Melanie Joy on the ideology of Carnism

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spencelo said:
Educational literature: farmsanctuary.org/learn/educational-literature/
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This site refers one to a number of articles. I have looked at two so far, and they are wildly inaccurate. They are so full of nonsense that one hardly knows where to begin. But three quick examples:

Under “Beef”. Contrary to this article, almost no cattle are ever branded. That practice creates a blemish on the hide, reducing its value and that of the animal. There is almost no “open range” anymore, so it isn’t needed for identification, other than as a protection against theft, as some believe. But branding is not really effective in protecting theft, and most know it. The article pretends that most cattle are branded, when almost none are.
Never, ever have I seen anybody put cuts on an animal’s neck for identification. I have seen thousands upon thousands of cattle and have never seen it even once. It would be stupid to do it, dangerous to attempt it, and totally unnecessary.

Under the same topic, it is preposterous to claim that cattle on open pastures die from the elements. They are very well equipped by nature to do it if they are adequately fed and watered and are not ancient animals. (kind of a complicated story, and I don’t have time to fully explain why and how) I have raised cattle for decades and never had one die from the elements. In point of fact, I have not had a cow die for years from any cause. All cattle will die wherever they are if they get old enough. It’s stupid to allow that. You cull cattle and don’t let that happen. I will admit that in the most northern parts of the U.S., they provide shelter for cattle, which is more related to feeding than to the cold, as I understand. But in the three states in which most cattle are raised (Tx, Ok & Mo) and with which I am most familiar, nobody does it because they’re healthier outside than inside.

Under “poultry”. Contrary to this article, chickens are NOT hung then dipped into an electrified bath. That’s just absurd. I have been in poultry plants, and that’s now how it works.

Nobody should believe this stuff.
 
Ridgerunner said:
Under “poultry”. Contrary to this article, chickens are NOT hung then dipped into an electrified bath. That’s just absurd. I have been in poultry plants, and that’s now how it works.

Nobody should believe this stuff.
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It also claims that chickens have a uterus:rolleyes:
 
april32010 said:
and i would bet your one of those VII clown mass devotees.:tsktsk: :whackadoo:
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i apologize ,in the spirit of ecumenism i will admit that i do enjoy BACON!!!with many of the other varitites of Carnism,the fullness of the truth of Carnism is found in BACON!!!
 
april32010 said:
vegetable soup ?:confused:
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Yes, it doesn’t exactly ring right, but the truth is that bacon is the universal flavoring.🙂

My son in law makes chili with bacon in it. I know it sounds odd, but it really is good.
 
april32010 said:
i apologize ,in the spirit of ecumenism i will admit that i do enjoy BACON!!!with many of the other varitites of Carnism,the fullness of the truth of Carnism is found in BACON!!!
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Solo bacon is wrong. People should not believe in that approach. Come to Texas and you will see that tradition is consistent with beef first and pork second 😦
 
Cristiano said:
Solo bacon is wrong. People should not believe in that approach. Come to Texas and you will see that tradition is consistent with beef first and pork second 😦
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I don’t have to go to Texas to know that. As between a good beef steak and pork of any kind, I’ll take the steak. But even you will have to admit that bacon is excellent flavoring. I know Texans are proud of their chili, so I won’t say chili is improved with some bacon in it notwithstanding that my son in law makes a wonderful chili that way.
 
Ridgerunner said:
I don’t have to go to Texas to know that. As between a good beef steak and pork of any kind, I’ll take the steak. But even you will have to admit that bacon is excellent flavoring. I know Texans are proud of their chili, so I won’t say chili is improved with some bacon in it notwithstanding that my son in law makes a wonderful chili that way.
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Hence the bacon that I wrap around my filet!
 
Ridgerunner said:
I don’t have to go to Texas to know that. As between a good beef steak and pork of any kind, I’ll take the steak. But even you will have to admit that bacon is excellent flavoring. I know Texans are proud of their chili, so I won’t say chili is improved with some bacon in it notwithstanding that my son in law makes a wonderful chili that way.
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I would probably agree with you only if the bacon is not sliced but in big chuncks with the rind on (chinese style) and not cooked too much that it renders all the fat.
http://www.seriouseats.com/images/201104229-chinese-bacon3.jpg
 
Oh my gosh…you guys are making me HUNGRY!

I’m making home-made pizza tonight with lots of animal based toppings…
 
At least Ms. Joy admits that her denial of carnism is rooted in a denial of human exceptionalism. In another thread spencelo repeatedly denied that his argument was based on this principle. Now at least we can move on from that charade.
 
Ridgerunner said:
This site refers one to a number of articles. I have looked at two so far, and they are wildly inaccurate. They are so full of nonsense that one hardly knows where to begin. But three quick examples:

Under “Beef”. Contrary to this article, almost no cattle are ever branded. That practice creates a blemish on the hide, reducing its value and that of the animal. There is almost no “open range” anymore, so it isn’t needed for identification, other than as a protection against theft, as some believe. But branding is not really effective in protecting theft, and most know it. The article pretends that most cattle are branded, when almost none are.
Never, ever have I seen anybody put cuts on an animal’s neck for identification. I have seen thousands upon thousands of cattle and have never seen it even once. It would be stupid to do it, dangerous to attempt it, and totally unnecessary.

Under the same topic, it is preposterous to claim that cattle on open pastures die from the elements. They are very well equipped by nature to do it if they are adequately fed and watered and are not ancient animals. (kind of a complicated story, and I don’t have time to fully explain why and how) I have raised cattle for decades and never had one die from the elements. In point of fact, I have not had a cow die for years from any cause. All cattle will die wherever they are if they get old enough. It’s stupid to allow that. You cull cattle and don’t let that happen. I will admit that in the most northern parts of the U.S., they provide shelter for cattle, which is more related to feeding than to the cold, as I understand. But in the three states in which most cattle are raised (Tx, Ok & Mo) and with which I am most familiar, nobody does it because they’re healthier outside than inside.

Under “poultry”. Contrary to this article, chickens are NOT hung then dipped into an electrified bath. That’s just absurd. I have been in poultry plants, and that’s now how it works.

Nobody should believe this stuff.
Click to expand...
Why not contest the factual claims with information that is backed up by evidence that we can examine? In other words, why not support your assertions with well-sourced links?
 
Marc_Anthony said:
At least Ms. Joy admits that her denial of carnism is rooted in a denial of human exceptionalism. In another thread spencelo repeatedly denied that his argument was based on this principle. Now at least we can move on from that charade.
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I’ve been fully upfront about my position, but again, the argument I pushed in the other thread (difference between bullfighting and meat-consumption) doesn’t assume the denial of human exceptionalism.
 
spencelo said:
Why not contest the factual claims with information that is backed up by evidence that we can examine? In other words, why not support your assertions with well-sourced links?
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Interesting. You don’t trust his personal experiences?
 
Marc_Anthony said:
Interesting. You don’t trust his personal experiences?
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One person’s individual experiences are necessarily very limited, and I only have his claim of alleged inaccuracy, which I weigh against the numerous sources that tell me otherwise. So no, his unsupported assertions of inaccuracy aren’t entitled to much weight .
 
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