Mass vs Sleep

[Rosebud77]

My pastor would say that if he called you Sunday AM and told you he had a priceless gift to give you, but you have to get it now, would you? If the answer is yes, get to Mass!

With great respect I find this difficult for many reasons. Over the years I made that decision wrongly many times. God does not want us exhausted and racing round to fulfil a rule… Often what I have read here has put guilt on me but finally in old age I am at peace on this. I can now very rarely go to Mass because of increasing disability and the danger with no immune system of getting an infection there. I am certain, sure, convinced that my acceptance of that condtiion is a holy thing and that He will feed me. I can still manage short car journeys that delight and strengthen and to live in my solitude without having to ask for help . For me Jesus is gift in every hour and every place. I used to go into our cathedral in the earlier hours, pray, light candles in the holy peace but now they have closed the car park except at mass times and I cannot walk far enough. Internet mass is grand and a blessing… We obey and honour in so many ways, do we not? For me to risk serious infection? Two years ago I accepted an invitation to the 1st communion of a dear friends child, caught a virus and was ill for months. When the next invitation came this year ( he has 4!) I had to say no. It was a sacrfice. As the OP to risk exhaustion that will affect others? Not wise or caring

 

[Angel_Bradford]

With great respect I find this difficult for many reasons. Over the years I made that decision wrongly many times. God does not want us exhausted and racing round to fulfil a rule… Often what I have read here has put guilt on me but finally in old age I am at peace on this. I can now very rarely go to Mass because of increasing disability and the danger with no immune system of getting an infection there. I am certain, sure, convinced that my acceptance of that condtiion is a holy thing and that He will feed me. I can still manage short car journeys that delight and strengthen and to live in my solitude without having to ask for help . For me Jesus is gift in every hour and every place. I used to go into our cathedral in the earlier hours, pray, light candles in the holy peace but now they have closed the car park except at mass times and I cannot walk far enough. Internet mass is grand and a blessing… We obey and honour in so many ways, do we not? For me to risk serious infection? Two years ago I accepted an invitation to the 1st communion of a dear friends child, caught a virus and was ill for months. When the next invitation came this year ( he has 4!) I had to say no. It was a sacrfice. As the OP to risk exhaustion that will affect others? Not wise or caring

Your situation is different because it is health related. As I read the OP’s posting, he/she makes no claim to exhaustion and admits that the situation does not occur often (in fact, she/he did say that this is the first time it has happened) . Therefore, I submit that he/she probably can and should go to Mass. If Jesus can hang on a cross for 3 hours, I can spend 1 hour at Mass.

 

[Rosebud77]

Your situation is different because it is health related. As I read the OP’s posting, he/she makes no claim to exhaustion and admits that the situation does not occur often (in fact, she/he did say that this is the first time it has happened) . Therefore, I submit that he/she probably can and should go to Mass. If Jesus can hang on a cross for 3 hours, I can spend 1 hour at Mass.

That is a s" bad" as your previous post, in the same way. The Jesus I know and love does not ask us to suffer as He did. He suffered so that we need not do so…lack of sleep is health related, and if you are blessed with a constitution that can take that then you are blessed indeed. I have struggled to mass many times in the past when that attitude put guilt on me and it was sin to do so. Many years ago here I read a post that said that even if you had to use a wheelchair and an oxygen mask YOU WENT TO MASS. I thought that that wrongful thinking had died. Seems not.

 

[jmcrae]

There are always exceptions to every rule. If you think you might be exceptional, speak to your priest and find out for sure.

If you are in normal health, go to Mass. Other than the tiniest of hamlets, there is a Mass within driving distance that you can attend either just before or directly after your Sunday work shift.

 

[Angel_Bradford]

That is a s" bad" as your previous post, in the same way. The Jesus I know and love does not ask us to suffer as He did. He suffered so that we need not do so…lack of sleep is health related, and if you are blessed with a constitution that can take that then you are blessed indeed. I have struggled to mass many times in the past when that attitude put guilt on me and it was sin to do so. Many years ago here I read a post that said that even if you had to use a wheelchair and an oxygen mask YOU WENT TO MASS. I thought that that wrongful thinking had died. Seems not.

You’re comparing apples to oranges by using your health-related issues to prove a point that may not effect the OP. Remember what Jesus said to his apostles in the Garden of Gethsemane? “Could you not keep watch one hour with me?”.

 

[CJsmommy]

Um… wow. A bit of a hot button topic. Would it help if I mentioned I’m a deli clerk, and work around potentially dangerous objects? And yet late/early turn around is not unusual. Ironically if I’d worked any earlier I would easily have been able to attend evening Mass with no issues at all.

 

[jmcrae]

Um… wow. A bit of a hot button topic. Would it help if I mentioned I’m a deli clerk, and work around potentially dangerous objects? And yet late/early turn around is not unusual. Ironically if I’d worked any earlier I would easily have been able to attend evening Mass with no issues at all.

Alternatively, can you use your supper break to go to Mass in the afternoon?

When I was working odd shifts in my younger years, I never had any issues asking for time off to go to Church on Sundays; they always gave it to me, and if they forgot and scheduled me anyway, I simply reminded them, and went to Church prior to coming in for work.

I once had a manager say to me, “You’re late for work - where were you?” and when I replied “I was at Church” he didn’t say anything else about it, and actually after that, he was the one who reminded others that I wasn’t available on Sunday mornings.

I also had co-workers who asked me one time why I always “get to sleep in” on Sunday mornings, and after I explained that I go to Church, they started bringing me their prayer requests and asking me to pray for them when I was in Church.

Even the most ardent atheists never had an issue with me going to Church on Sunday mornings, and coming in a bit later to work if I was scheduled on Sundays.

 

[EasterJoy]

… The Jesus I know and love does not ask us to suffer as He did. He suffered so that we need not do so…

Just out of curiosity, where did you get the idea that the Christian life does not involve any suffering?
Bear your share of hardship along with me like a good soldier of Christ Jesus.* 2 Tim 2:3

*He said, “The Son of Man must suffer greatly and be rejected by the elders, the chief priests, and the scribes, and be killed and on the third day be raised.” Then he said to all, "If anyone wishes to come after me, he must deny himself and take up his cross daily and follow me. For whoever wishes to save his life will lose it, but whoever loses his life for my sake will save it. What profit is there for one to gain the whole world yet lose or forfeit himself? *Luke 9:22-25

That is not to say that someone ought to put themselves or others in danger rather than to seek a dispensation from the obligation to attend Mass on Sundays and holy days. It is only to challenge a rather popular premise that is not and never has been taught by Holy Scriptures or by the Church.

 

[EasterJoy]

Um… wow. A bit of a hot button topic. Would it help if I mentioned I’m a deli clerk, and work around potentially dangerous objects? And yet late/early turn around is not unusual. Ironically if I’d worked any earlier I would easily have been able to attend evening Mass with no issues at all.

There are times when these things cannot be helped. Ask your pastor for guidance on this one. Ask the scheduler at work what the options are, too, if that is a reasonable option. I agree that people who work around meat slicers and who can give food poisoning to innocent people if they are careless at work have a serious reason to get the sleep necessary to do their jobs safely. How much that is will differ from one person to another.

 

[Rosebud77]

You’re comparing apples to oranges by using your health-related issues to prove a point that may not effect the OP. Remember what Jesus said to his apostles in the Garden of Gethsemane? “Could you not keep watch one hour with me?”.

Words fail. They really do… I watch with Jesus every hour of every day. No legalism here thankfully

 

[EasterJoy]

Words fail. They really do… I watch with Jesus every hour of every day. No legalism here thankfully

I’m not sure I understand you. The poster was merely saying that it isn’t clear whether this is a health issue as extreme as you’re saying. Maybe, but maybe not. How is the caution to be honest about the situation a case of “legalism”?

Legalism, after all, goes both ways. One kind binds those who should not be bound, true. The other kind, however, urges drivers to hit the gas as hard as they can whenever they see a yellow light. Following the spirit of the law rather than the letter will warn us away from two ditches, one which is too strict and the other which is too lax.

Note that when Jesus criticizes the Pharisees for their hypocrisy, in at least one case he gave an example of setting aside a divine precept for a human one:

Then Pharisees and scribes came to Jesus from Jerusalem and said, “Why do your disciples break the tradition of the elders? They do not wash (their) hands when they eat a meal.” He said to them in reply, “And why do you break the commandment of God for the sake of your tradition? For God said, ‘Honor your father and your mother,’ and ‘Whoever curses father or mother shall die.’ But you say, ‘Whoever says to father or mother, “Any support you might have had from me is dedicated to God,” need not honor his father.’ You have nullified the word of God for the sake of your tradition. Hypocrites, well did Isaiah prophesy about you when he said: ‘This people honors me with their lips, but their hearts are far from me; in vain do they worship me, teaching as doctrines human precepts.’” He summoned the crowd and said to them, “Hear and understand. It is not what enters one’s mouth that defiles that person; but what comes out of the mouth is what defiles one.” Matt. 15:1-11

Honoring the day of worship is a divine precept, not a human one. Yes, the Sabbath was made for man and not man for the Sabbath, but the need to worship God is a human need as surely as it is a duty to God. It should not be neglected without a serious reason. Maybe the OP has that, but let’s not act as if this isn’t a divine precept we’re talking about.

 

[smead2942]

I had a really nasty schedule last week, and I wanted to know if that was a situation that it would be alright to not attend Sunday Mass that week.

On Saturday night I had to work late at my retail job (afternoon through midnight, so no chance for the vigil Mass) and then had to work at 11:30 am to 8pm Sunday and missed the evening Mass too. I could have technically made a morning Mass, but would have paid with lack of sleep.

It’s not a situation that happens often. That was only the 1st time since I started attending that I had a weekend schedule like that. I wound up just finding a Mass streaming online and hoped that would be enough.

I work from 4-12:30am on Saturday evenings and 11-9pm on Sundays, but still find time for Holy Mass on Sunday morning. It’s doable. Offer up your tiredness and dedicate those two days of work to the Immaculate Heart or something.

 

[Rosebud77]

Just out of curiosity, where did you get the idea that the Christian life does not involve any suffering?
Bear your share of hardship along with me like a good soldier of Christ Jesus.* 2 Tim 2:3

He said, “The Son of Man must suffer greatly and be rejected by the elders, the chief priests, and the scribes, and be killed and on the third day be raised.” Then he said to all, "If anyone wishes to come after me, he must deny himself and take up his cross daily and follow me. For whoever wishes to save his life will lose it, but whoever loses his life for my sake will save it. What profit is there for one to gain the whole world yet lose or forfeit himself? Luke 9:22-25

That is not to say that someone ought to put themselves or others in danger rather than to seek a dispensation from the obligation to attend Mass on Sundays and holy days. It is only to challenge a rather popular premise that is not and never has been taught by Holy Scriptures or by the Church.

Where in my posts did you get that idea! I live with acute pain almost every day and every hour… that is so funny!!! roflol nothing to do with being a Christian of course. How i bear it is a different latter and believe me I suffer for my faith…BUT and it is a very big BUT the point here from the OP is that we surely do not seek suffering or add to it. We take care for others as for our own health and safety. Rushing to cram mass in? Dreadful. and one of the main reasons I stopped going in person. It became an ordeal and a such was not honouring Jesus. What I find … wrong …( tired so excuse poor word choice. thank you) is seeking suffering And I think you misread the words you quote to try to fit this situation which you seem to sort in your last para… It i when folk compare being exhausted at mass with the suffering of Jesus that I wince.

 

[EasterJoy]

Where in my posts did you get that idea! I live with acute pain almost every day and every hour… that is so funny!!! roflol nothing to do with being a Christian of course. How i bear it is a different latter and believe me I suffer for my faith…BUT and it is a very big BUT the point here from the OP is that we surely do not seek suffering or add to it. We take care for others as for our own health and safety. Rushing to cram mass in? Dreadful. and one of the main reasons I stopped going in person. It became an ordeal and a such was not honouring Jesus. What I find … wrong …( tired so excuse poor word choice. thank you) is seeking suffering And I think you misread the words you quote to try to fit this situation which you seem to sort in your last para… It i when folk compare being exhausted at mass with the suffering of Jesus that I wince.

You said, “… The Jesus I know and love does not ask us to suffer as He did. He suffered so that we need not do so…”

I want to know where you got the idea that Our Lord suffered so that we don’t need to, that’s all. You wrote that, but He didn’t say that. The Apostles didn’t say that. They both said very clearly that the follower of Christ was choosing suffering–not because suffering was a good thing, but because fidelity was a necessary thing that necessarily involves suffering from time to time.

No one here is asking the OP or anyone else to seek suffering for the sake of suffering. The point is that when fidelity requires one to suffer, then one remains faithful. That is the kind of suffering that was meant by “fiilling up what is lacking in the afflictions of Christ on behalf of his body, which is the church” (Col. 1:24) You don’t go looking for suffering, but you do stay vigilant to what fidelity requires you to do and you remain willing to suffer in order to remain faithful to love of God and love of neighbor, when that is required. When the sick or suffering person remains faithful in spite of their suffering, it is not the suffering that pleases God. You are right: God does not rejoice in suffering! It is the *fidelity even in spite of suffering *that pleases God.

As you are implying, however, fidelity and the demands of health and safety are not contrary to each other. Fidelity gives us certain religious duties, but fidelity also gives us duties to avoid harming ourselves or others. I still expect my pastor would say what I did: do not skip Mass because it is inconvenient or difficult, but do weigh whether honoring the obligation to go to Mass conflicts with another duty, such as the duty to do dangerous work in a safe way or taking common sense care of your health or the health of others. One pastor, in fact, gave an announcement reminding parishioners that when they have a communicable disease they have a duty to STAY HOME AND KEEP OTHERS SAFE. He didn’t want to see someone drag themselves to church with the flu and think they were being dutiful Catholics when in fact they were probably going to make a lot of other people miserable, not to mention rendering them unable to fulfill their daily duties.

*Let us hold unwaveringly to our confession that gives us hope, for he who made the promise is trustworthy. We must consider how to rouse one another to love and good works. We should not stay away from our assembly, as is the custom of some, but encourage one another, and this all the more as you see the day drawing near. * Heb 10:23-25

The duty to attend Mass is a real obligation. That is not to say it is an obligation from which one is not ever excused. No one here is saying that. They are saying that it is a real obligation that should be missed only for a sufficiently serious reason. I think most of us here would say that the one to help you discern what is “sufficiently serious” is your pastor, who has the authority to dispense the obligation when such a serious reason exists. (Notice that I didn’t say absolve the sin of missing, but dispense the obligation. Missing for a legitimate reason is not a sin at all.)

 

[Angel_Bradford]

You said, “… The Jesus I know and love does not ask us to suffer as He did. He suffered so that we need not do so…”

I want to know where you got the idea that Our Lord suffered so that we don’t need to, that’s all. You wrote that, but He didn’t say that. The Apostles didn’t say that. They both said very clearly that the follower of Christ was choosing suffering–not because suffering was a good thing, but because fidelity was a necessary thing that necessarily involves suffering from time to time.

No one here is asking the OP or anyone else to seek suffering for the sake of suffering. The point is that when fidelity requires one to suffer, then one remains faithful. That is the kind of suffering that was meant by “fiilling up what is lacking in the afflictions of Christ on behalf of his body, which is the church” (Col. 1:24) You don’t go looking for suffering, but you do stay vigilant to what fidelity requires you to do and you remain willing to suffer in order to remain faithful to love of God and love of neighbor, when that is required. When the sick or suffering person remains faithful in spite of their suffering, it is not the suffering that pleases God. You are right: God does not rejoice in suffering! It is the *fidelity even in spite of suffering *that pleases God.

As you are implying, however, fidelity and the demands of health and safety are not contrary to each other. Fidelity gives us certain religious duties, but fidelity also gives us duties to avoid harming ourselves or others. I still expect my pastor would say what I did: do not skip Mass because it is inconvenient or difficult, but do weigh whether honoring the obligation to go to Mass conflicts with another duty, such as the duty to do dangerous work in a safe way or taking common sense care of your health or the health of others. One pastor, in fact, gave an announcement reminding parishioners that when they have a communicable disease they have a duty to STAY HOME AND KEEP OTHERS SAFE. He didn’t want to see someone drag themselves to church with the flu and think they were being dutiful Catholics when in fact they were probably going to make a lot of other people miserable, not to mention rendering them unable to fulfill their daily duties.

*Let us hold unwaveringly to our confession that gives us hope, for he who made the promise is trustworthy. We must consider how to rouse one another to love and good works. We should not stay away from our assembly, as is the custom of some, but encourage one another, and this all the more as you see the day drawing near. * Heb 10:23-25

The duty to attend Mass is a real obligation. That is not to say it is an obligation from which one is not ever excused. No one here is saying that. They are saying that it is a real obligation that should be missed only for a sufficiently serious reason. I think most of us here would say that the one to help you discern what is “sufficiently serious” is your pastor, who has the authority to dispense the obligation when such a serious reason exists. (Notice that I didn’t say absolve the sin of missing, but dispense the obligation. Missing for a legitimate reason is not a sin at all.)

Beautifully stated; thank you!