Mass for th Repose of the Soul of Osama Bin Laden???

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While we should pray for our enemies, and while it is likely that OBL is “down below,” where prayers for his soul won’t really do any good, I think it is in incredibly bad taste to announce publicly a Mass to pray for his ultimate salvation.

Also, I would ask how many Masses were offered for Adolf Hitler or Josef Stalin? I would wager “none.” And, yet, both of these men were baptized into the Catholic Church (I think Stalin even considered becoming a Priest), and would, arguably, be more entitled to have Masses offered for their souls than a Muslim whose driving force was the death of Chiristians.

If the Priest, or whoever, really wanted a Mass for Bin Laden, a small, private Mass, with the intention not made public, would have been the better course of action.
 
I disagree! God will understand? He won’t understand why we can’t pray for those who are our enemies.

[BIBLEDRB]Matthew 5:44-48[/BIBLEDRB]

This is an exercise in letting go of our pride. God doesn’t want hate between us and our enemies. He wants us to love unconditionally as He loves us unconditionally. He will judge Osama, not us.
I agree with your take. Jesus told us to love our enemies. That means that we cannot ever hope for his damnation. Praying for OBL is not easy, but then who ever said being a follower of Jesus was going to be easy. We must take up our cross every day.

Go to this Mass and pray ernestly for OBL’s salvation. You will be doing exactly as our Lord commanded you.

God bless you in this trial. And, please thank your family for their wonderful service to our country.
 
While we should pray for our enemies, and while it is likely that OBL is “down below,” where prayers for his soul won’t really do any good, I think it is in incredibly bad taste to announce publicly a Mass to pray for his ultimate salvation.

Also, I would ask how many Masses were offered for Adolf Hitler or Josef Stalin? I would wager “none.” And, yet, both of these men were baptized into the Catholic Church (I think Stalin even considered becoming a Priest), and would, arguably, be more entitled to have Masses offered for their souls than a Muslim whose driving force was the death of Chiristians.

If the Priest, or whoever, really wanted a Mass for Bin Laden, a small, private Mass, with the intention not made public, would have been the better course of action.
Hope you didn’t wager too much money… several historians still believe that Cardinal Bertram offered a requieum mass for Hitler on May 6, 1945.
 
I agree with your take. Jesus told us to love our enemies. That means that we cannot ever hope for his damnation. Praying for OBL is not easy, but then who ever said being a follower of Jesus was going to be easy. We must take up our cross every day.

Go to this Mass and pray ernestly for OBL’s salvation. You will be doing exactly as our Lord commanded you.

God bless you in this trial. And, please thank your family for their wonderful service to our country.
And I believe this is a good exercise for us that we may also learn to pray for those enemies we have that are not international terrorists. Whether its the annoying neighbor, the coworker who took credit for your work, or Osama, we should pray for them all, dead or alive.
 
I noticed in my Sunday bulletin, that someone had scheduled a mass on Thursday for the Repose of the Soul of Osama Bin Laden.

I make up the weekday schedule, and my DH & I serve on Thursday morning, but honestly, we don’t feel we can attend this mass.

I would love to hear others thoughts.
I think its a great thing especially since Christ said love your enemy.
 
I’ve read all of the posts, and my husband and I have discussed it thoroughly.

If we find, when we get up at 5:30 Thursday morning,to prepare for mass, that we really cannot serve at a mass for the Repose of the Soul of Osama Bin Laden, we will resign from our Ministry.

We would have preferred a mass for him, to be said, privately, because we know our Pastor’s Homily will run on and on about the fact that we, as the United States, are wrong, to engage in war.

He does not live in the “real” world, nor understand, that our service men and women, serve, and their service protects his freedom, to serve mass.
 
I wonder if Charles Martel and the Catholic soldiers prayed for the Muslims who just got through trying to hack them to pieces and conquer Europe for Islam after Martel and the boys taught them a lesson on the battlefield? I wonder if the Church held prayer vigils for Hitler, Goebbels, Himmler, and all the death camp commanders at the end of WWII? I wonder if the Church recommends praying for all the rapists in Darfur?
I sure hope they did. I know from reading a lot of early-Church martyr narratives that our greatest saints prayed for the people who hacked them to pieces as they were doing the hacking. So, for that matter, did Jesus Christ, dying on the cross, pray for his own torturers and murderers, who had committed a crime far greater than any OBL or Hitler could possibly imagine perpetrating.

You can’t wriggle your way out of dogma by ridiculing it, Gurney.
I do have better things to do. I will pray for the victims. 🙂
Prayer is not a zero-sum game.
 
I’ve read all of the posts, and my husband and I have discussed it thoroughly.

If we find, when we get up at 5:30 Thursday morning,to prepare for mass, that we really cannot serve at a mass for the Repose of the Soul of Osama Bin Laden, we will resign from our Ministry.

We would have preferred a mass for him, to be said, privately, because we know our Pastor’s Homily will run on and on about the fact that we, as the United States, are wrong, to engage in war.

He does not live in the “real” world, nor understand, that our service men and women, serve, and their service protects his freedom, to serve mass.
I don’t see how having a problem with the war is in any way dumbing down the sacrifice the troops make so I would go easy on your priest.

Right now Americans should be affraid that their freedoms are being attacked by the very people they appointed to protect them and that the troops are being misused by their own government. I have talked to plenty of troops that have fought in the Middle East and they agree with this and they are pissed off about it.

Anyway I dont mean to offend. I have friends and family in active duty and I honor their sacrifices and view them with the utmost respect even though I think the war we are in is total bs started by domestic terrorists within our own government.
 
Peace in Christ.

As I understand it as Catholics we are enjoined to follow the way of peace - to reject war as a grave wrong. That includes Catholics in the US as well as elsewhere. Yes Osama bin Laden committed a grave wrong against the innocents slain on 9/11 and here in London on 7/7 but we are enjoined by the Master to “turn the other cheek.”

Indeed in the Gospel of St Matthew [5: 43-48] the Lord gives us no option not just to pray for our enemies (which would include offering Mass for the repose of their soul) but also to love them.

As for “the Flag”, “the Marines” and the rest, these are things of the world. As a Royal Navy veteran I know how important these worldly things are or seem to be, but again we are enjoined to leave the things of this world alone. “Do not love the world or anything in the world. If anyone loves the world, the love of the Father is not in him.” [1 Jn 2:15]. Again we are told that “…know you not that the friendship of this world is the enemy of God? Whosoever therefore will be a friend of this world, becometh an enemy of God.” [Jas 4:4]

It follows in my opinion that offering a Mass for this man’s salvation and also preaching a sermon on peace are hard to justify as anti-catholic or anti-American.

As to the question of scandal if it were to be widely known that the Church taught us to pray for our enemies then perhaps the world might be scandalised but there is a chance that they might see that we live according to the instructions of the Christ.
 
I’ve never heard of a Mass being said for anyone other than a deceased Catholic.

I’d say let it ride. It’s only going to be mentioned briefly, and you don’t have to pray for him if you don’t want to.
When I was a kid, I was an alter boy. They had a mass for the repose of the soul of Martin Luther King. He was not Catholic. He is the complete flip side of an Osama Bin Laden, but he was not Catholic.

I don’t think people object to a mass being said for a non Catholic. I the issue is mass being said for the Hitler of our time.
 
When I was a kid, I was an alter boy. They had a mass for the repose of the soul of Martin Luther King. He was not Catholic. He is the complete flip side of an Osama Bin Laden, but he was not Catholic.

I don’t think people object to a mass being said for a non Catholic. I the issue is mass being said for the Hitler of our time.
Further more, I think praying for our enemies is what good Catholics do.
 
I don’t see how having a problem with the war is in any way dumbing down the sacrifice the troops make so I would go easy on your priest.

Right now Americans should be affraid that their freedoms are being attacked by the very people they appointed to protect them and that the troops are being misused by their own government. I have talked to plenty of troops that have fought in the Middle East and they agree with this and they are pissed off about it.

Anyway I dont mean to offend. I have friends and family in active duty and I honor their sacrifices and view them with the utmost respect even though I think the war we are in is total bs started by domestic terrorists within our own government.
It’s a bit difficult to “go easy on my priest” right now.

He is an alcoholic, banned a young woman from our church, who called him out, on breaking his word to the Altar & Rosary Society. He lied, he was wrong, but he refuses t say the simple words, “I’m sorry”.

No, you haven’t offended me. I stood, helplessly by, watching as the 2nd plane hit the Twin Tower. That moment is burned in my memory, forever.

I too, have friends and family, actively serving to protect our freedoms.

And I agree, we are in this war started by the domestic terrorists within our government.
 
Further more, I think praying for our enemies is what good Catholics do.
Then, perhaps, I am not a “good” Catholic.

Maybe I am wasting my time, rising at 5:30 every morning, to be in the Sacristy, setting up for 8:00 A.M. mass, every morning.

I would have preferred we had masses for Osama Bin Laden, while he was alive…perhaps the, I wouldn’t have had to serve at so many funerals.
 
It’s a bit difficult to “go easy on my priest” right now.

He is an alcoholic, banned a young woman from our church, who called him out, on breaking his word to the Altar & Rosary Society. He lied, he was wrong, but he refuses t say the simple words, “I’m sorry”.

No, you haven’t offended me. I stood, helplessly by, watching as the 2nd plane hit the Twin Tower. That moment is burned in my memory, forever.

I too, have friends and family, actively serving to protect our freedoms.

And I agree, we are in this war started by the domestic terrorists within our government.
What a passive-aggressive attitude! “No, you didn’t offend me - but I DID watch 3000 people burn to death in pain and agony”. This is the epitome of manipulation. There are Jews who saw more than 3000 people go up in smoke in Auschwitz, but they found it in the depths of their souls to forgive the Nazi criminals. You may not offer this Mass in your heart for bin Laden’s soul because you can’t do it, but you CAN serve at this eternal, holy Mass just to say “I forgive you”. Forgive 70 x 7 times, at the very least, so you can be forgiven.

Whether you had or have family members in domestic service is irrelevant. This is a huge tactic people tend to use (not just Americans): “well, I’ve got family members in the army, so don’t be critical of War X or Operation Y, because you’re attacking their honour”, implicitly. Let human honours be cursed, and worldly medals and virtues be banished to Hell.

What will happen when God demands the 10 billion dollars you owe Him personally? Will He find you at the bottom of the steps of His palace, wringing Osama’s neck for 100 dollars? Osama has no debt with you, only with God. Don’t act as if you’re personally insulted, as if your honour is the highest and noblest thing in the world. God’s honour, glory, power, empire, and majesty reign forever. The Book of Revelation is a good antidote to this sort of pride. He will take the martyrs from under His holy high altar in Heaven, and they shall praise His Name, and beg for justice - that God’s glory may be fulfilled. It is, perhaps, likely that Osama will burn under the stern gaze of the martyrs, but who knows what contrition was in his soul as the final bullets traveled those few feet toward his sacred, immortal person?

GOD is looking for you to serve this Mass for YOUR OWN SOUL’S SAKE. I doubt bin Laden is much of an issue to Him anymore. He has entered beyond the gates of eternity, and now proceeds where he deserves to proceed. In your life, you must count yourself lower than dust in matters like this. God has put it into your heart to be an altar server all these years JUST FOR THIS ONE MOMENT. He wants to see that you won’t run away just because you happen to vehemently disagree with the priest. It doesn’t matter about bin Laden; this situation, as it is, is about you and your will. God wants to observe you here, to see if you really do understand how worthless your own sense of honour and patriotic pride is. Leaving this Mass and resigning is a sign that you want to be pleased, that you want to increase. Let Him increase.
Then, perhaps, I am not a “good” Catholic.

Maybe I am wasting my time, rising at 5:30 every morning, to be in the Sacristy, setting up for 8:00 A.M. mass, every morning.

I would have preferred we had masses for Osama Bin Laden, while he was alive…perhaps the, I wouldn’t have had to serve at so many funerals.
This is very sentimental and schmaltzy, even for someone who is justified in being sorrowful. As much as you are deeply wounded by the events of that black day, you cannot continue rubbing it into us and yourself. It would have been ideal for a Mass to be offered for bin Laden while he was alive, of course, but that time is past. Did you ever offer a Mass, an Offertory, or a Holy Communion for his salvation? If so, then you have a right to be angry… if you never thought to do so, then attend this one in reparation for your lack of charity to bin Laden while he was alive.

God wants right reason to prevail in us: for all the faculties and appetites to be reigned in. This is the way it was in Eden, before this mess started. Allowing your will to be controlled by irascibility, rather than the intellect, is a terrible problem. Be rational, and detach your own self from the situation. Look at this from the vantage point of almighty God.

We’re not asked by our Lord to do the hard thing - He commands us to do it in the strongest terms. For those too lukewarm to offer one celebration of the Holy Mass for an evil sinner, He may say “I vomit thee out of my mouth, because thou art neither hot nor cold”. Don’t think you’re just and righteous because you get up ‘early’ every morning to serve at Mass. Perhaps you don’t feel that way, but it’s certainly the feeling I’m getting from your posts: that you’re entitled to be angry, and to boycott the Mass simply because you’re an important sacristan, and the priest has to listen to you.
 
"Then, perhaps, I am not a “good” Catholic.

Maybe I am wasting my time, rising at 5:30 every morning, to be in the Sacristy, setting up for 8:00 A.M. mass, every morning.

I would have preferred we had masses for Osama Bin Laden, while he was alive…perhaps the, I wouldn’t have had to serve at so many funerals."

I cannot say whether you are a good Catholic or not…only you and God know the state of your soul.

I get the feeling, and perhaps I am wrong, that you are very proud of rising at an early hour to prepare for Mass. Pride is a sin more deadly than anything Osama bin Laden could do to you.

As to serving at funerals - I know from bitter experience that it is a hard task to help provide the last offices for the dead, but an understanding that death is not the end merely a transformation works for me and may for you also.
 
What a passive-aggressive attitude! “No, you didn’t offend me - but I DID watch 3000 people burn to death in pain and agony”. This is the epitome of manipulation. There are Jews who saw more than 3000 people go up in smoke in Auschwitz, but they found it in the depths of their souls to forgive the Nazi criminals. You may not offer this Mass in your heart for bin Laden’s soul because you can’t do it, but you CAN serve at this eternal, holy Mass just to say “I forgive you”. Forgive 70 x 7 times, at the very least, so you can be forgiven.

Whether you had or have family members in domestic service is irrelevant. This is a huge tactic people tend to use (not just Americans): “well, I’ve got family members in the army, so don’t be critical of War X or Operation Y, because you’re attacking their honour”, implicitly. Let human honours be cursed, and worldly medals and virtues be banished to Hell.

What will happen when God demands the 10 billion dollars you owe Him personally? Will He find you at the bottom of the steps of His palace, wringing Osama’s neck for 100 dollars? Osama has no debt with you, only with God. Don’t act as if you’re personally insulted, as if your honour is the highest and noblest thing in the world. God’s honour, glory, power, empire, and majesty reign forever. The Book of Revelation is a good antidote to this sort of pride. He will take the martyrs from under His holy high altar in Heaven, and they shall praise His Name, and beg for justice - that God’s glory may be fulfilled. It is, perhaps, likely that Osama will burn under the stern gaze of the martyrs, but who knows what contrition was in his soul as the final bullets traveled those few feet toward his sacred, immortal person?

GOD is looking for you to serve this Mass for YOUR OWN SOUL’S SAKE. I doubt bin Laden is much of an issue to Him anymore. He has entered beyond the gates of eternity, and now proceeds where he deserves to proceed. In your life, you must count yourself lower than dust in matters like this. God has put it into your heart to be an altar server all these years JUST FOR THIS ONE MOMENT. He wants to see that you won’t run away just because you happen to vehemently disagree with the priest. It doesn’t matter about bin Laden; this situation, as it is, is about you and your will. God wants to observe you here, to see if you really do understand how worthless your own sense of honour and patriotic pride is. Leaving this Mass and resigning is a sign that you want to be pleased, that you want to increase. Let Him increase.

This is very sentimental and schmaltzy, even for someone who is justified in being sorrowful. As much as you are deeply wounded by the events of that black day, you cannot continue rubbing it into us and yourself. It would have been ideal for a Mass to be offered for bin Laden while he was alive, of course, but that time is past. Did you ever offer a Mass, an Offertory, or a Holy Communion for his salvation? If so, then you have a right to be angry… if you never thought to do so, then attend this one in reparation for your lack of charity to bin Laden while he was alive.

God wants right reason to prevail in us: for all the faculties and appetites to be reigned in. This is the way it was in Eden, before this mess started. Allowing your will to be controlled by irascibility, rather than the intellect, is a terrible problem. Be rational, and detach your own self from the situation. Look at this from the vantage point of almighty God.

We’re not asked by our Lord to do the hard thing - He commands us to do it in the strongest terms. For those too lukewarm to offer one celebration of the Holy Mass for an evil sinner, He may say “I vomit thee out of my mouth, because thou art neither hot nor cold”. Don’t think you’re just and righteous because you get up ‘early’ every morning to serve at Mass. Perhaps you don’t feel that way, but it’s certainly the feeling I’m getting from your posts: that you’re entitled to be angry, and to boycott the Mass simply because you’re an important sacristan, and the priest has to listen to you.
One of the best posts I have ever read on Catholic Answers. Major Kudos!

While I have the floor, I would like to offer a little perspective to the idea of going to war. There seems to be a sense that war is wrong and those horrible internal terrorists within our borders are evil because they took us to war.

Was the American revolution an evil war declared by barbaric leaders? No, it was the war that founded our nation and gave us the freedoms we enjoy to this day. Was the civil war brought about by despicable despots? No, it was a war to preserve the union keeping American strong and free and it lead to our confronting the issues of slavery and segregation.

I realize that blood is shed at war. It was General Sherman who said, “War is hell”. He is quite right. But, we can never judge the efficacy and impact that a military action respresents until enough time has passed for the history to be written.

Suppose we were able to sit and watch two parrallel worlds. One, where we would never have gone to war in Afghanistan and Iraq. And the other where we did. Which one paints the better world order.

Suddam Hussein, gone. Osama bin Laden, gone. Moamar Khaddafi, on the ropes. Maybe in the next ten years we will see terrorism abated and a more peaceful and enduring existance. Then again, maybe we won’t. Only time will tell…
 
Well for me and this is just me and the way I see it. If Jesus forgave eveyone while dieing on the cross for us, then who am I not to do the same. I would go, not because who the mass is being offered but for the sacrifice of the mass the eucharist.

Sometimes being Catholic is hard and thats when I have to be strong in Faith not for you but for me to have inner peace.

On a side note. When I was young and running amock, I was kidnapped and left for dead. During this ordeal I though for sure I was going to die, so I forgive them for what they did. All I could think of was the example Jesus gave us on the cross and Pope John Paul II forgiving the man that shot him. Who am I not to.

God bless

jesus g
 
“But I say to you that listen, Love your enemies, do good to those who hate you, bless those who curse you, pray for those who abuse you.” - Luke 6:27-28
 
Jesus forgave those who crucified Him, the Son of God. They tortured and killed the Son of God! And yet He forgave them. He gave us a commandment – love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you – and an example.
This is one thing that is often lost on us. The Lord forgave Deicide–the worst sin a people could commit against God. God forgave the killing of his Son, the second person of the Divine Trinity.

In the end, if God could forgive the killing of Himself, then we should be able to forgive each other for everything else. All other sins–including murder–pale in comparison to what our sins did to Jesus on the cross.

One of the worst pronouncements I have ever heard on the radio was way back when Dr. Laura Schlessinger’s show went nationwide. She said that if she went to heaven and saw Hitler there, that she would immediately demand that she be sent to hell. If she found out that God had forgiven Hitler, she would renounce her belief in God and be happy in hell. At that point, I decided that Dr. Laura wasn’t worth listening to and I changed the radio station.

Let’s not be like that.
 
Those who are opposed to a Mass being said for Bin Laden’s soul should keep in mind that since none of us can be certain what the final fate of any person’s soul is that every time we offer a Mass for the souls in purgatory or prayers for those suffering souls it may very well include Bin Laden. And if Bin Laden is in hell then it doesn’t matter whether prayers or Masses are said for him since he will not benefit from them and instead God will pour the graces from such prayers onto the souls who need them most.

I think perhaps we forget what type of people we pray for sometimes. Those of us who remember the souls in purgatory in our prayers should remember that not all of the people in purgatory are just your “average sinner” like you and me. There are surely many great sinners, individuals who have committed crimes on par with Bin Laden’s, who through the infinite Mercy of Christ have been forgiven and are now expiating the temporal punishment due to their sins. If we can pray for these people (who may have been our enemies in life) why can we not pray for Bin Laden’s soul?
 
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