Meaningful life after divorce?

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Psych77

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OK, I am not technically divorced. My wife and I are sleeping separately, and she has told me that she no longer wants to attempt a reconciliation, no longer wants to speak, no longer wants to have anything to do with each other apart from raising the children.

And yes, I love to spend time with my children - all six of them! But I need some time to be with other adults. People I can treat as equals, and maybe even develop close enough relationships that eventually I can look to them for support.

Up until now, I am afraid, I have had a really hard time making friends. My social skills stink (since I was a child) and unfortunately I was using my marriage (when I still had one) as my primary (read: only) source of social interaction and support. And yes, that was just one of the myriad of problems that contributed to the collapse of a 19 year marriage.

I live in central Massachusetts, where the practice of Catholicism is so alive and enthusiastic it might as well wear a toe tag. So, there is not a lot of chance to get involved with a group that focuses on spiritual development and support (which I would love). But it seems that most secular social venues are largely focusd on finding a romantic partner (which is no longer an option for me, obviously) or, worse, just “hooking up.”

I know that in more than one way my isolation is my own fault. But I do feel very lonely, and the loneliness gives occasion to a lot of temptation. And anyway, regardless of how much is my own fault, I still have the rest of my life to live, and I want to live it right, and meaningfully.

Any ideas on how I can stop being so isolated? Have some more sense of purpose in my life, apart from just making a living for my family and spending time with my kids (after all, they will eventually grow up, and then I will have to have something else in my life)?

Anybody have some advice on how to live a celibate, divorced life that isn’t just centered on grieving and bitterness?
 
Well, if you feel the way you do about spiritual life and your area, maybe others do also. I’d suggest working towards setting up a group for you and those people.

Another suggestion is to do some volunteer work.
 
There is a monastery in Petersham, MA (I think it is between Springfield and Worcester.) I know some lay Catholic men go there on retreat. Might be a good place to start for some spiritual renewal. I’m not suggesting you become a monk, but through them you might be able to meet some other like-minded Catholic lay men nearby. Here is their website if you wanted to contact them.
maronitemonks.org/wp/
 
I’d second the suggestion of volunteer work. You’ll get out of the house, meet new people, and spend some time focusing on others. It would really be good for you.
I saw your other post, also, and I’m so sorry for what you’re going through. Will pray for you both.
 
agnes_therese said:
I’d second the suggestion of volunteer work. You’ll get out of the house, meet new people, and spend some time focusing on others. It would really be good for you.
I saw your other post, also, and I’m so sorry for what you’re going through. Will pray for you both.
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I am so sorry for your troubles.
I will third the Volunteer idea.
And there’s another monastery in Spencer MA that has retreats, as well. I am anxious to go there one day for this. It’s a beautiful day trip, too. So beautiful.

spencerabbey.org/

With prayers for you and the family.
 
Many great ideas here.

I second starting a group for others who want to increase their Catholic faith. You might be the one to apply the shock paddles and knock the toe tag off!

Maybe you can find some groups through meetup.com for things that interest you? Get involved in your kids’ activities?

Have you dug into why you might struggle socially? Counseling?

I am divorced and find my meaning in doing my best to raise my children to love God. In living a life that will be pleasing to God in the end, and praying that I will continue to do better at that. Our meaning ultimately comes from doing His will.
 
  1. volunteer work
  2. Take a non-credit “fun” class at a community college. Choose something that is interesting to you and you will meet other people who share that interest. This makes it easier to establish rapport and talk to people.
  3. See if there is a class in your area that teaches social skills. Yes, there are places that do teach this. It might be awkward at first, but let yourself make mistakes.
 
Psych77 said:
…But I do feel very lonely, and the loneliness gives occasion to a lot of temptation. And anyway, regardless of how much is my own fault, I still have the rest of my life to live, and I want to live it right, and meaningfully…

Anybody have some advice on how to live a celibate, divorced life that isn’t just centered on grieving and bitterness?
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The most important advice I can offer to you is to become the best Catholic you can – and to do so requires prayer – constantly, no matter how you feel or no matter what’s going on. If you are struggling in prayer, this is a good reason in itself to visit with a priest for guidance.

My diocese has “New Beginnings”, which is a ministry to divorced, separated and widowed Catholics. Maybe you can check out if your diocese offers something helpful to you, even if you’re not technically divorced:
Catholic Divorce Ministry: nacsdc.org/index.shtml
– Massachusetts: nacsdc.org/rgn/r1/r1ma.html

Volunteering or attending Bible study sessions might also help you with your social needs.

Enjoy your children! They need to see the light of Christ’s love in you.
 
Psych77 said:
OK, I am not technically divorced. My wife and I are sleeping separately, and she has told me that she no longer wants to attempt a reconciliation, no longer wants to speak, no longer wants to have anything to do with each other apart from raising the children.

And yes, I love to spend time with my children - all six of them! But I need some time to be with other adults. People I can treat as equals, and maybe even develop close enough relationships that eventually I can look to them for support.

Up until now, I am afraid, I have had a really hard time making friends. My social skills stink (since I was a child) and unfortunately I was using my marriage (when I still had one) as my primary (read: only) source of social interaction and support. And yes, that was just one of the myriad of problems that contributed to the collapse of a 19 year marriage.

I live in central Massachusetts, where the practice of Catholicism is so alive and enthusiastic it might as well wear a toe tag. So, there is not a lot of chance to get involved with a group that focuses on spiritual development and support (which I would love). But it seems that most secular social venues are largely focusd on finding a romantic partner (which is no longer an option for me, obviously) or, worse, just “hooking up.”

I know that in more than one way my isolation is my own fault. But I do feel very lonely, and the loneliness gives occasion to a lot of temptation. And anyway, regardless of how much is my own fault, I still have the rest of my life to live, and I want to live it right, and meaningfully.

Any ideas on how I can stop being so isolated? Have some more sense of purpose in my life, apart from just making a living for my family and spending time with my kids (after all, they will eventually grow up, and then I will have to have something else in my life)?

Anybody have some advice on how to live a celibate, divorced life that isn’t just centered on grieving and bitterness?
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How can you two live together and never speak? What does your children think about this? You two really need marriage counseling. I know she won’t go with you, so go alone. Your kids will need counseling soon anyway when they see their parents being so mean to each other if only just psychologically. It’s not good for them.

I guess you have also given up if you are only looking for a way not to be so lonely with outside people. You need to watch the movie, “Fireproof” and read the book. That man thought his marriage was dead as well but he worked on it by doing things for his wife. She came around slowly to trust him again.
 
HMM I hadn’t thought about that one myself. Find a “Love Dare” book. I have a 40 day one, my daughter and son-in-law have a year one. Basically it gives a short reading each day and something to do for your spouse. Like one day the “dare” is “Contact your spouse sometime during the business of the day. Have no agenda other than asking how he or she is doing and if there is anything you could do for them.” In my book there is also a space at the end of each days reading and dare for you to make notes.
 
Psych77 said:
…

Anybody have some advice on how to live a celibate, divorced life that isn’t just centered on grieving and bitterness?

…
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Ok, I’m divorced with my marriage declared null. Married 21 years, Wife left in Jan 2010, divorce final August 2010, filed for declaration of nullity August 2011, marriage declared null October 2012.

First, sit down and list all your blessings. For your kids to exist, you had to get together with your wife-- never, ever forget that. Never tell your kids you regret your marriage, ever. It carries an implication that you regret them. Thank God for your marriage, the good times you had, your kids, the air you breathe, your health, ability to see color, hear good music, watch a bird in flight— any and everything you can think of. Part of your life sucks. Other parts are great- don’t forget them.

Next. Who are you? Not what you do, what you’ve accomplished. But what are the values and attitudes that make you the person you are. Psych 77 is …? What? If you aren’t a bitter person do not let this change you into one. That is a choice we make. How we react to life. Don’t get me wrong, you will get down at times, you will get frustrated, you will wonder why this is happening. But you must decide if Psych 77 is a bitter person, or someone who will not let the negative overcome the positive.

List all the things you know you enjoy doing and those things you’re interested in and haven’t tried. I don’t care if its extreme sports or quilting. Or volunteering. Ever thought about becoming a catechist and teach CCD? You could choose an activity that one of your kids is interested in as well and do it together.

Get the phone book out, find groups in your areas of interest. Or classes at the Junior College. Sign up for at least one.

You will not get a social life by staying home and brooding. I’m probably the worst one to give you this advice as I have my kids full time and just barely find the time to do laundry, cooking, cleaning, yard-work, help with homework etc. (still single and not even dating, don’t have the time…when the last kid leaves maybe…) But I’ve met folks in groups I’m interested in joining and stay in touch for when I have the time. Join groups and learn skills you are interested in - playing an instrument, dancing, SCUBA – whatever.

It’s natural for you to grieve right now because, I suspect that even though you seem to have given up, you really haven’t. As long as you and your wife are living under these conditions you have hope. That can crush, and grieving will continue as long as the marriage is in the process of dying vice dead. Only you know how much of that you can take.

Pray always, be good to your wife, try to be the kind of person she would want to be with, no one wants to be with a bitter, angry person. If the opportunity presents itself- suggest counseling, marriage encounter, retrovaille etc.

Look at yourself in the mirror every day and choose to be the person you want to be vice allowing life to change you into someone else. Psych77 is…?
 
All life has a meaning, it’s just difficult to grasp at that meaning in difficult situations. But it comes down to resisting the gloom and being able to do our job and even perhaps enjoy life despite the problems. It can be hard to resist the impulse to shut off the external world and keep focusing on the problems instead.
 
Psych77 said:
Up until now, I am afraid, I have had a really hard time making friends. My social skills stink (since I was a child) and unfortunately I was using my marriage (when I still had one) as my primary (read: only) source of social interaction and support. And yes, that was just one of the myriad of problems that contributed to the collapse of a 19 year marriage.

I live in central Massachusetts, where the practice of Catholicism is so alive and enthusiastic it might as well wear a toe tag. So, there is not a lot of chance to get involved with a group that focuses on spiritual development and support (which I would love). But it seems that most secular social venues are largely focusd on finding a romantic partner (which is no longer an option for me, obviously) or, worse, just “hooking up.”

Anybody have some advice on how to live a celibate, divorced life that isn’t just centered on grieving and bitterness?
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Being divorced IS NOT a death sentence! You WILL NOT be a pariah simply for being divorced.

You can still be an active part of the community - even the parish community - if you are divorced. Focus on serving others within the parish and the community. You can be a part of a group that focuses on spiritual development and support. Someone has mentioned groups for divorced, separated and widowed Catholics.

Someone also mentioned counseling, which I would also highly recommend - not just for getting though the separation and possible divorce, but also for your low self-esteem and lack of social skills.

You will be in my prayers…
 
If you are not actually divorced at this time, I would caution strongly against it. It is a horrible experience for all involved, especially the children. This is not to say that those who’ve survived have not demonstrated great pluck in doing so.

Right now, it probably seems as though your life can’t get much worse. Believe me, it can. On another thread I beleive you intimated that you can not afford to live separately, and hence you are lving under the same roof. How/when would you ever expect this to change?

Reconcilation can take a long time, and if living under the same roof is not actually impeding it, I’d hang in there.
 
oneofmany said:
You two really need marriage counseling. I know she won’t go with you, so go alone. …

…You need to watch the movie, “Fireproof” and read the book. That man thought his marriage was dead as well but he worked on it by doing things for his wife. She came around slowly to trust him again.
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I realize I have to resist my own reaction of placing my experiences over what I read. The OP didn’t give any clue what the issues are in the marriage. It could be that he can do something that will change her heart, if it was something in his treatment of her that led to this.

However, when there were problems in my marriage, I read and followed the advice of just about every “How to Save Your Marriage” and then “How to Save Your Marriage By Yourself” book ever written. The more I tried to be a better and better wife, the more my (ex) husband just got the idea he could carry on with what he was up to.

If he hasn’t looked into those things, they may well be worth looking into, but one of the hard things about a marriage falling apart is other people blaming the victim and saying they just didn’t try hard enough. Sometimes, one spouse is not going to be swayed, no matter what, and nothing in the world will change that.
 
Increase acts of charity: spiritual & corporal works of mercy. Spiritual acts of mercy at Mass, Adoration Chapel, and private prayer. Corporal works of mercy at soup kitchens, serving all people.

Goto catholic retreates & seminars like, RCIA, That Man is you, Theology on Tap, Catholics come home.

The CCC says there is great grace in chastity: "2349 “People should cultivate [chastity] in the way that is suited to their state of life. Some profess virginity or consecrated celibacy which enables them to give themselves to God alone with an undivided heart in a remarkable manner. Others live in the way prescribed for all by the moral law, whether they are married or single.” Married people are called to live conjugal chastity; others practice chastity in continence:

There are three forms of the virtue of chastity: the first is that of spouses, the second that of widows, and the third that of virgins. We do not praise any one of them to the exclusion of the others. . . . This is what makes for the richness of the discipline of the Church."
scborromeo.org/ccc/para/2349.htm
 
My prayers are with you!

I am divorced and have a decree of nullity (2007), and one young son. Although I am free to marry in the Church, I know that my son needs me to remain single for now ANC just be his mom. So I’ve been celibate and closed (not open) to dating for six years now.

Celibacy can be a heavy cross to carry, but I have grown so much from choosing chastity and the teachings of the Catholic Church.

As for bitterness and grief, both are natural, and if your marriage ends in divorce, you will feel bitterness and grief off and on for the rest of your life. Others have given great advice, especially counseling with a Catholic counselor. You might try Catholic Therapists to find a reference.

The big regret of my life is that I didn’t really fight for my marriage. As Colorado is a no-fault divorce state, I didn’t think I had any choice but to go along with everything. I don’t know what you’ve tried already to save your marriage, but I am praying for you during this time.

Pray and pray and pray!

God bless you.

Gertie
 
Sorry I haven’t replied for a long time. Things suddenly picked up at work, and I did not have a lot of time to go online.

You guys gave me a lot to think about.

Initially, as I read some of the ideas you gave me, I would find myself becoming stressed. Then, when I read Styrgwillidar’s post, I realized why - I am similar in that, when my responsibilities are fulfilled, I have little time left. I work 50-60 hours a week to make ends meet, then get home and eat dinner, help the kids do the dishes, read to them and put them to bed. By that time, I am exhausted, and I usually can’t get more than 6 hours of sleep a night.

So, I guess that is part of my problem…I am really lonely (for adult company, especially someone who can understand my situation), but I don’t want to lose the time I have with my kids - that is the one part of married life I have been successful with; I am a big part of their lives.

Holyrood - I have a good idea why I struggle socially - I am diagnosed with Asperger’s disorder (now renamed as “Autism Spectrum Disorder” - yay). That is probably a contributing factor to the marital breakup. It seems that my lack of social insight makes me an incredibly annoying and frustrating companion. My wife is constantly annoyed with me, and tells me that my mistakes are intentional and passive-aggressive (yes, she knows about the diagnosis, and even anticipated it). Unfortunately that got us into arguments, and in the last few years before the breakup, I would get so upset I would scream at her, and intrude on her personal space, leaving her feeling threatened and intimidated. Of course, intimidation of your spouse constitute spousal abuse, and at her request I went to a 40 week batterer’s intervention program. Less than halfway through it, she told me she no longer wanted to speak, go to counseling (which we had done numerous times, and we were in counseling together at the time) or make any further attempts to recover the marriage. She wanted us to live as though there were nothing between us except the children. She ended the conversation by saying, “As far as I’m concerned, this marriage is irrevocably broken.” I remember the exact words - they’ll stick in my mind for the rest of my life.

It stinks for the kids, but we seldom get in any arguments anymore, and I hope that by keeping both of their parents in the house with them and both of us being there for them they will at least grow up feeling secure and cared for. Then maybe they won’t carry this pattern for marriage into their lives.
 
Can you get your wife to go to church with you on the weekends? Take the children and go as a family. I hope you are doing this anyway but I think that would be very important no matter what else the two of you do.
 
Get yourself into counseling to deal with the grief and loneliness. You really need to talk about that, and you are going to have a lot more to unload than what even the most devoted friends will be equipped to cope with. Even if they’re devoted, they’re not going to know what to tell you. A trained counselor can help you to learn skills to get yourself through this with less suffering and anxiety…how to deal with the stress, how to deal with your other relationships, how to communicate with your in-house estranged wife, how to look to the future in a constructive way. Your physician may be able to refer you, and very often insurance covers a certain amount of counseling per year (with a co-pay, of course). Your pastor may have ideas, too. (Do look at whether your insurance has a list of “preferred providers”.)

As for just needing a real unpaid human relationship with someone you can like and be liked by, a lot of times you can socialize with dads you meet as a result of your kids doing stuff with their kids. For instance, I know youth baseball coaches who play on their own team on Sundays. If you like sports at all, that is a way that guys tend to like to socialize…they play the game, they go out after the game and talk about their game and about sports, they forget their jobs and their other troubles. If they are smart, they don’t drink enough that they wind up talking about their marriage or work troubles too much, although that happens, too. You’re better off getting a counselor to help you work through your marriage troubles, and just be friends to each other to your guy friends. It is not as if your marriage problems are a taboo subject, I don’t mean that, but try to make mutual enjoyment of each other’s company your main goal with the guys. Avoid saying too much about difficult topics unless you are both soliciting that conversation topic. Give the other guy lots of “outs”, and look for any sign he’d like to change the subject, that is what I mean.

The other things the guys I know like to do are fishing, golfing, tennis, snowmobiling, waterskiing, and hunting. They like doing things together, and that way they can keep the conversation as shallow, non-existent, or as deep as they feel inclined.

You might also want to find what the Knights of Columbus or St. Vincent de Paul are up to, or Habitat for Humanity. Again: the guys I know like to make friends by doing things together, particularly if they’re not great conversationalists. For women, I’d suggest volunteering or group activities where there is more of a chance to talk–book clubs, that kind of thing.

Speaking of, you’re still married, so be a friend to your wife, even if she won’t let you be a lover. Encourage your wife to get out herself, to join a book club or have lunch with her friends. She might not think much of you as a husband, but if you are a good friend to her, it might cut the tension considerably. It might also upset some unfair “tapes” she has running in her head about you. Certainly if you and she don’t get on together, your children might enjoy you each when you’re caring for them alone. It is something to consider.

I’m sorry you have to go through this. Good luck and hang in there!!
 
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