Mary everywhere?

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RomanRyan1088

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Ok, i have this friend, who says that all the times mary has appeared to us, like in Fatima and in Guadalupe, that that is works of the devil and not of God. She said that in the bible it says that the devil can appear like an angel, and that the Devil is trying to get us to follow him. What can i say to convince her that this truly is Mary and not works of the Devil.
 
Ask your friend to reference something in particular that he/she would consider a work of the devil.

One he/she references this point, research it to find out the validity of it and whether it is contrary to Church teaching. Someone on the boards can help you in referencing the point your freind is contesting with you.
 
Some Marian apparitions, such as Fatima and Guadalupe, are accepted by the Church.
Others, such as those in Bayside NY, and Necedah Wisc. were specifically disapproved by the local bishop, who has authority over such matters.

Note that the Church does not require belief in any apparition, but does declare some worthy of belief. Others are specifically condemned. So you would need to investigate the claims of any particular apparition, and the best source would be the local diocese in which it is located.

JimG
 
If your friend is a protestant, you may want to use these scriptures:

1 John 4:1-3:

*Dear friends, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, because many false prophets have gone out into the world. This is how you can recognize the Spirit of God: Every spirit that acknowledges that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is from God, but every spirit that does not acknowledge Jesus is not from God. This is the spirit of the antichrist, which you have heard is coming and even now is already in the world.
*
The Church-approved Marian apparitions certainly pass muster here. Our Lady always points to Jesus Christ as Lord. I think this is consistent with the scripture’s description of a spirit from God.

Matthew 12:22-27

Then they brought him a demon-possessed man who was blind and mute, and Jesus healed him, so that he could both talk and see. All the people were astonished and said, “Could this be the Son of David?” But when the Pharisees heard this, they said, “It is only by Beelzebub, the prince of demons, that this fellow drives out demons.” Jesus knew their thoughts and said to them, "Every kingdom divided against itself will be ruined, and every city or household divided against itself will not stand. If Satan drives out Satan, he is divided against himself. How then can his kingdom stand? And if I drive out demons by Beelzebub, by whom do your people drive them out?

In the passage from Matthew, Jesus points out the devil would certainly not drive out his own demons.

In the Marian apparitions, I think we see a similar logic. Our Lady always points the way to Jesus Christ as the Son of God; this is inconsistent with your friend’s claim about the devil’s work. If the Marian apparitions are the work of the devil, why do they all point to Jesus Christ as Lord? I think your friend’s argument breaks down here as well.

Hope this helps, peace.
 
Just an afterthought on Our Lady of Guadalupe in particular. These appearances of Our Lady directly caused the a massive conversion of Mexican citizens to Christianity. Certainly this must be considered God’s work, absolutely not the work of the devil.
 
I would like to thank Chaffa55 for that post.

Now the question might be “is it possible for the devil to deceive us by appearing as Mary to us?”

I think so, we must still be on our guard. With the church’s approval I would be more inclined to think that the apparitions did not happen at all than to think that they were from the father of lies. The only reason I say this is that we are certainly permitted to doubt an apparition of Mary.

As incredible as it might seem there have always been Catholics who doubted some major apparitions like Fatima, Lourdes, Walsingham and Guadelupe. Such people, faithful to the Magisterium and in every other way devout, also have their place in the church. But to the idea that these major apparitions come from Satan I would say the church’s careful work (this is serious business) is intended to prevent that possibility.

Our church rejects hundreds of apparitions (or ignores them) every decade. That is not to say that we know all of them are not true but there is sufficient cause for doubt in the mind of the church. This process has served to protect us. Our Protestant friends may be sceptical, but if they could get beyond their understandable scepticism and realize that it’s OK to have certain doubts they might find that Faith and Reason are compatible in the church and soften their stony hearts.

In Christ
Michael
 
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Hesychios:
Now the question might be “is it possible for the devil to deceive us by appearing as Mary to us?”

I think so, we must still be on our guard. With the church’s approval I would be more inclined to think that the apparitions did not happen at all than to think that they were from the father of lies. The only reason I say this is that we are certainly permitted to doubt an apparition of Mary.
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Michael, I agree with everything you’ve said. We really do need to count on the Church’s guidance in these matters; certainly not on our own judgement. I don’t know for certain, but I imagine the Church uses the standard of 1 John 4:1-3 (among other standards) in verifying Marian apparitions. Your admonition to “…be on our guard…” is good advice indeed. Peace and best regards.
 
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