May Parents Reject "Restored Order?" Children's Liturgy of the Word?

[lak611]

strictly speaking this thread is about the order of the sacraments of initiation, not the age for the sacraments. and to this poster and a previous poster, it is for the bishop to set the age for confirmation, not the parents, and not the child. Every year confirmation is delayed means fewer youth will receive the benefit of the sacrament, because they dropout of RE just as frequently before as after. To my mind delay to the later teen years can amount to denial of the sacrament.

My parish used to confirm children in 9th grade, but switched to 8th grade. Too many children stopped going to CCD after starting high school, so a lot of them were not being confirmed. By having confirmation in the 8th grade, the majority of the children are still in the parish school and the rest are still in CCD. Now there are fewer children not being confirmed.

 

[puzzleannie]

Confirmation does not require that anyone be appropriately catechized…that’s just not accurate.

yes canon law says adults and children of catechetical age must be properly prepared and disposed for the sacraments and that includes adequate catechesis. This entire discussion is focussing on law as it applies in the Latin Rite.

yes the actual age in practice and the actual order of the sacraments may differ depending on whether the child or youth has previously been baptized. The unbaptized adult (for this purpose anyone over catechetical age, usually 7) is prepared for and receives baptism, confirmation and first communion at one celebration, preferably at the Easter Vigil or at least during the Easter season. The RCIA, adapted for each country, is the normative document here (canon law is cited in the ritual book for the references).

baptized children and youth celebrate first communion (preceded by first confession) and confirmation anytime after age 7, after proper preparation geared to their age and understanding. The bishops of each national bishops conference set the age range for their country, and the bishop of each diocese sets the actual age, and the governing document is Particular Law of the Diocese Regarding Sacraments. The point it that neither the pastor, DRE, catechist or parents chooses the age and order of the sacraments. That is the bishop’s perogative.

 

[pprimeau1976]

yes canon law says adults and children of catechetical age must be properly prepared and disposed for the sacraments and that includes adequate catechesis. This entire discussion is focussing on law as it applies in the Latin Rite.

yes the actual age in practice and the actual order of the sacraments may differ depending on whether the child or youth has previously been baptized. The unbaptized adult (for this purpose anyone over catechetical age, usually 7) is prepared for and receives baptism, confirmation and first communion at one celebration, preferably at the Easter Vigil or at least during the Easter season. The RCIA, adapted for each country, is the normative document here (canon law is cited in the ritual book for the references).

baptized children and youth celebrate first communion (preceded by first confession) and confirmation anytime after age 7, after proper preparation geared to their age and understanding. The bishops of each national bishops conference set the age range for their country, and the bishop of each diocese sets the actual age, and the governing document is Particular Law of the Diocese Regarding Sacraments. The point it that neither the pastor, DRE, catechist or parents chooses the age and order of the sacraments. That is the bishop’s perogative.

So in the USA do the bishops care if a 13 year old isn’t ready? I can see the prudence of the bishops for not giving the sacraments out to younger children. But what effect will the sacrament have if it is done under false pretenses? For example, if a couple gets married under false pretenses, the church declares that the sacrament never happened. What happens when kids don’t believe and are forced by their parents to be confirmed. Isn’t it a false confirmation?

I know that this is really challenging, but even Pope Benedict said (I apologize for the lack of source) that he prefers a smaller church if it means that the faith of the flock was greater. I know he doesn’t mean to set out excommunicating people - I don’t think that is in the Holy Father’s character - despite being the “Panzer Cardinal” as the media loved to label him.

 

[H_Opey]

Hopeful,
We, as parents, are the first teachers of our children.
I would really pray as to why you do not want to comply, because some of the things you mention you could do at home. PSR and CCD was to HELP US parents IF we need it. We are personally having our own battle with confirmation…we WANT and our children WANT to be confirmed earlier than allowed in our diocese. Have you had a chance to talk with your priest? If you do prayerfully decide to wait (which I hope you don’t), I would at least in letter, explain to your priest why you and your husband chose this.
I would love to see confirmation combined with baptism OR as your parish has it. We are looking at the benefits from the sacrament. And lets face it…if the parents are not involved and stong in their faith…it isn’t gonna make much of a difference if they are confirmed at 10 days or 8 yrs is it? WE make the biggest impact on our children.

So do you have a RIGHT to NOT have your child confirmed…yes I guess you would.

 

[puzzleannie]

Confirmation does not require that anyone be appropriately catechized…that’s just not accurate.

you need to visit the RCIA Complaint Department Threads to find a differing opinion, you also need to consult particular law on sacraments for your diocese on what constitutes Confirmation preparation and catechesis.

 

[Sr_Sally]

Ensuring that your children are properly taught is a parental duty whether the child has confirmation at 15, 10, or 5. That can be done by sending them to CCD classes or with teaching at home. That duty never changes despite what the prevailing wind is about when children should get confirmed.

I can’t say what is right or wrong. I can speak from experience. I was confirmed at age 16 and had to go to ccd classes until we were confirmed. As much as I hated it, and as much as I seemed to not learn what I should have, I did get SOMETHING out of all those years of ccd and religion classes. The last 3 years before confirmation was spent in a seperate group of classes for teens with lots of special programs for kids that age. I didn’t like them then, but as I look back now as a revert, I can see it was good for me.

My sister’s kids on the other hand had their first communion and confirmation at the same time. Now she doesn’t send them anywhere for ccd or religion classes, and she pretty much sees it as her job being over and done with as far as formation. They were confirmed at an early age, and basically won’t get those formation classes like I did in my early years. I fear that they do not and will not know their catholic faith because of this.

If I had kids in formation, whether or not they were confirmed early or late I’d want them in religion classes or ccd or formation throughout their teen years. And I do think that youth masses aimed at younger kids would be great!

 

[Brendan]

you need to visit the RCIA Complaint Department Threads to find a differing opinion, you also need to consult particular law on sacraments for your diocese on what constitutes Confirmation preparation and catechesis.

Frommi is pretty much correct on this issue. The Sacrament, by it’s Nature, does not require cathechisis.

Particular Law might, but the Church as a whole does not.

This is particularly well shown in the Eastern Catholic Churches, which offer the Sacrament to infants.

The Sacrament is a conferal of Grace that is beneficial to all who recieve it in a State of Grace. That includes infants and the uncatechized.