Marriage option?

[brownpau77]

Is there any option for older, widowed adults to live as husband and wife without being officially married by the church? The reason to not get “married” would be that they would lose their insurance coverage and the estates would become complex for the two families. Both involved want to stay within the church, both have been widowed for years, and have found love and companionship with the other, but to get married would complicate things practically, as stated above. Any legitimate options?

 

[El_Nica]

give to ceasar what is ceasars and to god what is gods. But other wise go for it. at this point in life you should probably be woried as much as possible about what God thinks and not about what your family are hoping to gain from your loss. (or gain depending on what you REALLY believe.

 

[LilyM]

Is there any option for older, widowed adults to live as husband and wife without being officially married by the church? The reason to not get “married” would be that they would lose their insurance coverage and the estates would become complex for the two families. Both involved want to stay within the church, both have been widowed for years, and have found love and companionship with the other, but to get married would complicate things practically, as stated above. Any legitimate options?

If a couple intends to live as husband and wife, they need to acknowledge that committment before God in a church ceremony at the very least. To not do this much would be a grave sin.

If the estates and other financial arrangements are that complicated, then what they really need is advice about how to better plan and manage their finances and respective estates. Even if this is difficult to do, it’s simply not an option to maintain an illicit pseudo-marital relationship solely for reasons of financial convenience.

 

[jamannor]

Living out of marriage as husband and wife is a sin. Mainly marriage is a sacrament that cannot be manipulated to fit ones personal lives. It’s a vocation that you and your loved one are called to partake in.

The Vocation to marriage is written in the very nature of man and woman as they came from the hand of the Creator. Marriage is not a purely human institution despite the many variations it may have undergone through the centuries in different cultures, social structures and spiritual attitudes. -CCC, no. 1603.

Marriage is so sacred it is a reflection of the love between Christ and the church. As for legality, although it is not romantic a prenuptial agreement might work in your case.

I know this must be really complex but I’ll pray for you, and you should talk to your priest.

Jerry

Is there any option for older, widowed adults to live as husband and wife without being officially married by the church? The reason to not get “married” would be that they would lose their insurance coverage and the estates would become complex for the two families. Both involved want to stay within the church, both have been widowed for years, and have found love and companionship with the other, but to get married would complicate things practically, as stated above. Any legitimate options?

 

[puzzleannie]

Is there any option for older, widowed adults to live as husband and wife without being officially married by the church? ?

no there is no option for unmarried people to cohabit, not matter what their age, no matter what the financial sacrifices might entail from getting married. no one has the right to the pleasures of marriage without marriage. No one. What is an option is for couples to get sound financial planning advice long before one spouse retires or dies, so that they can make prudent decisions about insurance, pensions, IRAs, SS etc. that take into account the fact that the surviving spouse may someday marry again.

 

[1ke]

Is there any option for older, widowed adults to live as husband and wife without being officially married by the church? The reason to not get “married” would be that they would lose their insurance coverage and the estates would become complex for the two families. Both involved want to stay within the church, both have been widowed for years, and have found love and companionship with the other, but to get married would complicate things practically, as stated above. Any legitimate options?

No. One cannot simulate marriage.

Marriage is a Sacrament. If they cannot commit themselves totally, come what may, then they are not really committed.

The estates can be handled through lawyers, trusts, and wills.

 

[Matt_Collins]

Marriage is a public act. That’s why there must be witnesses. Canon law even requires the priest (or other witness) to adhere to all just civil laws regarding marriage, such as signing the civil marriage license.

The church does allow for the RARE case when marriages may be secret, but only for legitimate reasons. Tax fraud and insurance fraud cannot be considered legitimate reasons.

As others have said above, a good lawyer can handle legitimate concerns about estates, etc.

Perhaps, though, civil law regarding marriage could be modified to address the needs of older couples.

 

[brownpau77]

Thanks for the info. This is actually about a grandparent, not me, but I had the same thoughts regarding the whole thing. It doesn’t make me comfortable to have some sort of pseudo-marriage arrangement. They have talked to a priest, but sometimes priests are less strict than they should and I didn’t know if there was a higher authority they should talk to…a canon law expert, or diocesian marriage tribunal…etc.

 

[puzzleannie]

there is an authority but it is up to this couple to do the asking, not you or any other family members. Don’t offer an opinion unless and until you are asked. They are talking to the priest so assume in Christian charity that he is advising them appropriately. We do not speculate about the supposed or potential sins of others, not even our relatives (as tempting as that may be).

 

[frfreddie]

OK, let me ask the silly question. Do they plan to have marital relations? Or are they planning to live together as room mates, as brother and sister? Of course, this depends on what is “written in their hearts”, not just what they say.

Related to this, I know it’s silly, but I have never understood this. How do very old people get married in the church if they can’t consummate the marriage? I guess they don’t have to be very old, what about a quadriplegic (thank God for spell checkers) man?

I’m not trying to make this difficult, I’m really just trying to understand.

 

[Matt_Collins]

Related to this, I know it’s silly, but I have never understood this. How do very old people get married in the church if they can’t consummate the marriage? I guess they don’t have to be very old, what about a quadriplegic (thank God for spell checkers) man?

They’re still validly married. That’s what gives them the right to even try to have intercourse. It’s just that the marriage is not yet consummated, and could be dissolved by the pope:

Can. 1141 A marriage which is ratified and consummated cannot be dissolved by any human power or by any cause other than death.

Can. 1142 A non-consummated marriage between baptised persons or between a baptised party and an unbaptised party can be dissolved by the Roman Pontiff for a just reason, at the request of both parties or of either party, even if the other is unwilling.

Even if a couple has not consummated their marriage, it is still a valid marriage. Mary and Joseph were really and truly married even though they never consummated it.

 

[rwoehmke]

But inability to consummate would imply erectile dysfunction of major proportions or total impotence. Isn’t this an impediment to marriage whether one is eighteen or eighty?

 

[frfreddie]

But inability to consummate would imply erectile dysfunction of major proportions or total impotence. Isn’t this an impediment to marriage whether one is eighteen or eighty?

Thank you. That’s what I was trying to ask.

 

[puzzleannie]

if you want to discuss canon law on conditions for a valid marriage, including natural law impediments, go to one of the dozens of threads that have that discussion. It is certainly no business of the grandchildren in this instance to speculate about the intentions of their grandparents in this regard. The couple in question has consulted a priest, according to OP, so the matter is closed as far as anyone else is concerned, including their relatives and members of this forum.