Mass intentions for the same deceased people every Sunday for years?

[Laetus]

Is it legitimate and proper to have the same three deceased individuals as part of the Mass intentions for our early Mass every Sunday? This has been going on for many years at my parish. There are typically other names as well (which always change) for this Mass but these three: “†William Smith, †Mr & Mrs Jose Smith & Family” are always at the top.

I find it sort of repugnant because these people were known to be fairly serious givers (for those projects they liked and controlled) but they certainly didn’t pay for the church or any buildings or anything of that magnitude. Is this a class thing where wealthy people are buying prayers? The only other time I have heard of others being on the list of Mass intentions perpetually are Edward and Estelle Doheny who paid for Saint Vincent’s Church in Los Angeles. Thank you.

 

[Phemie]

Is it legitimate and proper to have the same three deceased individuals as part of the Mass intentions for our early Mass every Sunday? This has been going on for many years at my parish. There are typically other names as well (which always change) for this Mass but these three: “†William Smith, †Mr & Mrs Jose Smith & Family” are always at the top.

I find it sort of repugnant because these people were known to be fairly serious givers (for those projects they liked and controlled) but they certainly didn’t pay for the church or any buildings or anything of that magnitude. Is this a class thing where wealthy people are buying prayers? The only other time I have heard of others being on the list of Mass intentions perpetually are Edward and Estelle Doheny who paid for Saint Vincent’s Church in Los Angeles. Thank you.

It’s quite possible that their families offer that Mass on a regular basis. Or they may have left money in their will for masses to be offered in their intention – at an average stipend of $10, you don’t have to be a millionaire to request that the early Mass on Sunday be offered for the repose of your soul for the next 20 years.

I know that if I want Midnight Mass at Christmas celebrated for someone, all I have to do is request it early enough each year and I could have had the same intention for the last 14 years. I also know that some people will call late one year and request all the masses they want celebrated for the next year, usually on dates that mean something to that family (Mother’s Day, the deceased’s birthday, a wedding anniversary, the date of death, Christmas, etc.) Parishes usually try to accommodate the families if they can. It was rare that someone requested a specific date that couldn’t be accommodated in our parish when we had a Pastor. Since people usually request masses without specifying a date, it’s possible that if you came to the office tomorrow and asked for a Mass for a date next week you could be accommodated as long as next week’s intentions had not been publicly announced yet.

 

[TimothyH]

Is $10 a typical stipend?

I thought it was more.

-Tim-

 

[cradlecatholic5]

I find it sort of repugnant because these people were known to be fairly serious givers (for those projects they liked and controlled) but they certainly didn’t pay for the church or any buildings or anything of that magnitude.

 

[midori]

It’s generally more for funeral masses and wedding masses, but $10 is a pretty average offering for a regular mass.

A lot of times, you’ll see people requesting $10 for a mass, $90 for a 9-day set of novena masses, or $300 for a 30-day set of Gregorian masses. But anyone who’s gotten on the charitable giving mailing lists has ample access to novenas for far smaller offerings… $5, $10, $15 <—this amount will really help!, $25.

Likewise, I’ve seen Gregorian mass series— an uninterrupted series of 30 consecutive masses— with a recommended offering of $120.

It irks me when someone says “buying prayers”. Every mass includes a number of intercessions…

May he make us an everlasting gift to you and enable us to share in the inheritance of your saints, with Mary, the virgin Mother of God, with the apostles, the martyrs, (Saint N. – the saint of the day or the patron saint) and all your saints, on whose constant intercession we rely for help.

Lord, may this sacrifice, which has made our peace with you,advance the peace and salvation of all the world. Strengthen in faith and love your pilgrim Church on earth; your servant, Pope N., our Bishop N., and all the bishops,with the clergy and the entire people your Son has gained for you. Father, hear the prayers ofthe family you have gathered herebefore you. In mercy and love unite all your children wherever they may be.

Welcome into your kingdom our departed brothers and sisters, and all who have left this world in your friendship. We hope to enjoy for ever the vision of your glory, through Christ our Lord,from whom all good things come.

If someone wishes to specially hold up a particular intention and make an offering, that’s fabulous. But you have to admit, it’s a bit cheesy to critique others for being enthusiastic about their intentions-- or deem them not “important enough” to have arranged for the number of intentions that they have. While you might not always get the priest you want, at the time you want, on the day you want, at the church you want-- with a little preplanning, it’s not that hard (and certainly not expensive) to have numerous masses said for your own intentions.

 

[benjohnson]

I have to admit that all this talk of renumeration to be in the intentions has triggered my delicate Lutheran sensibilities. Rather than argue and create rancor, I’ll go clean the kitchen. My wife will be thankful.

 

[maryjk]

I have 3 more Masses planned this year, for the repose of soul of “my parents.” Two have already been said.

In December of last year I went to the church and gave them 5 dates (dates of birth, death and their anniversary) and $50. I got the dates and the times I wanted.

When we first moved to the South, every time we went to daily Mass on a Friday, it was always for the same person, the wife of a very well known person. This went on for years. Now the very well known person’s health doesn’t allow him to attend daily Mass, and the offering of Mass for the wife stopped.

Supposedly he came in every year at the end of the year and had the Masses planned.

It just takes planning. Nothing to get upset about.

 

[Phemie]

I have to admit that all this talk of renumeration to be in the intentions has triggered my delicate Lutheran sensibilities. Rather than argue and create rancor, I’ll go clean the kitchen. My wife will be thankful.

Stipends for Masses are governed by Canon Law. We are not ‘buying a Mass’, it would be celebrated whether there is an intention or not. We are asking the priest to add our intention to his and offering him a gift to do so.

While some priests will celebrate for all requested intentions and not accept stipends, they are allowed to accept one stipend per day regardless of the number of Masses they celebrate and that stipend is set by the diocese. If they concelebrate they may share that stipend with the concelebrant but they can’t each have a full stipend.

If we request a Mass and our ‘delicate sensibilities’ do not allow us to give a stipend, they have to celebrate it.

In mission parishes that is often the only money the priest gets to put food on the table. That is why often, if a parish ends up with too many Mass intentions and stipends on its books, it will transfer the money and the intentions to a missionary to celebrate. The tradition in the parish where I grew up was that extra Mass intentions were transferred twice/year and the list of intentions was posted so that parishioners knew that Mass would be celebrated elsewhere for intention they had requested.

 

[etmom]

Is $10 a typical stipend?

I thought it was more.

-Tim-

It’s $10 at our parish. They mass intentions are set up quite quickly when the schedule comes out in November each year. I tried to get a Mass intention set up in memory of my son’s birthday (this Friday) a few months ago, but couldn’t get anything for months out. I was able to get one set up for his birthday in 2013. When the 2014 book is made available in November of this year, I will get them set up for both him and my MIL for 2014.

 

[1ke]

Is it legitimate and proper to have the same three deceased individuals as part of the Mass intentions for our early Mass every Sunday?

Legitimate? Certainly.

Proper? Define proper.

If someone has submitted mass intentions on their behalf, then certainly they are to be said. Mass stipends and mass intentions are governed by canon law.

This has been going on for many years at my parish. There are typically other names as well (which always change) for this Mass but these three: “†William Smith, †Mr & Mrs Jose Smith & Family” are always at the top.

So?

I find it sort of repugnant because these people were known to be fairly serious givers (for those projects they liked and controlled) but they certainly didn’t pay for the church or any buildings or anything of that magnitude.

Sounds like maybe you don’t know how mass intentions work. Perhaps you should ask your priest about it, rather than assuming bad motives and nefarious conspiracies.

Is this a class thing where wealthy people are buying prayers?

It’s a **Church **thing, where anyone may offer mass intentions.

The only other time I have heard of others being on the list of Mass intentions perpetually are Edward and Estelle Doheny who paid for Saint Vincent’s Church in Los Angeles. Thank you.

Well, I am sure there are other instances. And, certainly family members or a will or trust could make arrangements for mass intentions.

Again, I suggest you ask your priest about it-- in a charitable way-- expressing curiosity, not animosity.

 

[PatriceA]

Is it legitimate and proper to have the same three deceased individuals as part of the Mass intentions for our early Mass every Sunday? This has been going on for many years at my parish. There are typically other names as well (which always change) for this Mass but these three: “†William Smith, †Mr & Mrs Jose Smith & Family” are always at the top.

I find it sort of repugnant because these people were known to be fairly serious givers (for those projects they liked and controlled) but they certainly didn’t pay for the church or any buildings or anything of that magnitude. Is this a class thing where wealthy people are buying prayers? The only other time I have heard of others being on the list of Mass intentions perpetually are Edward and Estelle Doheny who paid for Saint Vincent’s Church in Los Angeles. Thank you.

Soooo only people that paid for an actual church can be on the list perpetually? I think repugnant is an awfully strong word to use because a family has requested a mass, even one every week, be said for their deceased loved ones.

 

[SMHW]

Is it legitimate and proper to have the same three deceased individuals as part of the Mass intentions for our early Mass every Sunday? This has been going on for many years at my parish. There are typically other names as well (which always change) for this Mass but these three: “†William Smith, †Mr & Mrs Jose Smith & Family” are always at the top.

I’m kind of curious what you think the alternative should be???

If the stipends have been presented to the parish then the Masses *have *to be said for these individuals.

Are you thinking that those intentions should be offered at different Masses?

At many parishes it is the case that mass intentions for a particular date are requested months (or years) in advance. People like to remember their loved ones on a birthday or death date. At my parish (and I suspect this is the case for many parishes) there are way more requests for Mass intentnions than there are Masses in a year.

 

[benjohnson]

I done cleaning the kitchen. :coolinoff:

Upon reflection, I don’t see a problem with the Catholic practice: Without reservation, I gladly pay for vigil candles myself and l’m tankful for the opportunity.

In mission parishes that is often the only money the priest gets to put food on the table. That is why often, if a parish ends up with too many Mass intentions and stipends on its books, it will transfer the money and the intentions to a missionary to celebrate.

That’s really awesome and wholesome. Missionaries are truly the fingertips of God’s work.

FYI - Most Lutheran churches are small enough that additional intentions are voiced directly in the service by celebrants - that practice can stop once a church becomes large enough that there’s a risk that an individual could abuse the privilege as a soapbox, so I certainly see the value of the Catholic method of vetting the intentions beforehand.

 

[juno24]

Just out of curiosity, Laetus, at what point do you believe we should stop praying for the souls of the deceased? I see nothing wrong (and certainly nothing repugnant) about having Masses said for the repose of anyone’s soul for years, decades, or longer. Until we receive confirmation that someone is indeed in Heaven we should always pray for them.

 

[Laetus]

It’s sad that so many focused on the money and not the frequency. I question if it’s proper to have someones’ names at the same Mass every week, year after year. It demeans the tradition to me. In smaller parishes with fewer Masses the intentions could quickly be “bought out” for the entire year. Would it really be OK in a small parish with only one Sunday Mass for some number (possibly 4-6?) of people to buy-out all the Masses for the year at that parish for 4-6 individuals of their choosing? That seems terribly wrong.

I don’t think there is a canonical prohibition but it does seem like something a pastor should prohibit. Having 3-4 Masses/year celebrated for one’s deceased parents would be beautiful. Have 52+/year (and always on Sundays) seems quite wrong.

 

[wasserfall]

Is $10 a typical stipend?

I thought it was more.

Here Tim, I found this just for you: archatl.com/offices/odw/docs/Stipend-Guidelines.pdf

While the province of Atlanta does not have an established norm for mass stipends, the custom of $10 per mass should be followed as a guideline. If a sum of money is given for the celebration of masses, the amount should be divided by ten to determine how many masses should be offered for the intention.

 

[arkwright]

I don’t see any sense in giving money to a priest for a Mass when you can go to Mass yourself and place the intention yourself through Jesus into the hands of the Father .

 

[HelenRose]

I have to admit that all this talk of renumeration to be in the intentions has triggered my delicate Lutheran sensibilities. Rather than argue and create rancor, I’ll go clean the kitchen. My wife will be thankful.

It is not required.

 

[HelenRose]

I don’t see any sense in giving money to a priest for a Mass when you can go to Mass yourself and place the intention yourself through Jesus into the hands of the Father .

This practice was one of the many many many many wonderful hidden treasures of the Catholic faith that I surprised and pleased me when I became a Catholic.

 

[maryjk]

It’s sad that so many focused on the money and not the frequency. I question if it’s proper to have someones’ names at the same Mass every week, year after year. It demeans the tradition to me. In smaller parishes with fewer Masses the intentions could quickly be “bought out” for the entire year. Would it really be OK in a small parish with only one Sunday Mass for some number (possibly 4-6?) of people to buy-out all the Masses for the year at that parish for 4-6 individuals of their choosing? That seems terribly wrong.

I don’t think there is a canonical prohibition but it does seem like something a pastor should prohibit. Having 3-4 Masses/year celebrated for one’s deceased parents would be beautiful. Have 52+/year (and always on Sundays) seems quite wrong.

Do you know that this is what is happening? Do you know that others are trying to have Masses said and can’t?

Or is it that you just hear the same name every week?