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croix_de_fer
Guest
Muslims also believe Mary was a virgin and remained a virgin after the birth of Jesus. Interestingly, Mohamed’s daughter was named Fatimah.
MARY-Mother of God--Theotókos-God-bearer-The one who gives birth to God
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Byzantine_Wolf
Guest
They also believe she gave birth to Jesus under a palm tree (S. 19:23).
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MartinJordan
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GaryTaylor
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Yup, I’m solidly on the affirmative side of everything the Catholic Faith has taught about Our Lady.
Not a doubt in my mind about it. Matter of fact I believe what St Louis de Montfort had to say.
St Louis de Montfort, “The Secret of Mary”
In adopting this devotion, we put our graces merits and virtues into safe keeping by making Mary the depositary of them. It is as if we said to her, “See, my dear Mother, here is the good that I have done through the grace of your dear Son. I am not capable of keeping it, because of my weakness and inconstancy, and also because so many wicked enemies are assailing me day and night. Alas, every day we see cedars of Lebanon fall into the mire, and eagles which had soared towards the sun become birds of darkness, a thousand of the just falling to the left and ten thousand to the right. But, most powerful Queen, hold me fast lest I fall. Keep a guard on all my possessions lest I be robbed of them. I entrust all I have to you, for I know well who you are, and that is why I confide myself entirely to you. You are faithful to God and man, and you will not suffer anything I entrust to you to perish. You are powerful, and nothing can harm you or rob you of anything you hold.” “When you follow Mary you will not go astray; when you pray to her, you will not despair; when your mind is on her, you will not wander; when she holds you up, you will not fall; when she protects you, you will have no fear; when she guides you, you will feel no fatigue; when she is on your side, you will arrive safely home” (Saint Bernard). And again, “She keeps her Son from striking us; she prevents the devil from harming us; she preserves virtue in us; she prevents our merits from being lost and our graces from receding.” These words of St Bernard explain in substance all that I have said. Had I but this one motive to impel me to choose this devotion, namely, that of keeping me in the grace of God and increasing that grace in me, my heart would burn with longing for it.
God Bless, GT
Not a doubt in my mind about it. Matter of fact I believe what St Louis de Montfort had to say.
St Louis de Montfort, “The Secret of Mary”
In adopting this devotion, we put our graces merits and virtues into safe keeping by making Mary the depositary of them. It is as if we said to her, “See, my dear Mother, here is the good that I have done through the grace of your dear Son. I am not capable of keeping it, because of my weakness and inconstancy, and also because so many wicked enemies are assailing me day and night. Alas, every day we see cedars of Lebanon fall into the mire, and eagles which had soared towards the sun become birds of darkness, a thousand of the just falling to the left and ten thousand to the right. But, most powerful Queen, hold me fast lest I fall. Keep a guard on all my possessions lest I be robbed of them. I entrust all I have to you, for I know well who you are, and that is why I confide myself entirely to you. You are faithful to God and man, and you will not suffer anything I entrust to you to perish. You are powerful, and nothing can harm you or rob you of anything you hold.” “When you follow Mary you will not go astray; when you pray to her, you will not despair; when your mind is on her, you will not wander; when she holds you up, you will not fall; when she protects you, you will have no fear; when she guides you, you will feel no fatigue; when she is on your side, you will arrive safely home” (Saint Bernard). And again, “She keeps her Son from striking us; she prevents the devil from harming us; she preserves virtue in us; she prevents our merits from being lost and our graces from receding.” These words of St Bernard explain in substance all that I have said. Had I but this one motive to impel me to choose this devotion, namely, that of keeping me in the grace of God and increasing that grace in me, my heart would burn with longing for it.
God Bless, GT
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croix_de_fer
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Alexander_Roman
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In fact, “Christotokos” is a legitimate term in Catholicism as well since Christ is God Incarnate and the usage of this term by the Assyrian Catholic Church of the East does not pose any problem re: eventual union with Rome.
The Assyrian Church itself rejects “Nestorianism” as a whole and condemns it. Assyrians also object to being called “Nestorian” where that term means that “in Christ there are two ‘prosopa’ or persons.”
The distinction between “person” and “nature” is always a tricky one. The Eastern Orthodox and Oriental Orthodox were in ecumenical session talking about the “One Nature of God the Word Incarnate” until it dawned on both groups that for the Oriental Orthodox, the Greek word for “Nature” meant “Person.” In that case, there was no longer any problem, even though that one word divided them for 1800 years . . .
The Assyrian patriarch signed an agreed statement on Christology with Pope John Paul II at Rome - that should end the whole thing.
Calvin’s reaction to the term “Mother of God” was not a theological one. He accepted the truth of that phrase.
He himself was only concerned with the “idea” that somehow the Virgin Mary would be (and he believed was) considered to be “divine” as a result.
But just as our parents never qualify the statement that they are our parents “according to the flesh, but God created the soul,” so too the Virgin Mary gave birth to a Divine Person.
She participated in the Divine Incarnation of our Lord both physically and spiritually, as a result of her holiness bestowed on her by the Holy Spirit whose Temple she always was. And that was not for anything she did, but for the exalted role she played in the plan of Redemption.
The Body of Jesus by which He preached, performed miracles, and died on the Cross was taken from the flesh and blood of the Virgin Mary. She offered her Son for the worship of the shepherds and wise men at Bethlehem, placed him in the arms of Simeon to fulfill the promise to him that he would not taste death until he saw the Messiah, looked sorrowfully for her Son in Jerusalem for three days until she received His reminder in the Temple that He must be about His Father’s work, told the people at the wedding - and all of us - to "do whatever He tells you without qualification, walked with her Son to Calvary and stood beneath His Cross, covered in His Blood that dripped from Him, and she was also anointed with the Holy Spirit at Pentecost becoming the Mother of the Church, the Body of Christ, and therefore our spiritual Mother who nurtures us and pushes us toward her Son, telling us too to “do whatever He tells you.”
Alex
The Assyrian Church itself rejects “Nestorianism” as a whole and condemns it. Assyrians also object to being called “Nestorian” where that term means that “in Christ there are two ‘prosopa’ or persons.”
The distinction between “person” and “nature” is always a tricky one. The Eastern Orthodox and Oriental Orthodox were in ecumenical session talking about the “One Nature of God the Word Incarnate” until it dawned on both groups that for the Oriental Orthodox, the Greek word for “Nature” meant “Person.” In that case, there was no longer any problem, even though that one word divided them for 1800 years . . .
The Assyrian patriarch signed an agreed statement on Christology with Pope John Paul II at Rome - that should end the whole thing.
Calvin’s reaction to the term “Mother of God” was not a theological one. He accepted the truth of that phrase.
He himself was only concerned with the “idea” that somehow the Virgin Mary would be (and he believed was) considered to be “divine” as a result.
But just as our parents never qualify the statement that they are our parents “according to the flesh, but God created the soul,” so too the Virgin Mary gave birth to a Divine Person.
She participated in the Divine Incarnation of our Lord both physically and spiritually, as a result of her holiness bestowed on her by the Holy Spirit whose Temple she always was. And that was not for anything she did, but for the exalted role she played in the plan of Redemption.
The Body of Jesus by which He preached, performed miracles, and died on the Cross was taken from the flesh and blood of the Virgin Mary. She offered her Son for the worship of the shepherds and wise men at Bethlehem, placed him in the arms of Simeon to fulfill the promise to him that he would not taste death until he saw the Messiah, looked sorrowfully for her Son in Jerusalem for three days until she received His reminder in the Temple that He must be about His Father’s work, told the people at the wedding - and all of us - to "do whatever He tells you without qualification, walked with her Son to Calvary and stood beneath His Cross, covered in His Blood that dripped from Him, and she was also anointed with the Holy Spirit at Pentecost becoming the Mother of the Church, the Body of Christ, and therefore our spiritual Mother who nurtures us and pushes us toward her Son, telling us too to “do whatever He tells you.”
Alex
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Alexander_Roman
Guest
In fact, during the apparitions of Our Lady at Zeitun in Egypt, many Muslims came out to praise the Virgin Mary and they also brought expensive prayer rugs that they rolled onto the sandy paths in front of the Cathedral over which the Mother of God was appearing.
I’ve no doubt that Our Lady of Fatima was a sign of blessing to the Muslims as well.
Alex
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revkevin
Guest
Would it be safe to say that Mary is the Mother of the Trinity? Because all 3 are 1.
Father, Son and Holy Spirit. If she is the Mother of God and Jesus, she must also be the Mother of the Holy Spirit.
Father, Son and Holy Spirit. If she is the Mother of God and Jesus, she must also be the Mother of the Holy Spirit.
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Byzantine_Wolf
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Absolutely…if we were Modalists.
The Incarnate Word contained the fullness of God, but was still distinct in Person. Only the Son became flesh. The Father did not become flesh, nor did the Holy Spirit become flesh. Saying she was Mother of the Trinity would therefore be misguided and erroneous.
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revkevin
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Ok, now the Father did not become flesh and the Holy Spirit did not either, only Jesus became flesh. So because Jesus became flesh who is God the Father in flesh and the Holy Spirit in flesh, because they are all one. How does it make her the Mother of God and Jesus and not the Holy Spirit. God is a spirit and the Holy Spirit is a spirit, the same spirit, remember they are one, all 3 are one. So to say that she is the Mother of one of the spirits and not the other spirit is to say that the Trinity don’t exist. How can she be the Mother of one spirit and not the other spirit when they are the same person. Different rolls but the same person.Absolutely…if we were Modalists.
The Incarnate Word contained the fullness of God, but was still distinct in Person. Only the Son became flesh. The Father did not become flesh, nor did the Holy Spirit become flesh. Saying she was Mother of the Trinity would therefore be misguided and erroneous.
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Byzantine_Wolf
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With all due respect, your Trinitarian definitions are very, very muddled.
First let’s establish some definitions and terms: Christians believe God is One Eternal Being revealed through three co-existent and co-eternal Persons: the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit. They are united by a common Essence. That has been orthodox Christian dogma for over 2000 years.
Now, at the Incarnation, the Second Person in the Trinity - the Son, or Eternal Word of God - became flesh. This is biblical as well: “And the Word became flesh and dwelt among us” (John 1:14). The Word - Jesus Christ - became flesh. Not the Father, not the Holy Spirit. You are confusing the concept that the Son is fully God with the terms Person and Being. Jesus is the Son within the Trinitarian God, and only the Son became flesh.
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revkevin
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Got ya.
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Byzantine_Wolf
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Cool, good.
God bless.
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Jimmy_B
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gcnuss
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Jimmy B;7007321**Does anybody here have a problem with St. Mary being referred to as [/quote said:
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Nine_Two
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When I was protestant I had some issues with the term “Mother of God”, since in my mind “God” meant the first person specifically.
Generally I think it is just a misunderstanding of trinitarian doctrine. It seems many (not all, probably not even most) evangelicals are actually tritheists, rather than trinitarians.
Generally I think it is just a misunderstanding of trinitarian doctrine. It seems many (not all, probably not even most) evangelicals are actually tritheists, rather than trinitarians.
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Jimmy_B
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Byzantine_Wolf
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Hey hey, you’re not the only one who can quote posts around here!
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Jimmy_B
Guest
I only re-post em , if I like em…
… I’ve re-posted some of yours in the past… I’m pretty sure… 
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CEM5
Guest
I have no problem with that. I firmly believe our blessed Mother, Mary, is the mother of God, after all, Jesus is her son, and He had two natures: fully human and fully divine, and since He is the second person of the Trinity, yes, He is God, therefore, Mary is mother of God.
blessings, :flowers:
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