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New_eve
Guest
I respect Mary very much, but can you explain why the assumption is a dogma of the church.
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fermat
Guest
It is a dogma of the church because it something that has been revealed to us from God, and it is something that is so critical to the understanding of Christ, that it must be held.
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ConstantineTG
Guest
Because what happened to Mary is the completion of the salvation that God promised man. For us who are worthy, we will get this same exact thing at the Final Judgement. Mary, being the Mother of God, was granted the privilege of being resurrected and assumed into heaven body and soul soon after her passing. Part of the reason too is because her body bore the flesh of God and thus it should be saved from corruption, thus resurrection and assumption into heaven soon after her passing.
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Deconi
Guest
The same reason the Church says that The Bible is the word of God!
The Church declares that both are dogma!
Accept both or deny both.
Pretty simple.
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bmullins
Guest
There has been enough evidence in writings and tradition to make it certain to the church that the revelation is from God and is truth. That’s how dogma gets there.
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TimothyH
Guest
This is absolutely correct, and not only that, but the revelation had become so clear and urging so strong, that the Church had to respond.
It’s worth reading the apostolic constitution from Pope Pius XII which formally declared the dogma, MUNIFICENTISSIMUS DEUS in full. In it the Holy Father answers the OP’s question directly, how it came to be dogma. He explains, without mentioning specific instances, but explains how understanding had grown to such a point, and that the Church had been urged to the point where the issue had to be addressed:
During the course of time such postulations and petitions did not decrease but rather grew continually in number and in urgency. In this cause there were pious crusades of prayer. Many outstanding theologians eagerly and zealously carried out investigations on this subject either privately or in public ecclesiastical institutions and in other schools where the sacred disciplines are taught. Marian Congresses, both national and international in scope, have been held in many parts of the Catholic world. These studies and investigations have brought out into even clearer light the fact that the dogma of the Virgin Mary’s Assumption into heaven is contained in the deposit of Christian faith entrusted to the Church. They have resulted in many more petitions, begging and urging the Apostolic See that this truth be solemnly defined.
The apostolic constitution is not long compared to most, and I think it will answer the OP’s question directly. It’s definitely worth reading.
-Tim-
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ConstantineTG
Guest
While this is true, it makes no sense for us to just accept and believe without understanding. Its praiseworthy for people to understand the doctrines of the Church.The same reason the Church says that The Bible is the word of God!
The Church declares that both are dogma!
Accept both or deny both.
Pretty simple.
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TimothyH
Guest
You know, I’m reading about this in the works of Diadochus of Photike, a 6th century bishop famous as the author of the earlierst writings known to have referenced the Jesus prayer.
…one ought to know that in the moment in which someone is spurred on by God to such a degree of love, he is elevated beyond faithy because when he reaches the very peaks of love; he now possess HIM in the keen sense of the heart who he first honored with Faith. The holy Apostile clearly preadches to us when he says, :So faith, hope, love remain, these three, but the greatest of these is love".
The point being, that faith leads to knowledge, and knowledge in turn leads to charity and love.
I think blind faith is just the start, just the beginning of a process which leads us to charity and love. Faith comes first, yes, without a doubt, but it is just the start. Was it St. Augustine who said, “faith preceedes understaning”? Through faith we will come to know God intimately and personally, and with that knowledge and understanding we cannot but love.
I think the point you make CTG is extremely important. The spiritually mature have moved past faith to the point where they are no longer in a state of blind faith, but can see and understand God clearly. To that end we should always ask for understanding, but should do so knowing that faith comes first.
-Tim-
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AmbroseSJ
Guest
Just playing devil’s advocate here; But I would also say that it DOES make sense for us to just accept and believe without understanding. Who can say they understand the Holy Trinity? God’s Infinite nature? and many other matters related to the next world and the Divinity. But the important point here, is that we accept in Faith these doctrines because Our Holy Mother Church has assured us that they are true. Wasn’t it St. Augustine who said he would never have believed the Bible if it weren’t for the Church saying it was true? Also it is written in the prophets that even fools would be kept on the path of Wisdom by the [Messiah’s] Church. (Forget the citation right now, Isaiah maybe.)
Understanding the Church’s doctrines is very important so that we don’t misunderstand the Divine Revelation. It is so sublime and transcendent, that the Church’s wording and definitions are very important to grasp even if we don’t fathom or understand them completely in this mortal life.
But I don’t mean to downplay TimothyH’s post which I whole heartedly agree with.
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New_eve
Guest
Thanks. I realize Catholics accept this. Good to understand it as well.
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ConstantineTG
Guest
I totally agree. And you are correct, there is always a starting point. Either we believe to understand, or understand to believe. We can’t have both from the beginning. I’m just saying we shouldn’t just sit pretty and say, “the Church says its De Fide, therefore I believe and that’s the end of it”. Because in learning and understanding, its not just scholastic work, it also helps us to reflect and contemplate on the truths presented to us so that we may grow further in our faith.
I believe it was declared a heresy to say that God is unknowable. For one thing there is revelation. Sure, we cannot know the fullness of God because he is infinite. But we have been given revelations from the Prophets and from God himself in the person of Jesus Christ so we should do our best to understand and learn as much of the revelations as we can. We don’t have to be in the level of St. Aquinas, but a good reading on the teachings of the Popes, Saints and Church Fathers would help us better grasp our faith. I think many Catholics are swayed to other faiths because of a lack of catechesis. When we fail to defend our beliefs within ourselves from polemics, we falter and often give in to conversion out of the Church.
We should have at least a good basic understanding of the core beliefs. Because we believe them for a purpose. For example, many people do not understand the significance of Mary’s Assumption to our own lives. We think that just because she’s the Mother of God, then she gets that privilege, thats it. But in fact the Assumption is a preview of what we can expect for ourselves if we die in faith and love of the Lord. At the end of time we will be resurrected and body and soul we will enter heaven.Understanding the Church’s doctrines is very important so that we don’t misunderstand the Divine Revelation. It is so sublime and transcendent, that the Church’s wording and definitions are very important to grasp even if we don’t fathom or understand them completely in this mortal life.
But I don’t mean to downplay TimothyH’s post which I whole heartedly agree with.
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ConstantineTG
Guest
Definitely! Faith shouldn’t be blind. I’m not saying that we should all be scholars of the faith. We can learn enough that the faith is coherent to us. God made revelations so that man doesn’t accept things blindly.
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AlltheRoses
Guest
The Assumption is a dogma of the Catholic Church because it represents the zenith of the salvation that Jesus promises and offers mankind. It shows a woman being lifted up, body and soul, to Heaven, and gives us hope that, by the grace of God, we may be lifted up in the same way. Like all the Marian dogmas, it is far more about Christ and his saving mission than it is about His Mother. Mary’s Assumption just points to what Jesus achieved for all humanity by His death and resurrection.
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New_eve
Guest
Thanks for this viewpoint.
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rdscheirer
Guest
I remember a few years ago we had a young Parochial Vicar who studied in Rome in the Vatican. He preached on the Feast of the Assumption and said- why is it in Rome there are 3 or 4 or 5 or even 6 skulls of John the Baptist displayed at different sites but there are no bones of Mary anywhere?
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ConstantineTG
Guest
Thank you for saying it way better than I could
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AlltheRoses
Guest
You’re welcome. I’m glad that I could help you understand (even if not agree with) the Catholic perspective on this. God bless you.
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AlltheRoses
Guest
Great minds think alike:thumbsup:Thank you for saying it way better than I could
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Deconi
Guest
(Emphasis mine.)
That line is what gave life to Protestantism.
Not disagreeing with you Con, but you suggest that you need to understand how a man with holes in him can walk through walls, come in, said hello and state he’s hungry!..sits down and eats a fish meal without leaking…before you can believe in Him?
In fact, why believe that account at all? Why believe scriptures? The Mohammedians have a scriptures too! As do the Israelites.
There is much in Holy Writ that we do not comprehend, as there is in Tradition.
Our faith is NOT blind. It is a revealed one. As such, we already know and accept that everything cannot be in writing because that’s what was revealed to us. Where? Scriptures! Why accept Sciptures? Because it is the word of God!
Says WHO?
…Back to square one.
Bottom line? You do not need to understand God, if you believe WHO He is!
In the same vein, you do not need to understand a dogma, once you know WHO proclaims it.
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