Mary Is Just A Dead Lady

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Mary Is Just A Dead Lady… A phrase I have heard several times from Bible thumpers of various sorts… Martin Luther, John Calvin and the main Protestant reformers all taught the Marian Dogmas for the most part; thus, they didn’t leave the Church due to the Marian Dogmas… Now, does anyone know when this “Mary is just a dead lady stuff started?” My guess is that it’s somewhere between 10 and 50 years old, does anyone out there know for sure???
 
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maesoph:
Mary Is Just A Dead Lady… A phrase I have heard several times from Bible thumpers of various sorts… Martin Luther, John Calvin and the main Protestant reformers all taught the Marian Dogmas for the most part; thus, they didn’t leave the Church due to the Marian Dogmas… Now, does anyone know when this “Mary is just a dead lady stuff started?” My guess is that it’s somewhere between 10 and 50 years old, does anyone out there know for sure???
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Must be a local thang. I’ve heard plenty of ignorant anti-Catholic crudities, but this particualar phrase is a new one on me. Consider the source, I always say.
 
If someone says this again, ask them why we bother remembering ANY notable historical figure. I mean, George Washington, Adolph Hitler, Ronald Reagan, Napoleon, JPII… all “just dead men.”
Or a slightly different approach- If Jesus’ own mother is not to be given proper respect and reverence for her role in Jesus’ life and has earned no special seat in heaven either, what does that say for our own insignificant, sinful existence??
And if you have scriptural documentation handy, you could say, “Well, technically, Jesus is just a dead man.” and then when they counter it with news of the resurrection and ascencion, you can likewise counter Mary being a dead lady with the assumption.
 
Would the person like it if you talked about thier mother that way? How does God feel when you disrespect his mother?

I think the “lets condemn Mary” started with the Fundamentalists movement in the early 1900’s as a result of some Bible communities feling like their Protestant Communities were becoming too liberal. They wanted to stick to the “core” beliefs as Christians. Just a guess though!
 
I have never heard the phrase. I would have to be very restrained if someone said that to my face. As was said previously, it is very disrespectful.
 
Just to be fair, Martin Luther maintained his devotion to the blessed Virgin even after he left the Church.
 
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kp1:
I think the “lets condemn Mary” started with the Fundamentalists movement in the early 1900’s as a result of some Bible communities feling like their Protestant Communities were becoming too liberal. They wanted to stick to the “core” beliefs as Christians. Just a guess though!
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That’s my guess also. Between the two extremes of the fundementalists and the modernists, Mary got taken out of the majority of Protestant doctrine.
 
Gee, I wonder if the recent “liberation” aka degradation of women is due, at least in part, to the lack of Marian Dogmas???
 
WOW. . .I’ve never heard that one before! Actually what surprises me most is that it is something uttered by someone who thinks themselves to be Christian!

As a Christian, I believe (per Scripture and Church teaching) that those who die in Christ have eternal LIFE in him. I would not say anyone “is just a dead person” if I thought they were living eternally with God! And I think that goes for Mary, too.
 
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maesoph:
Gee, I wonder if the recent “liberation” aka degradation of women is due, at least in part, to the lack of Marian Dogmas???
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I read somewhere that when non-Catholic Christians rejected Mary they were left with Eve as the representative for women, and Eve, being responsible for the loss of paradise is looked down on, not looked up to.
 
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Fidelis:
Must be a local thang. I’ve heard plenty of ignorant anti-Catholic crudities, but this particualar phrase is a new one on me. Consider the source, I always say.
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An Anglo-Catholic priest was complaining about the idea in 1938 - see “The Mystery Of Mary” by Bede Frost. 😃​

It is absurd - it implies that the Body of Christ is partly a corpse.

The reason a lot of people say is that their notion of death is still that of the OT - whereas the Resurrection has changed death: for all purposes that really matter, He “has abolished death”:
  • 2Ti 1:6 Hence I remind you to rekindle the gift of God that is within you through the laying on of my hands;
  • 2Ti 1:7 for God did not give us a spirit of timidity but a spirit of power and love and self-control.
  • 2Ti 1:8 Do not be ashamed then of testifying to our Lord, nor of me his prisoner, but share in suffering for the gospel in the power of God,
  • 2Ti 1:9 who saved us and called us with a holy calling, not in virtue of our works but in virtue of his own purpose and the grace which he gave us in Christ Jesus ages ago,
  • 2Ti 1:10 and now has manifested through the appearing of our Saviour Christ Jesus, who abolished death and brought life and immortality to light through the gospel.
Now that, is good news - death is abolished: it’s irrelevant. So how can Christians be expected to bother with it. The notion that it can separate those who are in Christ from Him, or from one another, is quite simply incredible. If death can separate the Blessed from their Saviour, He is no Saviour - if it can separate those who are in Him from one another, when distance & language cannot, He is not to be called Our Life: because those who are alive, live. As He is called “Our Life” by St. Paul, separation by death is impossible:
  • Col 3:1 If then you have been raised with Christ, seek the things that are above, where Christ is, seated at the right hand of God.
  • Col 3:2 Set your minds on things that are above, not on things that are on earth.
  • Col 3:3 For you have died, and your life is hid with Christ in God.
  • Col 3:4 When Christ who is our life appears, then you also will appear with him in glory.
  • Col 3:5 Put to death therefore what is earthly in you: fornication, impurity, passion, evil desire, and covetousness, which is idolatry. my emphases]
Dying & death are for *this *world - not the next.

The idea that Mary is or could or can be dead, is completely incompatible with the NT - there is no such thing as a dead Christian: they’re even rarer than flying pigs. If Mary is “in Christ”, it’s impossible for her to be dead unless Christ is the bringer of death - but what Christian is going to think that ? He would bring death, only if God brought death - but that could only be true if God were entirely different from the God of the Bible, Who is the Living God. IOW, because God is as He is, Mary, like everyone else in Christ, is alive in Christ with His own Life. ##
 
I would guess that anti-Christian phrase began just after December 8, 1854. Why? Because Protestants define themselves by being “ANTI-CATHOLIC!” That was the year Pope Pius the IX declared the Immaculate Conception. Of course we also had the Perpetual Viginity of Mary declared in 1854 by Pope Pius XII. (I hope those dates and Popes are correct?)

Remember that dribble about the ‘siblings’ of Jesus? Guess when it started? If you guess after 1854 you’d be correct too. Why? Because it’s the anti-Catholic thing to do. Anti-Catholics have to invent "ME"ology to prove the Church wrong. They sure won’t little things like facts stand in their way.
 
I have been in fundamentalist churches and this is a new one on me. Wow! I would guess that this would be offensive to even most fundamentalists.
 
I forget which “This Rock” it was but it was some years ago. Perhaps 2001, that had a statement written by Martin Luther concerning his thoughts on Mary. He gave Mary the upmost respect and thought well of her. His words deffinately regarded her as more than some dead lady.

Of course the protestants your hearing this from might of more Calvinist stock rather than Lutheran.
 
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