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Dan_Defender
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why not? Jesus was walking the earth so it was a unique time to be a disciple. Of course this is all speculation.
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tuffsmurf
Guest
Actually we don’t know that Mary was a consecrated virgin, since that didn’t really exist at the time.
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anon91549587
Guest
That edict was given to the animals who have no will in the earlier verse Gen 1:24. Check out Matt 19:12 too.
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RidgeSprinter
Guest
Yes, and Luke does not refute. Mary and Joseph had no biological children together, so end game, they were not open to children.
For all we know that tidbit of information could have been fabricated to give the Bible some credibility or at least give the Catholic Church some credibility in it’s Doctrine.
It becomes rather suspect.
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RidgeSprinter
Guest
Really ? It is not an edict. Read it again.
is a prelude statement to what God would do 1:25
Matt 19:12 no relevance
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RidgeSprinter
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anon91549587
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ok . Gen 1:22 cheese burgers.
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RidgeSprinter
Guest
Catholic Apologists use the verses I gave earlier.
Gen 1:22 does not relate and is not relevant. And it’s not like the critters actually heard God. All God’s words did was invoke the mating urges and set the pheromones in play.
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Anesti33
Guest
My friend, you don’t understand what it means to be “Open to children” or “Open to life”.
Luke 1:38 “Let it be done to me according to your word.” – Mary is open to conceiving Jesus
“Hail Mary… blessed is the fruit of thy womb, Jesus” – Mary is fruitful and multiplies
Matthew 1:24 “When Joseph woke from sleep, he did as the angel of the Lord commanded him; he took his wife…” – Joseph gratefully accepts Jesus and adopts Him as his foster son.
Mary and Joseph set the gold standard for openness to children. It is Mary that we encourage mothers to imitate, when she conforms her will perfectly to that of God’s. Our doctrine does not tell us how many children a couple should bear, nor how they should come by those children, just that they should welcome children into their families, raise them in the faith, and cherish them as if they are the offspring of their one-flesh union.
Luke 1:38 “Let it be done to me according to your word.” – Mary is open to conceiving Jesus
“Hail Mary… blessed is the fruit of thy womb, Jesus” – Mary is fruitful and multiplies
Matthew 1:24 “When Joseph woke from sleep, he did as the angel of the Lord commanded him; he took his wife…” – Joseph gratefully accepts Jesus and adopts Him as his foster son.
Mary and Joseph set the gold standard for openness to children. It is Mary that we encourage mothers to imitate, when she conforms her will perfectly to that of God’s. Our doctrine does not tell us how many children a couple should bear, nor how they should come by those children, just that they should welcome children into their families, raise them in the faith, and cherish them as if they are the offspring of their one-flesh union.
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RidgeSprinter
Guest
Mary was told it was going to happen.
Mary was not open.
Then she complied with her “fiat”.
Joseph definitely was not open.
He was going to put her way until divine intervention.
Mary and Joseph did not have Sex.
They did not have a biological child together.
They were not open to having biological children together.
And in the Judaic Tradition there was no Validity in the Marriage. It is the right of the woman to consummate and the duty of the husband to consummate.
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Anesti33
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EugeneCharles
Guest
Good day!
You have a very challenging question. I believe that because of Joseph’s dream it isn’t possible that they have an intercourse and that is why we call St. Joseph as the chaste spouse of the virgin.Joseph understand the situation. I think that it can be considered valid because God had granted His permission and because a true love isn’t about having intercourse, two people marry because they love one another. I would like to share a prayer which Tobias prayed before sleeping with Sarah:
When the girl’s parents left the bedroom and closed the door behind them, Tobiah arose from bed and said to his wife, “My love, get up. Let us pray and beg our Lord to have mercy on us and to grant us deliverance.”
She got up, and they started to pray and beg that deliverance might be theirs.
He began with these words:
“Blessed are you, O God of our fathers;
praised be your name forever and ever.
Let the heavens and all your creation praise you forever.
You made Adam and you gave him
his wife Eve to be his help and support;
and from these two the human race descended.
You said, ‘It is not good for the man to be alone;
let us make him a partner like himself.’
Now, Lord, you know that I take this
wife of mine not because of lust,
but for a noble purpose.
Call down your mercy on me and on her,
and allow us to live together to a happy old age.”
They said together, “Amen, amen,”
-Tobit 8: 4-8 NAB
You have a very challenging question. I believe that because of Joseph’s dream it isn’t possible that they have an intercourse and that is why we call St. Joseph as the chaste spouse of the virgin.Joseph understand the situation. I think that it can be considered valid because God had granted His permission and because a true love isn’t about having intercourse, two people marry because they love one another. I would like to share a prayer which Tobias prayed before sleeping with Sarah:
When the girl’s parents left the bedroom and closed the door behind them, Tobiah arose from bed and said to his wife, “My love, get up. Let us pray and beg our Lord to have mercy on us and to grant us deliverance.”
She got up, and they started to pray and beg that deliverance might be theirs.
He began with these words:
“Blessed are you, O God of our fathers;
praised be your name forever and ever.
Let the heavens and all your creation praise you forever.
You made Adam and you gave him
his wife Eve to be his help and support;
and from these two the human race descended.
You said, ‘It is not good for the man to be alone;
let us make him a partner like himself.’
Now, Lord, you know that I take this
wife of mine not because of lust,
but for a noble purpose.
Call down your mercy on me and on her,
and allow us to live together to a happy old age.”
They said together, “Amen, amen,”
-Tobit 8: 4-8 NAB
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tuffsmurf
Guest
Why would they need to stay virgins in order to be disciples of Jesus? St. Peter was most likely not and he became the first pope.
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tuffsmurf
Guest
Of course it’s ideal to marry someone because you love them (although historically and even at present it is not always the case), but I love many people; my parents, my siblings, close friends, etc. Marital love is unique because of the sexual aspect.
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acanonlawyer
Guest
They followed it at least as much as their Son did. And so…?
Generally, it seems to me that your claims (in other posts) do not follow sound argumentation or show an understanding of what certain phrases actually mean (e.g. “open to children” doesn’t mean what it seems you think it means). I suggest you do further study on these topics. Catholic Answers should have good resources to get you started.
Dan
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Dan_Defender
Guest
I never said they needed to. But there would be nothing surprising if they did. It was a unique time in history.
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EugeneCharles
Guest
Hi tuffsmurt! Yes! I agreed with your view!!! 
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