Mary and Joseph

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Reading the below verse:

“Now this is how the birth of Jesus Christ came about. When his mother Mary was betrothed to Joseph, but before they lived together, she was found with child through the Holy Spirit. Joseph her husband, since he was a righteous man, yet unwilling to expose her to shame, decided to divorce her quietly” – Matthew 1:18-19

Was St Joseph intending to divorce Mary because he thought Mary had betrayed him with another man or did St Joseph intend to divorce Mary humbly because he did not think he was worthy of her since “she was found with child through the Holy Spirit”?

God bless,
 
If you read on, you should find your answer ('But as he considered this, behold, an angel of the Lord appeared to him in a dream, saying, “Joseph, son of David, do not fear to take Mary your wife, for that which is conceived in her is of the Holy Spirit; she will bear a son, and you shall call his name Jesus, for he will save his people from their sins.” ’ Matthew 1:20-21 RSV). It seems obvious that Joseph thought Mary had been unfaithful. If he just didn’t feel “worthy”, I would think the angel would have said something about his being worthy; instead the angel told Joseph that the child had been conceived by the Holy Spirit.
 
The_Way said:
Reading the below verse:

“Now this is how the birth of Jesus Christ came about. When his mother Mary was betrothed to Joseph, but before they lived together, she was found with child through the Holy Spirit. Joseph her husband, since he was a righteous man, yet unwilling to expose her to shame, decided to divorce her quietly” – Matthew 1:18-19

Was St Joseph intending to divorce Mary because he thought Mary had betrayed him with another man or did St Joseph intend to divorce Mary humbly because he did not think he was worthy of her since “she was found with child through the Holy Spirit”?

God bless,
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The marriage of the Virgin Mary to Saint Joseph was virginal, chaste, and pure. The Virgin Mary said to Saint Bridget:

“Know most certainly that before he married me, Joseph knew in the Holy Ghost, that I had vowed my virginity to my God, and was immaculate in thought, word, and deed, and that he espoused me with the intention of serving me, holding me in the light of a sovereign mistress, not a wife. And I knew most certainly in the Holy Ghost that my perpetual virginity would remain intact, although by a secret dispensation of God I was married to a husband.”

When Joseph realized that his wife, the Virgin Mary, was with child, he did not suspect her of infidelity. He knew that she was faithful to God.’

“But when I had consented to the annunciation of God, Joseph, seeing my womb increase by the operation of the Holy Ghost, feared vehemently: not suspecting anything amiss in me, but remembering the sayings of the prophets, foretelling that the Son of God should be born of a virgin, deeming himself unworthy to serve such a mother, until the angel in a dream ordered him not to fear, but to minister unto me in charity.”

Quotes are from Saint Bridget of Sweden, Revelations of St. Bridget, p. 23-24.
 
Ron_Conte said:
The marriage of the Virgin Mary to Saint Joseph was virginal, chaste, and pure. The Virgin Mary said to Saint Bridget:

“Know most certainly that before he married me, Joseph knew in the Holy Ghost, that I had vowed my virginity to my God, and was immaculate in thought, word, and deed, and that he espoused me with the intention of serving me, holding me in the light of a sovereign mistress, not a wife. And I knew most certainly in the Holy Ghost that my perpetual virginity would remain intact, although by a secret dispensation of God I was married to a husband.”

When Joseph realized that his wife, the Virgin Mary, was with child, he did not suspect her of infidelity. He knew that she was faithful to God.’

“But when I had consented to the annunciation of God, Joseph, seeing my womb increase by the operation of the Holy Ghost, feared vehemently: not suspecting anything amiss in me, but remembering the sayings of the prophets, foretelling that the Son of God should be born of a virgin, deeming himself unworthy to serve such a mother, until the angel in a dream ordered him not to fear, but to minister unto me in charity.”

Quotes are from Saint Bridget of Sweden, Revelations of St. Bridget, p. 23-24.
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That is simply not true and not scriptural. Private revelation is not part of the Deposit of Faith and private revelations clearly have inaccuracies and contradictions.
It is clear from Scripture that Joseph thought Mary had been unfaithful which was why he was angry and contemplating divorce. He only subsequently knew that was not the case once he was told in a dream.
It is dangerous and misleading to try to use private revelation to state a fact that is not borne out by Scripture.
 
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thistle:
It is clear from Scripture that Joseph thought Mary had been unfaithful which was why he was angry and contemplating divorce. He only subsequently knew that was not the case once he was told in a dream.
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It is not clear from scripture that Joseph thought Mary had been unfaithful, or that he was angry, in fact since the Scriptures say that he is a righteous man, we can dismiss the idea that he was angry. The Scriptures may seem to imply what you say, but it is not clear by any means.

Another visionary of the 18th century, that was reputedly visited by St. Joseph, Mother Maria Baij, says that St. Joseph was in extreme perplexity because he knew that Mary would never be unfaithful to him or to God, yet physically that seemed to be contradicted. But there is still another explanation for why Joseph was unable to stay married to Mary. Under Jewish Law, it would be necessary for Joseph to accept Mary’s child as his own, or risk exposing Mary to the penalty of the Law. St. Joseph, for righteousness sake, was unable to do either, and this was a tremendous test of his Faith, much like that of Abraham. That is why the Angel delivered the message that he did. It was then apparent to Joseph, that this child was from God, that Mary had been faithful all along, and that he was to (tacitly) acknowledge this child as his own. All of his perplexities were put away.
 
The_Way said:
Reading the below verse:

“Now this is how the birth of Jesus Christ came about. When his mother Mary was betrothed to Joseph, but before they lived together, she was found with child through the Holy Spirit. Joseph her husband, since he was a righteous man, yet unwilling to expose her to shame, decided to divorce her quietly” – Matthew 1:18-19

Was St Joseph intending to divorce Mary because he thought Mary had betrayed him with another man or did St Joseph intend to divorce Mary humbly because he did not think he was worthy of her since “she was found with child through the Holy Spirit”?

God bless,
Click to expand...
The Perpetual Virginity of Mary and the Righteous Man

Matthew 1:19
19Because Joseph her husband was a righteous man and did not want to expose her to public disgrace, he had in mind to divorce her quietly.

Two interpretations attempt to explain why Joseph decided to separate from Mary. They give opposite answers to the question: Who did Joseph think was the unworthy partner in the betrothal?

The Suspicion Theory

This view holds that Joseph suspected Mary of adultery when he discovered that she was pregnant. The troubling news led him to seek a divorce in accordance with Deuteronomy 24:1-4, although he wished to do this secretly to avoid subjecting Mary to the rigorous law of Deuteronomy 22:23-24, which mandates capital punishment for adulterers. Joseph was a just man inasmuch as he resolved to act (divorce) in accordance with the Mosaic law. This common interpretation suffers from a serious weakness: Joseph’s desire to follow the law for divorce does not square with his willingness to sidestep the law proscribed for adulterers. A truly righteous man would keep God’s law completely, not selectively.

The Reverence Theory

This view holds that Joseph, already informed of the divine miracle within Mary (Matthew 1:18), considered himself unworthy to be part of God’s work in this unusual situation (cf. Lk 5:8; 7:6). His resolve to separate quietly from Mary is thus seen as a reverent and discretionary measure to keep secret the mystery within her. Notably, the expression “to expose her to public disgrace” is weaker in Greek than in the translation: it means that Joseph did not wish to “exhibit” Mary in a public way. The angelic announcement in Matthew 1:20, then, directs Joseph to set aside pious fears that would lead him away from his vocation to be the legal father of the Davidic Messiah. This view more aptly aligns Joseph’s righteiousness with his intentions. (Hahn, Scott and Curtis Mitch, The Gospel of Matthew, Ignatius Study Bible, 18).
 
The_Way said:
Reading the below verse:

“Now this is how the birth of Jesus Christ came about. When his mother Mary was betrothed to Joseph, but before they lived together, she was found with child through the Holy Spirit. Joseph her husband, since he was a righteous man, yet unwilling to expose her to shame, decided to divorce her quietly” – Matthew 1:18-19

Was St Joseph intending to divorce Mary because he thought Mary had betrayed him with another man or did St Joseph intend to divorce Mary humbly because he did not think he was worthy of her since “she was found with child through the Holy Spirit”?

God bless,
Click to expand...
Looking strictly at the Scripture one can only say that Joseph wanted to divorce her because it was a scandal in Joseph’s time for a betrothed to be pregnant. Joseph being the pious man he was did not want to make a big fuss out of this but just to divorce her quietly taking in mind that the consequence of such crime can be deathly (punishable by stoning). Looking at it today it may not be the best course of action that Joseph took; what would happen to Mary to be on her own and with a child? Divorce was prescribed in the Jewish common law for adultery so it is quite reasonable to think that Joseph wanted to divorce her was purely on this ground.

Other than this I think it is purely speculation to say otherwise because it will not conform to Scripture and the order of the day. Besides Joseph had no idea that Mary was with child conceived by the Holy Spirit. He knew only until he was told in a dream that it was; after which he complied and the rest was history.

Today the fact that St. Joseph was the most honored saint after the Blessed Mother does not change the fact of this early experience of the virgin birth. In fact it makes it all the more admirable and unique the coming of the Savior was and that those involved especially his parents had their share of suffering and humiliation in the world they lived in. This also makes us very thankful for them who willingly with a price to pay brought up a Savior to this broken world.

It is reasonable too that it was certainly a choice for either Joseph or Mary to say yes to God. Not everybody perhaps would do the same considering the burden and the implication that this gift would bring upon them. Joseph had to face a possible scandal over a pregnant betrothed and Mary had to witness the crucifixion of her son.

God bless.
 
Re: putting Mary away quietly

He was probably preparing to ask around, to find out a good place for Mary to live, in a place where they had kin. She could have gone back to her kinswoman Elizabeth, or various other places. Since divorce was relatively common in Jesus’ day, and since the man could divorce the woman without there being any fault on her part, Mary wouldn’t have to fear any special opprobrium. Mostly, people would have thought Joseph must be the kind of nasty guy who’d knock his girl up while still betrothed, and then divorce her for no good reason. It might be somewhat harder to find a man who’d marry a non-virgin, but if Mary were young and pretty enough, or if the man wanted a son to adopt, it wouldn’t have been impossible for Mary to marry again.

So Joseph wasn’t preparing to kick Mary to the curb, in the expectation that she’d starve to death like a dog in the street. The major thing would be to divorce her quietly and put her away quietly, so that everyone would know that it was obviously Joseph’s problem and no fault of Mary’s, and so that both their families would suffer less open embarrassment.
 
Mintaka said:
So Joseph wasn’t preparing to kick Mary to the curb, in the expectation that she’d starve to death like a dog in the street. The major thing would be to divorce her quietly and put her away quietly, so that everyone would know that it was obviously Joseph’s problem and no fault of Mary’s, and so that both their families would suffer less open embarrassment.
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Hi Mintaka,

Thanks for answering my post;

I know your intention is to contribute to this thread but please take care regarding the words you choose when speaking about our blessed Mother. Others like me may find it offensive.

God bless,
 
Randy_Carson said:
The Perpetual Virginity of Mary and the Righteous Man

Matthew 1:19
19Because Joseph her husband was a righteous man and did not want to expose her to public disgrace, he had in mind to divorce her quietly.

Two interpretations attempt to explain why Joseph decided to separate from Mary. They give opposite answers to the question: Who did Joseph think was the unworthy partner in the betrothal?

The Suspicion Theory

This view holds that Joseph suspected Mary of adultery when he discovered that she was pregnant. The troubling news led him to seek a divorce in accordance with Deuteronomy 24:1-4, although he wished to do this secretly to avoid subjecting Mary to the rigorous law of Deuteronomy 22:23-24, which mandates capital punishment for adulterers. Joseph was a just man inasmuch as he resolved to act (divorce) in accordance with the Mosaic law. This common interpretation suffers from a serious weakness: Joseph’s desire to follow the law for divorce does not square with his willingness to sidestep the law proscribed for adulterers. A truly righteous man would keep God’s law completely, not selectively.

The Reverence Theory

This view holds that Joseph, already informed of the divine miracle within Mary (Matthew 1:18), considered himself unworthy to be part of God’s work in this unusual situation (cf. Lk 5:8; 7:6). His resolve to separate quietly from Mary is thus seen as a reverent and discretionary measure to keep secret the mystery within her. Notably, the expression “to expose her to public disgrace” is weaker in Greek than in the translation: it means that Joseph did not wish to “exhibit” Mary in a public way. The angelic announcement in Matthew 1:20, then, directs Joseph to set aside pious fears that would lead him away from his vocation to be the legal father of the Davidic Messiah. This view more aptly aligns Joseph’s righteiousness with his intentions. (Hahn, Scott and Curtis Mitch, The Gospel of Matthew, Ignatius Study Bible, 18).
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Joseph did NOT have prior knowledge of the divine miracle. He found out Mary was pregnant, was not happy about that and considered divorcing her (albeit quietly). It was only subsequently he was then told in a dream about the divine miracle.
 
thistle said:
Joseph did NOT have prior knowledge of the divine miracle. He found out Mary was pregnant, was not happy about that and considered divorcing her (albeit quietly). It was only subsequently he was then told in a dream about the divine miracle.
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It appears that way at first but then one has to wonder what the below verse means:

“Now this is how the birth of Jesus Christ came about. When his mother Mary was betrothed to Joseph, but before they lived together, she was found with child through the Holy Spirit.” – Matthew 1:18

Who found her “with child through the Holy Spirit”?

God bless,
 
The_Way said:
It appears that way at first but then one has to wonder what the below verse means:

“Now this is how the birth of Jesus Christ came about. When his mother Mary was betrothed to Joseph, but before they lived together, she was found with child through the Holy Spirit.” – Matthew 1:18

Who found her “with child through the Holy Spirit”?

God bless,
Click to expand...
Matt 1:18-20
18 Now this is how the birth of Jesus Christ came about. When his mother Mary was betrothed to Joseph, but before they lived together, she was found with child through the holy Spirit.
19 Joseph her husband, since he was a righteous man, yet unwilling to expose her to shame, decided to divorce her quietly.
20 Such was his intention when, behold, the angel of the Lord appeared to him in a dream and said, "Joseph, son of David, do not be afraid to take Mary your wife into your home. For it is through the holy Spirit that this child has been conceived in her.

The expression you refer to does not in any way mean Joseph knew in advance who the father of the unborn child was. It conveys to readers of the gospel that she was pregnant by the Holy Spirit.
Read the three verses and you get the sequence. If Joseph knew in advance who had made Mary pregnant then why would God have to subsequently come to him in a dream and tell him.
 
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