Math anxiety-help needed

[Kal2012]

My son has dyscalculia. He’s 8.

It’s basically what you’d consider dyslexia in learning math. Their brain is responding to the (name removed by moderator)ut differently.

It really not the same as having math “anxiety”.

If you suspect that your child has a learning disability, then there are professionals out there who can actually make that diagnosis. Teachers are trained to spot problems, but they aren’t trained to make official diagnoses.

dyscalculia.org/

 

[Xantippe]

Algebra at age 9 - phewey!

Fractions and decimals are very advanced in themselves. The paradox between wholes and parts that one can’t even express are stretching us beyond our limits in the philosophy columns in this forum, so it’s very good to start young !!!

About the algebra at age 9–yeah. That alone is eye-roll worthy.

And Vic is correct that fractions and decimals are by themselves advanced. And I’d add that fractions are fundamental to more advanced math, so it’s worth taking pains and time and getting a good foundation.

I feel like the OP describes way too many complex areas being thrown at the kid. I have some serious qualms about the school’s approach.

 

[mommy_k]

If I understand correctly:

• If you simply write out equations, she has no problem solving them? Doing the math?
• She can not translate a word problem into the relevant equation?

If that is the case, she is not seeing math as a language. Just symbols. Hard to overcome, you need to focus on key words that translate to add/ subtract/ multiply /divide. Show her how words translate to mathematical operations. Both of my girls had this issue-- I could give them the equation but they couldn’t reason how to come up with the equation for a word problem. “Just tell me how to do it” was always their response to me trying to show them how to reason out the appropriate method/math to solve.

A simple example, Kathy has 60 cantaloupes (for some unknown reason we won’t delve into) and wants to give an equal amount to her 6 friends. How many do each get? "

Your daughter needs to recognize ‘give an equal amount’ as divide

Yes this is part of it. The other night I taught her how to add fractions, she understood. She got these right on her test. Then there was a word problem:

Joe and Meg each had a slice of different pizza’s at lunch which was at 12 noon. Joe had a slice that was 1/6 of his whole pie and Meg had a slice that was 1/4 of her pie. Who’s pie had more pizza left?

Dd said they were equal as they both had a slice and-- lunch time pizza is usually the same size.

 

[mommy_k]

Yes, Easter joy-I will get a white board too. Also I think that being an enthusiastic learner is one of the most important attributes-and I don’t want her anxiety or lack of confidence in math to ruin it for her. She loves school except for math.

 

[mommy_k]

About the algebra at age 9–yeah. That alone is eye-roll worthy.

And Vic is correct that fractions and decimals are by themselves advanced. And I’d add that fractions are fundamental to more advanced math, so it’s worth taking pains and time and getting a good foundation.

I feel like the OP describes way too many complex areas being thrown at the kid. I have some serious qualms about the school’s approach.

We love our dd’s school–but the math is becoming a big concern. The teacher offered to tutor after school-but dd does not understand it in class, so that made no sense to me. We are going to go to kumon instead.

Every week it’s something different, and not in the order of the textbook either. I would think the chapter on 2 digit multiplication should come before adding and subtracting fractions. But they teach this multiplication horizontal and it comes later in the year.

 

[Xantippe]

We love our dd’s school–but the math is becoming a big concern. The teacher offered to tutor after school-but dd does not understand it in class, so that made no sense to me. We are going to go to kumon instead.

Every week it’s something different, and not in the order of the textbook either. I would think the chapter on 2 digit multiplication should come before adding and subtracting fractions. But they teach this multiplication horizontal and it comes later in the year./QUOTE]



I think you may have found your problem.

 

[Xantippe]

Thank you all for your suggestions–yes, the math she is learning sometimes makes easy things harder through the operations they want to see.

Dh 's degree is math-- and thinks that she needs a review of 4th grade maybe even 3rd, as there may be a disconnect somewhere. Dd tells me the tests are timed and puts too much pressure- and makes her anxious too.

Our older kids went to a different elementary school and had no issues-maybe one or two-but nothing major and I hate to blame teachers. I know that they do not have manipulatives in class though.

So it’s a puzzle-the only thing I know is that she needs to get help and relax. I will be researching all the links and I appreciate all of your feedback.

Yeah.

She needs to get her confidence back.

 

[CouldBNE1]

This may not help with the anxiety, but www.khanacademy.org is a wonderful (and free!) resource for all kinds academic materials. They have fantastic videos that definitely helps visual learners.

 

[pollylodges]

Saint Michael, the archangel, defend us in battle, be our defense against the wickedness and snares of the devil, may God rebuke him, we humbly pray. And do you, O’ Prince of the Heavenly host, by the power of God thrust into Hell Satan and all the other evil spirits who prowl about the world for the ruin of souls.

Amen.

†

Our Father who art in Heaven, hallowed be thy name.

Thy kingdom come, thy will be done on Earth as it is in Heaven.

Give us this day our daily bread.

And forgive us our trespasses, as we forgive those who trespass against us.

And lead us not into temptation, but deliver us from evil.

Amen.

†

Hail Mary, full of grace, the Lord is with thee.

Blessed are you among women, and blessed is the fruit of your womb Jesus.

Holy Mary, Mother of God, pray for us sinners, now and at the hour of our death.

Amen.

†

Prayer to Our Lady of Mental Peace

O Lady of Mental Peace,
Mother of Tranquility
and Mother of Hope,
look upon mommy k’s daughter in this time
of weakness and unrest.

Teach her searching heart
to know that God’s Love
for her is unchanging and
unchangeable, and, that
true human love can only
begin and grow by touching
His Love.

Let your gentle Peace -
which this world cannot give

• be always with her.
  And, help her to bring this
  same Peace into the lives
  of others.

Our Lady of Mental Peace,

• Pray for us!
  Amen.

Jesus, Help Me!

In every need let me come to You with humble trust,
saying:
Jesus, help me!
In all my doubts, perplexities, and temptations:
Jesus, help me!
In hours of loneliness, weariness and trials:
Jesus, help me!
In the failure of my plans and hopes, in disappointments,
troubles and sorrows:
Jesus, help me!
When others fail me, and Your Grace alone can assist me:
Jesus, help me!
When I throw myself on Your tender Love as Savior:
Jesus, help me!
When my heart is cast down by failure, at seeing no good
come from my efforts:
Jesus, help me!
When I feel impatient, and my cross irritates me:
Jesus, help me!
When I am ill, and my head and hands cannot work and
I am lonely:
Jesus, help me!

Always, always, in spite of weakness, falls and short-
comings of every kind:
Most Sacred Heart of Jesus, help me and never forsake me!

Amen

†

 

[CatholicRaven]

Yes this is part of it. The other night I taught her how to add fractions, she understood. She got these right on her test. Then there was a word problem:

Joe and Meg each had a slice of different pizza’s at lunch which was at 12 noon. Joe had a slice that was 1/6 of his whole pie and Meg had a slice that was 1/4 of her pie. Who’s pie had more pizza left?

Dd said they were equal as they both had a slice and-- lunch time pizza is usually the same size.

So she’s visualizing the scene somewhat, but not recognizing that her lunch time pizza slice is not necessarily cut the same as Joe’s or Meg’s, because in her experience, everyone gets the same size slice. If every pizza she’s ever seen has been cut into eighths (or whatever), it’s going to be very difficult for her to visualize anything else.

I think it would help to draw it out or use circle cut-outs. Or better yet, you could get two (or more) small pizzas and cut them according to the problem. If she’s like my kids, she will probably see the difference if not seeing it means she gets the smaller slice! Seriously, though, it will probably help to compare the slices so that she can see that they do not contain the same amount if the two pies are cut into different numbers of slices (different fractions), and show her how pizzas can be cut in more than one way.

I also definitely second the recipes idea–baking is a fun way to work with fractions. I wouldn’t even half or double a recipe at the beginning, just use it as written so she can see and compare the fractions without having to figure things out just yet. She can also observe you use a half-cup measure twice to make 1 cup, etc. If she’s interested, you might let her use a dishpan of water or dry rice and some measuring cups and spoons to just play and observe.

As for the timed tests, I would suggest to her that she could work the problems she understands first, then the ones she is pretty sure about, then come back to the difficult ones last. Let her know she can skip a problem and come back to it later–they don’t have to be done in order before you can move on. That’s something I didn’t realize when I was younger, so when I got stuck on a problem, I’d panic. Thinking I still had fifteen problems to go meant I’d miss a LOT of problems if I couldn’t finish this one! I hated missing lots of problems that I knew I could have done if I’d only gotten to them. Once I realized I could skip over a tough one and come back after doing other (easier) problems, tests and quizzes were much less stressful for me. That may or may not help her with the stress, depending on what exactly worries her, but it’s worth a shot.

Prayers!

 

[CatholicRaven]

mommy k;13892626:

We love our dd’s school–but the math is becoming a big concern. The teacher offered to tutor after school-but dd does not understand it in class, so that made no sense to me. We are going to go to kumon instead.

Every week it’s something different, and not in the order of the textbook either. I would think the chapter on 2 digit multiplication should come before adding and subtracting fractions. But they teach this multiplication horizontal and it comes later in the year.

/QUOTE]



I think you may have found your problem.

I agree! What a mess.

Textbooks are generally written the way they are so that in the early lessons, students can get a foundation for later lessons. Skipping around is just confusing and doesn’t build any kind of foundation–even for students who can grasp the concepts separately. You may just have to get her through the rest of the year, take a break, and gently introduce some of these concepts in a “real-world,” relaxed way during the summer (maybe your dh can share some fun math puzzles, games, or “tricks” with her).

 

[EasterJoy]

Yes, Easter joy-I will get a white board too. Also I think that being an enthusiastic learner is one of the most important attributes-and I don’t want her anxiety or lack of confidence in math to ruin it for her. She loves school except for math.

I’d say that math is going to be where she shows how tough she is, and I would feel free to guarantee her that she’ll go far in life if she develops toughness and knows she has developed it, and becomes someone who gets in and does her best even when it is the pits. Besides, if she masters math, she’s going to know she’s accomplished something. It is a really great feeling when your parents aren’t just proud of what you’re capable of, but also proud of what you’ve done by your hard work.

Students who are praised for being hard workers actually do better in high school than students who are praised for being smart. Being smart is a burden you feel you have to live up to. Being a hard worker is something you control and something you feel you can take credit for achieving, too.

 

[shainski]

EasterJoy has given some great insight.

I have four kids in elementary school, so I get some of the unusual techniques being used. But I do see the logic behind it (after I overcome my initial resistance).

Anxiety about a subject can affect any of us. And once we start getting into the mode: “I’m not the kind of person who can do…” (whatever it is), we start defeating ourselves. We start shutting down before we even attempt to do it. (It doesn’t have to be math -

“I’m not hte kind of person who …”

… can do cartwheels.
… can learn a foreign language
…can give a speech in front of others
…can play a musical instrument
etc.

Now, that said, you have to learn how to undo the damage of getting into this mindset.

a little anecdote
Because of my math background, a woman at this company I worked for asked me if I could help her daughter in her high school math.

I was happy to do it. Her daughter was pulling in “A’s” in every subject, and getting “D’s” in math.

The first week I met her, she was a bit headstrong. She told me that she wasn’t the kind of person who could do math. She told me that her 4th grade (or some elementary grade) teacher had told her that she would never get it. That stuck with her to that day.

She wanted to do things her way. So, I told her - “Fine, I’ll make a deal with you - if you get the right answer, you can do things your own way”. But I wanted to observe how she did them.

When a story problem came up - she went absolutely blank.

“a canoe can go down the river at 5 miles an hour with no current”. “There is a 3 mile an hour current going against the canoe”. “How far will the canoe go…”

something like that. She told me that she was incapable of doing that. Okay, she was a high school kid. I could tell that she was extremely intelligent - and could do math in her head (if she didn’t realize she was doing math).

So, I told her, - what if I change the problem a bit.

“A cute football player is running down the field at 5 feet per second. He is being pushed back by another football player at 3 feet per second. How far does he go…”

No sooner had I got the question out, she told me the answer within seconds. I asked her how did she do it. Part of her problem was that if she wasn’t interested in the story, she had no connection to it, she couldn’t do it." So I told her that she could change any problem in to something that she was interested in.

She ended up easily pulling in a “B” in her class (and that includes the first semester averaging the “D” before I worked with her.

So, I suggest that you attempt to see the problems through your daughters eyes. See if you can change them to make more sense (or at least be more interesting)

I know it’s tough. But once she does some of these, she can build confidence. Since she can do the underlying math … something else is getting in the way.

 

[EasterJoy]

EasterJoy has given some great insight.

I have four kids in elementary school, so I get some of the unusual techniques being used. But I do see the logic behind it (after I overcome my initial resistance).

Anxiety about a subject can affect any of us. And once we start getting into the mode: “I’m not the kind of person who can do…” (whatever it is), we start defeating ourselves. We start shutting down before we even attempt to do it. (It doesn’t have to be math -

“I’m not hte kind of person who …”

… can do cartwheels.
… can learn a foreign language
…can give a speech in front of others
…can play a musical instrument
etc.

Now, that said, you have to learn how to undo the damage of getting into this mindset.

a little anecdote
Because of my math background, a woman at this company I worked for asked me if I could help her daughter in her high school math.

I was happy to do it. Her daughter was pulling in “A’s” in every subject, and getting “D’s” in math.

The first week I met her, she was a bit headstrong. She told me that she wasn’t the kind of person who could do math. She told me that her 4th grade (or some elementary grade) teacher had told her that she would never get it. That stuck with her to that day.

She wanted to do things her way. So, I told her - “Fine, I’ll make a deal with you - if you get the right answer, you can do things your own way”. But I wanted to observe how she did them.

When a story problem came up - she went absolutely blank.

“a canoe can go down the river at 5 miles an hour with no current”. “There is a 3 mile an hour current going against the canoe”. “How far will the canoe go…”

something like that. She told me that she was incapable of doing that. Okay, she was a high school kid. I could tell that she was extremely intelligent - and could do math in her head (if she didn’t realize she was doing math).

So, I told her, - what if I change the problem a bit.

“A cute football player is running down the field at 5 feet per second. He is being pushed back by another football player at 3 feet per second. How far does he go…”

No sooner had I got the question out, she told me the answer within seconds. I asked her how did she do it. Part of her problem was that if she wasn’t interested in the story, she had no connection to it, she couldn’t do it." So I told her that she could change any problem in to something that she was interested in.

She ended up easily pulling in a “B” in her class (and that includes the first semester averaging the “D” before I worked with her.

So, I suggest that you attempt to see the problems through your daughters eyes. See if you can change them to make more sense (or at least be more interesting)

I know it’s tough. But once she does some of these, she can build confidence. Since she can do the underlying math … something else is getting in the way.

This is not always tutoring that a student will believe coming from Mom or Dad. It’s very much like coaching a sport. Sometimes the teacher the student is most comfortable with is a parent, sometimes not. Finding a tutor that the student comes to believe will help her is key, though. I wouldn’t give a tutor more than three or four tries before I switched to someone the student accepts as a good source of help. Some initial resistance is common–do point out that professional athletes get private coaching, it is not just something that people who “can’t” go out and find–but if the student flatly says, “not him” or “not her,” keep looking.

 

[WT1]

Best advice find the best tutor you can and make the investment. We were not taught math the way they teach it now (which is ridiculous but besides the point) and a strong foundation in math is critical or it will limit her career choices later.

She can get over this, build confidence and eventually excell at math some kids just take a little extra time before it clicks. My oldest took to math like a duck on water but my youngest struggled to learn the multiplication tables (we were worried something was wrong) but with a tutors helped she gained confidence, it clicked and has been a straight A student ever since.

Make the investment and call local schools for recommendations as plenty of teachers tutor on the side.

 

[WT1]

Another piece of advice for all parents is find out in your schools who the best math teachers are and beg, borrow and steal if you have to in order to get your kids in their classes.

 

[Graceful_Lamb]

Math and I haven’t been good friends over the years. I didn’t know that there was such a thing as Math anxiety. Anyway, a good website for kids’ math is this site: coolmath4kids.com/

 

[mommy_k]

Thank you again everyone–

After last night’s math homework-seems I am having math anxiety too. We started at 4:30 and had a break for dinner. We ended at 8:30.
By the end-I could not add 2 and 2 together.

It was way too much to cover -and I missed the annoucement from school that theschool May Crowning time was switched from 10:00 to 9:00 this morning. So I showed up at 10:00, drove the 10 miles to it, and then the principal told me the 8th grade confirmation parent meeting is at 12:00. Umm-I have no 8th grader, told him that-- and am at school volunteering several times a week-and he had no clue who I was. I asked about the may crowning and he said I missed it–I should have checked the website last night and thought it was amusing that I was helping with homework.

Then kumon is 160 dollars a month with a 12 month commitment with 1/2 tutoring on site and the rest are worksheets.

I am feeling very put upon by this school right now, and am having s very negative attitude today- I hope dd does not have homework.

 

[Xantippe]

Thank you again everyone–

After last night’s math homework-seems I am having math anxiety too. We started at 4:30 and had a break for dinner. We ended at 8:30.
By the end-I could not add 2 and 2 together.

It was way too much to cover -and I missed the annoucement from school that theschool May Crowning time was switched from 10:00 to 9:00 this morning. So I showed up at 10:00, drove the 10 miles to it, and then the principal told me the 8th grade confirmation parent meeting is at 12:00. Umm-I have no 8th grader, told him that-- and am at school volunteering several times a week-and he had no clue who I was. I asked about the may crowning and he said I missed it–I should have checked the website last night and thought it was amusing that I was helping with homework.

Then kumon is 160 dollars a month with a 12 month commitment with 1/2 tutoring on site and the rest are worksheets.

I am feeling very put upon by this school right now, and am having s very negative attitude today- I hope dd does not have homework.

The Kumon sounds pretty price-competitive with private tutoring, except for the fact that with a private tutor, you could bail if things were going fine. On the other hand, with private tutors, there’s a lot more variation in quality–some might be worse than Kumon and a handful might be much better.

I’ve heard a lot of good things about Kumon over the years. If it were my kid and I had the money, I’d do Kumon, but if resources were more limited, a well-recommended private tutor might work even better. The worksheets they do outside of class are apparently a really important part of the program.

For perspective, I once priced out study skills at Sylvan–it was (if I remember correctly) $3500 for the course.

Another thing that comes to mind is that 4th grade is a really important school year in terms of academics getting more difficult, so it’s not surprising that if your child had trouble in school, this was the year.

Good luck!

 

[gardenswithkids]

Thank you again everyone–

After last night’s math homework-seems I am having math anxiety too. We started at 4:30 and had a break for dinner. We ended at 8:30.
By the end-I could not add 2 and 2 together.

It was way too much to cover -and I missed the annoucement from school that theschool May Crowning time was switched from 10:00 to 9:00 this morning. So I showed up at 10:00, drove the 10 miles to it, and then the principal told me the 8th grade confirmation parent meeting is at 12:00. Umm-I have no 8th grader, told him that-- and am at school volunteering several times a week-and he had no clue who I was. I asked about the may crowning and he said I missed it–I should have checked the website last night and thought it was amusing that I was helping with homework.

Then kumon is **160 dollars a month with a 12 month commitment **with 1/2 tutoring on site and the rest are worksheets.

I am feeling very put upon by this school right now, and am having s very negative attitude today- I hope dd does not have homework.

Aw, you deserve a hug! :console:

Since you are struggling with 2+2 now, let me do some of the math here for you. $160 per month with a 12 month commitment = $1920. (That price may or may not include everything–ask if that cover the cost of all the books, testing.) Rounding to the nearest thousand, $1920 rounds up to $2,000 for a year for tutoring, half of which you say is worksheets at home–and that’s on top of whatever you are already paying for private school and whatever homework comes from her school.

Before spending money for tutoring, I’d take up the 4th grade teacher on her offer to tutor your daughter after school AND I’d sit in on those tutoring sessions and have the teacher tutor me too. I’d want to take a look at the teacher book to see how the answer key approaches these math problems. There’s often more than one way to approach a math problem. If you passed 4th grade, you know how to do fourth grade math. You just need to know this particular fourth grade math, or more to the point how specifically they want your daughter’s math to look. Having multiple people showing your daughter multiple ways to solve math problems, may be compounding her confusion and anxiety. Going to the teacher and letting her explain it to your daughter again (when the rest of the class isn’t around) and *to you *might help far more than you realize.

Also, before spending any money on tutoring, I’d request in writing that the public school district evaluate her for a math learning disorder. If this is a learning disorder, a more specific type or style of tutoring could be more effective than others.