Marriage Sexuality, Catholicism, and Judgement

[piofaustina]

Greetings sweinhart2006,

…I am aware of what the Church teaches is sexually permissible and what is not in a Catholic marriage. I am aware for instance that oral sex/mutual masturbation is considered a mortal sin. This teaching is not something that is forbidden in the 10 commandments or mentioned in Jesus’ teachings but is created and enforced by the Catholic Church…

Hm, I think we would say this has always been part of Christian teaching, and we should think of the bible as a good, foundational, and Holy reference. Like a history book, and the constitution kind of rolled into one. We don’t find public nudity as a crime enforced by the Police in even the best history books or constitutional law. But I think it’s ok to toss someone in jail (strip them of the freedoms usually given them) for doing it.

…under threat of eternal damnation should the person die prior to repentance.

My understanding was that eternal damnation is different. You’re not so much being threatened with eteral damnation, like you’d be tossed in jail with a life sentence for no good reason. But you’ve spent your life turning yourself into the kind of person who can’t function right, a sort of career criminal I suppose. As a real man/woman with real free will, we get the crazy ability to “create” yourself in a matter of speaking. To create something that will last forever. Its not so much that we throw away people forever in hell, its that they would not make very good neighbors in Heaven. So they get a place of their own. People who can at least repent on their deathbed are “making” something of themselves. But that’s more my opinion than theology.

If all man are judged under the same law, this would necessarily mean that nearly all people go to hell, as most who do not abide by this law do not repent since they either do not believe or agree with this teaching, including most Christians and even many Catholics. I cannot believe that hell is what God has in store for nearly all of humanity, and if He does judge all on this standard, how can one consider God to be the loving and forgiving God we are all taught? If He does not judge all people on this standard, than it would seem that Catholics are judge far more harshly and stricter than those who do not believe. And if this is the case, why would anyone want to be Catholic when it just means your judgment will be that much more strict and your punishments far worse than the non-Catholic?

I think you have a good point here, and I think the logical answer can only be that all men cannot be judged by the same law. The Catholic Church does not teach that they are judged by the same law. And by all appearances, the Apostle Paul (1 Corinthians, Ch 5:9 - 5:13) is in agreement with that. I think…I take that back, I know we have higher standards. I cannot go running through the streets in my birthday suit, I will be forcibly removed from both polite company and civil society until I choose to show proper restraint. A child could get away with it, a person with mental disabilities could be forgiven for doing so. And perhaps someone so foreign to these lands as to be completely ignorant of our laws could be forgiven as well. As the bible says in the citation from Corinthians above, that doesn’t change the Church’s standards one bit. We’re always going to live more strictly, by comparison.

Sorry, I think I got lost. Is it the problem with the seeming arbitrariness of the teaching on sexuality a problem, or was it purely for example purposes?

 

[EasterJoy]

FYI my wife is pregnant and this is my 5th child. It has nothing to do with willingness to bring forth new life. And I would be very careful of stating that most protestants are going to hell. That I know is against Church teaching. I have also had personal experiences and seen many cases of people that have passed and are clearly not in hell, albeit probably purgatory, and these are people that traditionally the Church or the bible would say are damned such as prostitutes. I believe there is overwhelming evidence that suggests that sinners aren’t necessarily damned. Of course only God knows, but the Church is clearly strict on its teachings.

I wish people would quit throwing around “what the Bible says” with regards to who is going to Heaven. When the Lord was asked point blank if there would be few saved, he said simply, “Enter through the narrow gate.” He didn’t encourage us to worry about anyone else. He encouraged us to concern ourselves with ourselves.

“Amen, I say to you, tax collectors and prostitutes are entering the kingdom of God before you.” Matt. 21:31b

There are prostitutes going to heaven…it says so in plain language, in the red letters, the real Gospels, put into the canon of inspired Holy Scriptures by the Church. Look to enter through the narrow gate. That’s what we’ve been told to do. We ought to try to do it. We all know we’ll need mercy; just do your best, and encourage others to do the same. Dare to condemn no one, but only actions.

 

[Father_of_10]

Looking solely at the scripture, “sola scriptura”, is a protestant practice and not a Catholic one. The Church also has 2000 years of tradition that is also part of it’s teachings.

For example, the Church states that one of the fundamental beliefs of a Catholic is the Immaculate Conception of Mary. No where in scripture does it state that Mary was without sin. This was derived after centuries of writings and thoughts by theologians as far back as 600 A.D. and confirmed by Pope Pious IX in 1854 in the encyclical “Ineffabilis Deus”.

So taking a Church teaching and reducing it to whether it is in the Bible is moot if you are a Catholic. It follows that the Church was established by Christ who left Peter as it’s head and through apostolic succession until today as our present Pope.

I assume somewhere along the way the OP had to work hard to have a career with the ability to support a family. The career may have entailed getting a formal academic education, working as an apprentice at a trade or just diligent hard work to succeed. The tasks of getting there may have been mundane, not understood at the time, and thoroughly disliked. At anytime along the way, he could have given up and not succeeded. This is free will that has been given to us by God. Getting to heaven is similar. Yes, there will be those that make it to heaven not having the fullness of teaching of the Church. But the chances of salvation are greater following the Church that Christ left for us. Trying to become an attorney or engineer without going to a formal school for that training is possible, but the way is fraught with unknowns and possible derailment. Why chance salvation by going at it on your own and disregarding your faith?