Maynooth Gospel Choir on EWTN -- Violet Stoles?

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I am watching a re-run of the Mass at the Eucharistic Conference in Dublin, Ireland on EWTN. Why is the Maynooth Gospel Choir (largely if not all women) wearing what appears to be black cassocks (probably black choir robes) and more importantly violet stoles? Stoles are the sign of authority of the ordained in the Church. I don’t think any group should wear any liturgical stoles at a Catholic Mass except for bishops, priests, deacons and the like. Their stoles are a bad idea from thousands of miles away.

Yes, I know that people will claim they are not stoles (yeah, right) but the symbolism (by design I am sure) is extremely clear. Why allow this sort of garbage? It really is a big deal…

simonsonephotoadayplog.files.wordpress.com/2012/01/nuim_choir.jpg
 
Laetus said:
I am watching a re-run of the Mass at the Eucharistic Conference in Dublin, Ireland on EWTN. Why is the Maynooth Gospel Choir (largely if not all women) wearing what appears to be black cassocks (probably black choir robes) and more importantly violet stoles? Stoles are the sign of authority of the ordained in the Church. I don’t any group should wear any liturgical stoles at a Catholic Mass except for bishops, priests, deacons and the like. Their stoles are a bad idea from thousands of miles away.

Yes, I know that people will claim they are not stoles (yeah, right) but the symbolism (by design I am sure) is extremely clear. Why allow this sort of garbage?

simonsonephotoadayplog.files.wordpress.com/2012/01/nuim_choir.jpg
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I’ve also wondered about this. People say they aren’t stoles, but if they look like stoles, lay people have no place wearing them in any liturgical or para-liturgical context.
 
Are these the outfits you refer to?
youtube.com/watch?v=cbgIaih4xYQ

When I was in choir in high school, our choir robes had stoles. It was pretty clear they were part of the uniform, and no one with any sense could mistake us for a group of clerics.

The stoles on this group seem longer and more poorly done. Even so, I agree with you that the symbolism is clear - they are designed in the tradition of African-American gospel choirs.
Here’s a similar outfit, with shorter white stoles:
mostlyjunkfood.com/take-%E2%80%98em-to-church-10-hip-hop-and-rb-songs-with-that-gospel-feel/

The pastor or bishop is free to ask the invited group not to wear its usual attire, but in the absence of something being offensive that would be an unlikely request.
superamazingman said:
People say they aren’t stoles
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Who says they aren’t stoles?
 
If this is not in a liturgical context, then it does not matter. Stoles are worn by some honors graduates, as well as other non-liturgical functions.

If, however, the stole is worn in the context of a liturgy, one would have to look into what the context is. For example, for a joint gathering for the Ecumenical Patriarch of Constantinople in Atlanta, a black gospel choir from a local Protestant ecclesiastical community participated. Obviously, this is part of their particular dress, which should be respected. Another example would be the stole given to the king or queen at his or her coronation which, though in the liturgical context of a “Eucharist” (although we know it is not), does not represent any ordination or Holy Orders.

One must also remember that the stole did not develop solely as a liturgical garb, and existed long before Catholicism. Therefore, one cannot strictly limit the stole’s use to only liturgical functions and to those functions performed by one with Holy Orders.

That said, one must think long and hard before doing as you described. A layperson being confused with an ordained clergy can cause problems - practical, liturgical, and spiritual.
 
bmadamsberry said:
If this is not in a liturgical context, then it does not matter. Stoles are worn by some honors graduates, as well as other non-liturgical functions.

If, however, the stole is worn in the context of a liturgy, one would have to look into what the context is. For example, for a joint gathering for the Ecumenical Patriarch of Constantinople in Atlanta, a black gospel choir from a local Protestant ecclesiastical community participated. Obviously, this is part of their particular dress, which should be respected. Another example would be the stole given to the king or queen at his or her coronation which, though in the liturgical context of a “Eucharist” (although we know it is not), does not represent any ordination or Holy Orders.

One must also remember that the stole did not develop solely as a liturgical garb, and existed long before Catholicism. Therefore, one cannot strictly limit the stole’s use to only liturgical functions and to those functions performed by one with Holy Orders.

That said, one must think long and hard before doing as you described. A layperson being confused with an ordained clergy can cause problems - practical, liturgical, and spiritual.
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It was wrong for this group to wear them given that they performed just prior to a Mass.
 
Laetus said:
It was wrong for this group to wear them given that they performed just prior to a Mass.
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If it was prior to a Mass, then it was not during Mass.

I wasn’t there and haven’t seen it, but simply based upon the information I’ve read on this thread, I don’t see what the big deal is. It’s obvious that they weren’t priests, deacons, or bishops, and there is no way they could be confused with some liturgical function that requires Holy Orders because it was not done within Mass.

Will one ban belts because the priest wears a cinture? What about wearing a cross around one’s neck, because a bishop does? What about wearing a ring, which the bishop wears as a sign of his office?
 
Anyone with a grain of common sense can see that these stoles are not priestly stoles .
 
arkwright said:
Anyone with a grain of common sense can see that these stoles are not priestly stoles .
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And anyone with a grain of common sense can see that no type of stole should be worn in the liturgy by lay-people.
 
They were NOT taking part in the Liturgy. Their prominent role was in the 'warm up 'to the Liturgy.

They are a Gospel Choir and so tend to dress as Gospel Choirs usually do . You could call it a uniform - as the choristers in the Palestrina Choir wear a uniform
 
superamazingman said:
And anyone with a grain of common sense can see that no type of stole should be worn in the liturgy by lay-people.
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So make sure that you never wear a scarf around your neck in the liturgy because a lot of silly people on this forum will accuse you of wearing a stole . 😃
 
I think the stole is the symbol of power of office, and should not be worn by the laity. On the other hand I get a catalog from one of the big Catholic supply houses each year with an array of stoles for confirmandi. I have to presume that most bishops do not object.
 
(Please Note: This uploaded content is no longer available.)
“I am OUTRAGED that lay people stole a priest’s garment! This is an outrage! Stealing is so wrong! . . . . Nevermind.” 🙂
 
Joe_Kelley said:
I think the stole is the symbol of power of office, and should not be worn by the laity. On the other hand I get a catalog from one of the big Catholic supply houses each year with an array of stoles for confirmandi. I have to presume that most bishops do not object.
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I think more bishops object than do not. I know mine does strongly.

Many catholic supply stores also sell overstoles. That doesn’t mean they’re ok to use either.

Having confirmandi wear any sort of stole is wrong on so many levels. We shouldn’t concede that just because some bishop’s don’t care.
 
superamazingman said:
I think more bishops object than do not. I know mine does strongly.

Many catholic supply stores also sell overstoles. That doesn’t mean they’re ok to use either.

Having confirmandi wear any sort of stole is wrong on so many levels. We shouldn’t concede that just because some bishop’s don’t care.
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Seems that claiming publicly that “some bishops don’t care” is much more wrong than any mere choice of fashion.
 
I thought the choir stoles were in poor taste. I thought almost the entire opening (as shown on EWTN) was in poor taste. This is my opinion,

I wonder if ‘catholic sensibility’ is dead.
 
Stylites said:
Seems that claiming publicly that “some bishops don’t care” is much more wrong than any mere choice of fashion.
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Well, it’s true, and there’s bishops that “don’t care” about much greater issues as well.
 
Joe_Kelley said:
I think the stole is the symbol of power of office, and should not be worn by the laity. On the other hand I get a catalog from one of the big Catholic supply houses each year with an array of stoles for confirmandi. I have to presume that most bishops do not object.
Click to expand...
My bishop sent out letters to all his pastors that the children being confirmed were not to wear stoles of any kind.
 
The Choir robes worn by the choirs will remind us that the mass is a solemn celebration with God. The Stoles they use symbolizes that they honor God as they sing praises and worship to God, the songs of the mass is a part of the liturgy; so as choir, they should wear those stuffs to give formality to a group and to remind the people who attend the mass that they are listening to God’s word and that they should focus their attention to GOD. 🙂

I’ am a choir member in our parish, in our group we pick the best quality of fabric that will long last, we choose Churchgoers Choir Robes. Wearing a choir robe with stole during mass, feels like I’m an angel singing praises to GOD. :):)🙂
 
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