Mary is only an incubator

[srdxfit]

My Parish Priest removed our picture of Mary and the votive candles that were in place for prayer and veneration. I recently asked if he had ever considered giving a Primer in Marian Theology to our parish. He seemed almost insulted. he actually said that Mary was only an incubator!!! He firmly said that he was a “Priest of the Trinity ONLY” and that Jesus was the ONLY mediator. Period. End of discussion. I was shocked, especially since our Parish is in the heart of the California Missions! I don’t understand how a Catholic priest can be ordained that has this view of the Mother of God! His position seems Protestant to me! Is his position heretical or is this a pastoral problem or both.

Concerned in California!

 

[MichaelHowling]

If he truly believes what he says…it’s a serious problem and I think you need to talk to your bishop. It’s definatley heretical talk for a priest to say and mean such a thing. It goes against common sense, the early church fathers and the churches position on mary.

It’s also a pastoral problem by denying the truths the church teaches of Mary and possibly hindering the laity at your parish a relationship with their Mother.

 

[YoungTradCath]

This is extremely wrong. You must write your bishop. Use facts, not feelings.

 

[JReducation]

My Parish Priest removed our picture of Mary and the votive candles that were in place for prayer and veneration. I recently asked if he had ever considered giving a Primer in Marian Theology to our parish. He seemed almost insulted. he actually said that Mary was only an incubator!!! He firmly said that he was a “Priest of the Trinity ONLY” and that Jesus was the ONLY mediator. Period. End of discussion. I was shocked, especially since our Parish is in the heart of the California Missions! I don’t understand how a Catholic priest can be ordained that has this view of the Mother of God! His position seems Protestant to me! Is his position heretical or is this a pastoral problem or both.

Concerned in California!

That little bit that you shared is not heresy, but it’s walking a very fine line. One would have to ask what dogmas about Mary he accepts. One does not have to accept that which is not dogmatic. But the dogma has to be accepted and taught.

Even more important that his statement about Mary is his statement about the ministerial priesthood. That one is very incomplete.

Are sure that you heard him correctly or that he’s not going through something?

 

[Mrs_Sally]

My Parish Priest removed our picture of Mary and the votive candles that were in place for prayer and veneration. I recently asked if he had ever considered giving a Primer in Marian Theology to our parish. He seemed almost insulted. he actually said that Mary was only an incubator!!! He firmly said that he was a “Priest of the Trinity ONLY” and that Jesus was the ONLY mediator. Period. End of discussion. I was shocked, especially since our Parish is in the heart of the California Missions! I don’t understand how a Catholic priest can be ordained that has this view of the Mother of God! His position seems Protestant to me! Is his position heretical or is this a pastoral problem or both.

Concerned in California!

Speak to him again - make an appointment to speak in person, not right after Mass. Ask him to explain what he said about Mary because you are confused and shocked by it. Then after that conversation, if he says the same things again, document it for the bishop. Ask him to clear up the confusion for you.

YoungTradCatholic is right to say use facts, not feelings. State only what you asked and what his responses are. It doesn’t matter if you are in CA or anywhere else. And it isn’t helpful to say that he is being protestant.

The impression he is giving is wrong and should be corrected, but the best way of doing that is by being straightforward and charitable and not cloud the issue with extraneous opinions.

 

[malambo]

If you call his own mother an incubator, will he not feel offended? To call Mary an incubator is an insult to Mary and to Jesus Christ, her son. Elizabeth, guided by the Holy Spirit, recognized her as “the mother of the Lord”. That much is proclaimed very clearly in the Gospel (Lk 1:43).
Jesus Christ is the only mediator. That is true. But you should remember that he entrusted to his disciples his ministry and his mission. He is King, and we are kings with him. He his prophet, and we share in that. He is the High Priest, and we have a stake in that priesthood. If that applies to us, it does much more so to the mother of the Lord. If we pray for each other and expect God to listen to our prayers, much more so can Mary, the mother of the Lord, pray for us. If Jesus was ready to grant her request for wine, he will be even more ready to grant us grace, life and salvation, when his mother asks for them.

 

[rcwitness]

Speak to him again - make an appointment to speak in person, not right after Mass. Ask him to explain what he said about Mary because you are confused and shocked by it. Then after that conversation, if he says the same things again, document it for the bishop. Ask him to clear up the confusion for you.

YoungTradCatholic is right to say use facts, not feelings. State only what you asked and what his responses are. It doesn’t matter if you are in CA or anywhere else. And it isn’t helpful to say that he is being protestant.

The impression he is giving is wrong and should be corrected, but the best way of doing that is by being straightforward and charitable and not cloud the issue with extraneous opinions.

I agree with this approach very much! I am not one to hold devotion to Mary. But this language (incubator) is not how we should reduce His faithfull mother. It seems less than a temple of the HS.
But give your priest the respect to let him explain himself. It may have come out this way because of frustration from something that caused temporary irrational reaction.

 

[Khalid]

If he believes what he says, and said it, he’s better off preaching in the local Fundamentalists United for the Bible Against Romanism (FUBAR) church, and is by no means an orthodox Catholic. Not to put too fine a point on it, but he’s a heretic. He doesn’t have to have a devotion to the Blessed Virgin, but he must recognize the Church’s Marian dogmata and recognize the right of others to have said devotion: disparaging the Virgin Mother in such offensive terms is heresy.

This is one of the situations I would recommend immediate contact of his bishop.

 

[Juditsze]

I tend to agree with Mrs Sally about asking for an appointment and in a non-threatening way requesting to clear up the confusion. It also came to my mind that there is a passage in the Bible about talking to someone first in private, then together with one or two witnesses and only then go to the Church authority, so you may want to follow these steps before writing to the bishop.

 

[Pilosopo]

Chiming in with the rest. Do go to his superiors or the bishop.
It’s a hundredfold harmful that it should come from a priest.
I feel certain that there are others in you parish who are just as well offended (shocked perhaps is more like it). While we not a democracy, we are a community.
Hope the matter changes for better, sooner than later.

 

[red85]

Christ did warn in a private revelation not to openly rebuke the priest. Only He has the authority to correct His priest (via the bishops, of course).

I would share with your bishop your concerns. Your pastor’s view of Mary (Lord, have mercy on him) as only a incubator is definitely out of line with Catholic teachings.

 

[ChibiViolet]

My Parish Priest removed our picture of Mary and the votive candles that were in place for prayer and veneration. I recently asked if he had ever considered giving a Primer in Marian Theology to our parish. He seemed almost insulted. he actually said that Mary was only an incubator!!! He firmly said that he was a “Priest of the Trinity ONLY” and that Jesus was the ONLY mediator. Period. End of discussion. I was shocked, especially since our Parish is in the heart of the California Missions! I don’t understand how a Catholic priest can be ordained that has this view of the Mother of God! His position seems Protestant to me! Is his position heretical or is this a pastoral problem or both.

Concerned in California!

What a HORRIBLE insult! I would be upset if a *non-Catholic *talked to me like that! Or at least REPULSED or DEEPLY saddened. NO ONE should be talked about that way. NO ONE is “only an incubater,” but the fact that he’s a Catholic priest talking about OUR HOLY MOTHER makes it all the more disturbing.

Certainly Blessed Mary is not to be idolized, but really? “A human incubater…?”

On the other hand, he may have become scrupulous after reading a bunch of Protestant material or something…

DEFINATELY tell your Bishop **as soon as possible. **

 

[Jennifoo]

Scary.

 

[NeedImprovement]

If you call his own mother an incubator, will he not feel offended? . . .

• Kind of along the same lines as I was thinking . . . . . . I know I always tried to get my own , um, incubator some beautiful flowers when Mother’s Day came around.

That one word just seems to carry a natural abrasion and coldness when used that way. Try substituting it for the word “Mother” in the Gospel of John [19:25-27] and look at what we get (all text except substitution in italics taken from the DRV):

Now there stood by the cross of Jesus, his* incubator*, and his incubator’s sister, Mary of Cleophas, and Mary Magdalen.

When Jesus therefore had seen his incubator and the disciple standing whom he loved, he saith to his incubator: Woman, behold thy son. After that, he saith to the disciple: Behold thy incubator. And from that hour, the disciple took her to his own.

uch:

As Br. JR points out, he might be going through something. There is certainly a large selection of things one might be going through and there can be any number of factors involved.

Sometimes it is even we the parishoners, who in our zeal, can inavertently exert pressure which might cause such a reaction or contribute to forming a particular attitude in the long run. Some priests are happy to speak with someone about anything directly before or after Mass. Others I’ve known , make it a point of vacating the sacristy as soon as possible after Mass . . . because some people’s behaviour can make them end up feeling trapped .

We need to continue to to pray for all our priests.

Yet I am still left wondering about those actual words which were spoken , because what they convey doesn’t even appear to be totally congruent from a medical or scientific perspective. Here are several medical definitions of an incubator:

Definitions from medical-dictionary.thefreedictionary.com/incubator

**in·cu·ba·tor ** n.

1. An apparatus in which environmental conditions, such as temperature and humidity, can be controlled, often used for growing bacterial cultures, hatching eggs artificially, or providing suitable conditions for a chemical or biological reaction.
2. An apparatus for maintaining an infant, especially a premature infant, in an environment of controlled temperature, humidity, and oxygen concentration.

The American Heritage® Medical Dictionary Copyright © 2007, 2004 by Houghton Mifflin Company. Published by Houghton Mifflin Company. All rights reserved

---

incubator

an apparatus used to provide a controlled environment, especially temperature. Other environmental components, such as darkness, light, oxygen, moisture, and dryness, may also be controlled, as in an incubator for the cultivation of eggs or microorganisms in a laboratory or an incubator for premature infants.

Mosby’s Medical Dictionary, 8th edition. © 2009, Elsevier

The definition - as it applies to human beings, is almost always associated with a child who is premature. We know that with Jesus, this connotation isn’t plausible ; since in Galatians 4:4, St. Paul tells us that

In the fullness of time, God sent His Son, born of a woman .

 

[PJM]

=srdxfit;10291102]My Parish Priest removed our picture of Mary and the votive candles that were in place for prayer and veneration. I recently asked if he had ever considered giving a Primer in Marian Theology to our parish. He seemed almost insulted. he actually said that Mary was only an incubator!!! He firmly said that he was a “Priest of the Trinity ONLY” and that Jesus was the ONLY mediator. Period. End of discussion. I was shocked, especially since our Parish is in the heart of the California Missions! I don’t understand how a Catholic priest can be ordained that has this view of the Mother of God! His position seems Protestant to me! Is his position heretical or is this a pastoral problem or both.

Concerned in California!

In ADDITION to much prayer for this priest; I would send this idential information to your Bishop. Obviously there is a urgent ned for Catechesis and Instruction here that was lacking in his Priestly Formation.

This REALLY is something you should do. And it’s not something that should be discussed with others for fear of sining through Gossip and ruinging his good name.

God Bless you,
Pat/PJM

 

[Zekariya]

I’ve heard protestants call the Mother of God, a “vessel”. For some reason “incubator” sounds a lot worse than “vessel”. I would never call my biological mother an incubator.

 

[theistgal]

I too live in the “land of the California missions” and unfortunately, this sort of thing happens a lot out here - one of the reasons I turned to the Eastern Catholic churches. You would not see a priest getting away with something like that for more than about 5 SECONDS in our church!

 

[HelenRose]

My Parish Priest removed our picture of Mary and the votive candles that were in place for prayer and veneration. I recently asked if he had ever considered giving a Primer in Marian Theology to our parish. He seemed almost insulted. he actually said that Mary was only an incubator!!! He firmly said that he was a “Priest of the Trinity ONLY” and that Jesus was the ONLY mediator. Period. End of discussion. I was shocked, especially since our Parish is in the heart of the California Missions! I don’t understand how a Catholic priest can be ordained that has this view of the Mother of God! His position seems Protestant to me! Is his position heretical or is this a pastoral problem or both.

Concerned in California!

Ask him if he believes that his own mother was an incubator and nothing more to him.

 

[HelenRose]

I’ve heard protestants call the Mother of God, a “vessel”. For some reason “incubator” sounds a lot worse than “vessel”. I would never call my biological mother an incubator.

My thought exactly.

 

[CaptFun]

CaptFun responds in BLUE (and Red)

My Parish Priest removed our picture of Mary and the votive candles that were in place for prayer and veneration. I recently asked if he had ever considered giving a Primer in Marian Theology to our parish. He seemed almost insulted. he actually said that Mary was only an incubator!!! He firmly said that he was a “Priest of the Trinity ONLY” and that Jesus was the ONLY mediator. Period. End of discussion. I was shocked, especially since our Parish is in the heart of the California Missions! I don’t understand how a Catholic priest can be ordained that has this view of the Mother of God! His position seems Protestant to me! Is his position heretical or is this a pastoral problem or both.

Concerned in California!

http://us.cdn2.123rf.com/168nwm/zatletic/zatletic0910/zatletic091000422/5792048-nativity-scene.jpg

Well I hope this is an urban legend. Is there anything that might explain this (in a Blessed are the Peacemakers’ vein)?

– Are there actually some in the Parish that have the problem of setting the Trinity completely aside in favor of Mary? **

– Are people facing that picture all during Mass and not participating in the covenant sacrifice or something?

That would be VERY rare if it happens at all - and I’ve never really SEEN anything like that – but if it DID maybe his baffling actions would have some logic to them.

The story sounds plausible though. And good counsel has been given by others here as to ways to approach the problem with grace, charity …*** and if necessary resolve.***

Be it urban legend – or a real incident … it has inspired my poetic muse to advocate on behalf of a healthy devotion to our Blessed Mother.

Mary is only …**

In a Catholic Church (to the side) is a shrine to the mother of Jesus you see –
Who said “Yes” to His call and then gave Him her all – in her “Let it be done unto me!”

But a local Church Pastor is taking away any vestige of praise to her now?
Has he taken the picture and candles away? Has he said with an angry brow:

“I’m a priest of the Holy Trinity ALONE" - - and (though I don’t THINK that he hate her) …
Dear Mary whom I call my Mother so dear – he called “ … only an incubator?!”

But I read in the Bible her crown’s made of stars …
and she’s clothed with the sun now and more …

The moon’s at her feet and her seed will defeat – the dragon, though Satan may roar.

And if God has her crowned up in heaven above, and “on earth as in heaven’s” His plan
I will pray and tell her – thank you for – her part in the Savior’s plan.

The Father sent Gabriel, mouth full of praise, that HIS Son would soon be HER Son too.
And the Holy Spirit through Eliz-a-beth called her “Mother of (my) Lord,” so true.

So a GOOD Pastor of THE Trinity … ought to follow the lead of those three
and heap love and honor – and praises upon her - instead of “…*** have enmity!***”

And where Mary’s concerned, that is good for us all, if we don’t know how to feel … and
we’ll be more like Jesus who honored His Mother - than Satan who hates her with zeal.

http://www.rejonesconsulting.com/Revelation/Allred_large/Rev12AWoman.JPG

A representation of Revelation Chapter 12.
The Crowned Virgin and the Dragon.