be able to keep talking about it because it’s still giving him panic.”

That is arguably very bad as psychological practice. For PTSD, there’s something called “retraumatization,” where the patient is harmed by talking about and re-experiencing their trauma. I would suggest doing some research on retraumatization and talking with your next counselor about how to avoid it.

If you make contact with that counselor who worked with NYPD, this might be something that she would be sensitive to.
 
That’s true. Maybe the way that she encourages him to keep talking about what I did to him just makes him been more panicked.

I talked to the lady who counseled NYPD and Dh is supposed to call her as well. I’ll see if he gets around to doing it soon.
 
bernadettefaith said:
That’s the thing. I was never unhappy in the relationship - ever. Maybe I just have low standards. It’s hard to blame him for much because I never had an issue with him. Nothing major anyway. So when she wants us to complain about each other I just don’t have a lot to say. I don’t think it’s productive to gripe about each other anyway. For right now, the issues with him are letting go of the past and lack of commitment/negativity toward relationship. She doesn’t think commitment should keep him in an unhappy relationship so that argument doesn’t go over well with her.

He justifies bringing up the past because it still bothers him. He says that he should be able to keep talking about it because it’s still giving him panic.
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I think griping about a spouse can be very productive. You both get it off your chests and feel a bit better and then you realize what you need to work on. Then you start doing the work and move forward. However, I don’t think it’s productive at all if it’s just constant griping about the same thing over and over with no end in sight.

As far as bringing up the past goes, how is one supposed to move past a bad experience and heal if all they do is mentally relive the bad experience or cling to it as a way to avoid dealing with the underlying issues.

I really hope the fellow you found or the lady with law enforcement experience work out for you. Hopefully, you’ll be able to see one or both of them and start making progress.

In another post you mentioned insurance wouldn’t cover one of them without a diagnosis and you were worried a white lie would have to be told. I disagree. If your DH is having anxiety and panic attacks he could be diagnosed with PTSD or Generalized Anxiety Disorder and it wouldn’t be a lie as he is showing symptoms of either or both. If a diagnosis is given for insurance purposes and you later learn the diagnosis is incorrect or incomplete the therapist can always change the diagnosis.
 
In PTSD There’s also transference where the focus is placed on b when the real problem is a.
I’m not very good at simple explanations 🙂

But original trauma included loud noises, person appears fine once initial healing takes place, until they hear a similar noise that reawakens the hidden trauma…then they don’t understand why they are stressed, anxious etc and blame the current surroundings as they have have no Flash Backs to original trauma and so have no clue they have transferred the feelings related to then (a) to now (b).

Xan may be able to check w/MIL to clean that up a bit 🙂
 
MJJean said:
I think griping about a spouse can be very productive. You both get it off your chests and feel a bit better and then you realize what you need to work on. Then you start doing the work and move forward. However, I don’t think it’s productive at all if it’s just constant griping about the same thing over and over with no end in sight.

As far as bringing up the past goes, how is one supposed to move past a bad experience and heal if all they do is mentally relive the bad experience or cling to it as a way to avoid dealing with the underlying issues.

I really hope the fellow you found or the lady with law enforcement experience work out for you. Hopefully, you’ll be able to see one or both of them and start making progress.

In another post you mentioned insurance wouldn’t cover one of them without a diagnosis and you were worried a white lie would have to be told. I disagree. If your DH is having anxiety and panic attacks he could be diagnosed with PTSD or Generalized Anxiety Disorder and it wouldn’t be a lie as he is showing symptoms of either or both. If a diagnosis is given for insurance purposes and you later learn the diagnosis is incorrect or incomplete the therapist can always change the diagnosis.
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I understand the griping at first. I really didn’t have anything significant to gripe about other than what he’s doing right now. I just don’t get why the therapist doesn’t seem to do anything about his reliving old experiences. She asks him when this last happened and he said it was years ago. Then she says, “See, it’s been a long time. Do you think it will happen again?” He says, “No, but I expect it to happen anyway.” Then she says, “I know what that’s like. My ex-husband had a terrible temper. When I married my current husband I expected him to have a temper as well. He is so patient and never loses his temper with me. When I’d do something that I thought would make him mad, I’d always be shocked that he didn’t lose his temper.” We’ve had this same conversation at least 3 times :rolleyes:

I meant that our current therapist reassured us that she would come up with a diagnosis regardless. It’s all under my name so that dh doesn’t have it on his record for work purposes. I’m sure she probably put depression down as the cause though I think it’s at least 95% relationship issues. I certainly didn’t consider myself depressed before any of this. I’d have things that I worried about but nothing this severe ever.

Dh probably won’t agree for them to list PTSD as his diagnosis and bill it under him on the insurance 🤷 So we might not be able to get it covered. The current counselor asked me if cops get PTSD. I told her that they did. But then during therapy she seems to go along with his description that I’m the cause of his PTSD.
 
LROH said:
In PTSD There’s also transference where the focus is placed on b when the real problem is a.
I’m not very good at simple explanations 🙂

But original trauma included loud noises, person appears fine once initial healing takes place, until they hear a similar noise that reawakens the hidden trauma…then they don’t understand why they are stressed, anxious etc and blame the current surroundings as they have have no Flash Backs to original trauma and so have no clue they have transferred the feelings related to then (a) to now (b).

Xan may be able to check w/MIL to clean that up a bit 🙂
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I could definitely have brought up bad memories when I would get angry. For one, I’m sure his life and his family have been threatened numerous times by those he’s arrested. Also, during the police academy they constantly have someone screaming in their face to acclimate them to the job. I hardly believe I’m the worst and most stressful thing he has ever dealt with in his life.
 
bernadettefaith said:
I understand the griping at first. I really didn’t have anything significant to gripe about other than what he’s doing right now. I just don’t get why the therapist doesn’t seem to do anything about his reliving old experiences. She asks him when this last happened and he said it was years ago. Then she says, “See, it’s been a long time. Do you think it will happen again?” He says, “No, but I expect it to happen anyway.” Then she says, “I know what that’s like. My ex-husband had a terrible temper. When I married my current husband I expected him to have a temper as well. He is so patient and never loses his temper with me. When I’d do something that I thought would make him mad, I’d always be shocked that he didn’t lose his temper.” We’ve had this same conversation at least 3 times :rolleyes:

I meant that our current therapist reassured us that she would come up with a diagnosis regardless. It’s all under my name so that dh doesn’t have it on his record for work purposes. I’m sure she probably put depression down as the cause though I think it’s at least 95% relationship issues. I certainly didn’t consider myself depressed before any of this. I’d have things that I worried about but nothing this severe ever.

Dh probably won’t agree for them to list PTSD as his diagnosis and bill it under him on the insurance 🤷 So we might not be able to get it covered. The current counselor asked me if cops get PTSD. I told her that they did. But then during therapy she seems to go along with his description that I’m the cause of his PTSD.
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Well, if the woman had to ask if cops can have PTSD then I’m pretty sure she wasn’t qualified to diagnose or treat it! Yeesh.

I understand why your DH wouldn’t want PTSD or an anxiety disorder listed until after he gets the new job, so I see nothing wrong with diagnosing you so the sessions could be billed. And I’m pretty sure it wouldn’t be a white lie! If you’ve been feeling depressed since the marital troubles began then you’re depressed and a depression diagnosis isn’t a lie. If the cause is just the marital troubles and the counseling fixes the problem then you get to be cured! 😃
 
MJJean said:
Well, if the woman had to ask if cops can have PTSD then I’m pretty sure she wasn’t qualified to diagnose or treat it! Yeesh.

I understand why your DH wouldn’t want PTSD or an anxiety disorder listed until after he gets the new job, so I see nothing wrong with diagnosing you so the sessions could be billed. And I’m pretty sure it wouldn’t be a white lie! If you’ve been feeling depressed since the marital troubles began then you’re depressed and a depression diagnosis isn’t a lie. If the cause is just the marital troubles and the counseling fixes the problem then you get to be cured! 😃
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Yeah but this counselor said that he can only bill our insurance if we have a genuine mental health concern. He said that if the problem is the relationship then we have to self pay. Dh won’t agree to pay $100/hr out of pocket so now I’m hoping the new counselor finds a diagnosis of some kind.
 
bernadettefaith said:
I understand the griping at first. I really didn’t have anything significant to gripe about other than what he’s doing right now. I just don’t get why the therapist doesn’t seem to do anything about his reliving old experiences. She asks him when this last happened and he said it was years ago. Then she says, “See, it’s been a long time. Do you think it will happen again?” He says, “No, but I expect it to happen anyway.” Then she says, “I know what that’s like. My ex-husband had a terrible temper. When I married my current husband I expected him to have a temper as well. He is so patient and never loses his temper with me. When I’d do something that I thought would make him mad, I’d always be shocked that he didn’t lose his temper.” We’ve had this same conversation at least 3 times :rolleyes:

I meant that our current therapist reassured us that she would come up with a diagnosis regardless. It’s all under my name so that dh doesn’t have it on his record for work purposes. I’m sure she probably put depression down as the cause though I think it’s at least 95% relationship issues. I certainly didn’t consider myself depressed before any of this. I’d have things that I worried about but nothing this severe ever.

Dh probably won’t agree for them to list PTSD as his diagnosis and bill it under him on the insurance 🤷 So we might not be able to get it covered. The current counselor asked me if cops get PTSD. I told her that they did. But then during therapy she seems to go along with his description that I’m the cause of his PTSD.
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From the way that is phrased it seems like counselor is trying in no confrontational manor to help him see irrational fears.

We don’t get to pick the names they stick on our human failings…although we often get to negotiate them for the greater good.
 
How did she ask him if cops can get PTSD? Was she trying to open his eyes to the possibility that this is so etching he is dealing with? Or did it come across like she really expected cops would be immune to PTSD somehow?

Can’t imagine a counselor thinking ANYONE is immune to PTSD as they diagnose tons of people it now a days vs when it was new it was primarily returning active military.
 
LROH said:
How did she ask him if cops can get PTSD? Was she trying to open his eyes to the possibility that this is so etching he is dealing with? Or did it come across like she really expected cops would be immune to PTSD somehow?

Can’t imagine a counselor thinking ANYONE is immune to PTSD as they diagnose tons of people it now a days vs when it was new it was primarily returning active military.
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She asked me individually about PTSD. The only time she mentioned PTSD to him (to my knowledge) was when he said that he relives the incidents with my anger. Then she said that it sounds like he has PTSD.
 
“She asks him when this last happened and he said it was years ago. Then she says, “See, it’s been a long time. Do you think it will happen again?” He says, “No, but I expect it to happen anyway.” Then she says, “I know what that’s like. My ex-husband had a terrible temper. When I married my current husband I expected him to have a temper as well. He is so patient and never loses his temper with me. When I’d do something that I thought would make him mad, I’d always be shocked that he didn’t lose his temper.” We’ve had this same conversation at least 3 times”

I think your old counselor is lazy and disorganized and unprofessional.
 
We had our last session with this counselor tonight. She insists that she doesn’t see me as her ex husband and that I’m not nearly as angry as he was. I insisted otherwise but she believes that she was not comparing us.

She talked about breaking down the anger walls but nothing really got resolved. She doesn’t really seem to have ideas that would help with the anger.

We talked about our views on divorce. I said that I would only leave in case of abuse. She acted like I was crazy for wanting him to stay even if he’s still unhappy in a year.

So basically now Dh thinks I am selfish because I want him to stay regardless. I insisted that we could make the marriage happier and not be unhappy forever. The counselor just didn’t seem to help at all. Now I’m second guessing myself and they both make me feel like a crazy selfish person who wants to preserve marriage at all costs.
 
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