Merged: Do I need confession?Venial vs. Mortal

[ACanthony]

Hello all- My girlfriend and I usually say the Rosary over the phone together before we go to sleep. I was especially tired last night but obviously still wanted to say it with her, as I know it strengthens both of us. My girlfriend doesn’t go to bed for a few hours after me, so I guess she was in a talking mood. She had been very bothered by an experience that happened to her a few hours earlier in one of her psychology classes. Her psychology professor started the story by saying, “Whenever I tell this story, something evil always happens to me, so please pray for me and pray for yourselves too.” (obviously she should not have told this story, particularly because it was a night class!). The story was that a client was seeking help from this psychologist for lack of sleep. The client in the story said ever since he was real little he never got more than 1 hour of sleep each night. So the psychology professor asked the guy what his earliest childhood memory was and he told her (leaving out much details) that his Mom was in a Satanic cult and the Mom and his brothers would wake him up in the middle of the night and beat him. Right after my girlfriend told me the story, I jokingly told her thanks for telling me right before bed! She clearly had been troubled upon listening to the story (rightfully so) and she got very panicked right after I told her she shouldn’t have told me, and was fearful that something bad would happen to her (or me). We then began the Rosary but I could just feel a sense unease or even evil. I could tell my girlfriend was a having a tough time with the Rosary too. Well, after that, even though I was dog tired, I could not sleep one bit and turned on the computer for distraction. I just continued to feel unease and (in what seemed like a complete daze) I started looking at images I shouldn’t have (I have a porn blocker set up to prevent me from that, but the images were not pure at all). After I snapped out of it, I was tempted to do other things but instead somehow managed to pray myself to sleep. I went to Mass this morning and figured it would strengthen me and wipe away all venial sin. I guess my personal cross is perfection and if a mortal sin is ever in question I feel pain as I get through the day. Thank you and God Bless you for your help.

 

[ACanthony]

Hello all- I just posted a long convoluted story earlier today and I don’t blame anyone for not responding, so I will re-phrase my question here.

I struggle with purity (it’s a winning battle right now because of devotion to the Blessed Mother, daily Mass, etc.), especially at night time when I’m tired and especially if it has been an exhausting day. My question is if I begin an act of sin, take for instance, masturbation (or it can be any sin like theft for example), if I come to my senses during the sin and do not complete the act of sin (in the theft example for instance you do not actually steal the item or you begin to steal and then return it shortly after) would this still be considered a mortal sin? If I begin to masturbate and drop to my knees and pray after realizing what I’m doing and then do not sin any further, do I still commit a mortal sin?

Thank you and God Bless.

 

[pablope]

Hello all- My girlfriend and I usually say the Rosary over the phone together before we go to sleep. I was especially tired last night but obviously still wanted to say it with her, as I know it strengthens both of us. My girlfriend doesn’t go to bed for a few hours after me, so I guess she was in a talking mood. She had been very bothered by an experience that happened to her a few hours earlier in one of her psychology classes. Her psychology professor started the story by saying, “Whenever I tell this story, something evil always happens to me, so please pray for me and pray for yourselves too.” (obviously she should not have told this story, particularly because it was a night class!). The story was that a client was seeking help from this psychologist for lack of sleep. The client in the story said pray myself to sleep. I went to Mass this morning and figured it would strengthen me and wipe away all venial sin. I guess my personal cross is perfection and if a mortal sin is ever in question I feel pain as I get through the day. Thank you and God Bless you for your help.

Looks to me like you and your GF were attacked by the devil. But you kept on to the Rosary…which is the best weapon against the attacks of the devil.

If you feel like confessing, by all means, go. Even though it may not arise to mortal sin, the grace you will receive in going will far outweigh any concerns.

So…go and confess, if you feel compelled. I would say, this time, it is the Holy Spirit prompting you.

 

[ProdglArchitect]

I applaud your willpower, I wouldn’t’ have been able to stop at that point.

Because you did reject the sin once you were full aware of it, I believe it would only be counted as a venial sin. There’s no harm in confessing it though, just in case.

 

[ProdglArchitect]

Lol, I literally just responded to your post

But, I will reiterate what I said here. I believe that because you essentially came to your senses and stopped yourself from completing the act it would only be counted as a venial sin, rather than a full mortal sin. I know the Catechism has something in it about beginning to sin then turning away from the act being a lesser sin.

There are others on here who are more knowledgeable, but that is my understanding of it.

 

[JRKH]

The Catechism says Mortal sin requires Grave matter, Full knowledge and deliberate consent…Your description indicates that these are all met that the beginning of the execution of the act. Therefore…the sin would be mortal…

That said…The fact that you quickly repent…Before the sinful act is fully carried out…acts in your favor. As mentioned above…likely a lesser sin…
Certainly it demonstrates spiritual progress and this is what I would focus on rather than trying to precisely define something as mortal or venial.

The above is a very basic and broad comment on what you have written…nothing more…

Please take this matter to your confessor and be guided by his advice and recommendations.

Peace
James

 

[ChibiViolet]

If you looked at impure/immodest images in order to lust than you should definately go to Confession as soon as possible.

 

[Church_Militant]

The Catechism says Mortal sin requires Grave matter, Full knowledge and deliberate consent…Your description indicates that these are all met that the beginning of the execution of the act. Therefore…the sin would be mortal…

That said…The fact that you quickly repent…Before the sinful act is fully carried out…acts in your favor. As mentioned above…likely a lesser sin…
Certainly it demonstrates spiritual progress and this is what I would focus on rather than trying to precisely define something as mortal or venial.

The above is a very basic and broad comment on what you have written…nothing more…

Please take this matter to your confessor and be guided by his advice and recommendations.

Peace
James

Sorry James, but that’s not quite the case here.

What we have is a grave temptation that, because of God’s grace, is resisted and denied and therefore does not qualify as the necessary consent. Had he consented, he would have carried on with the sinful act, but he did not, and so it cannot be a mortal sin. If anything, it appears to be a fulfillment of James 4:7 which says, “Be subject therefore to God, but resist the devil, and he will fly from you.”

Your advice to take this to his confessor is the best that any of us can offer.

Notice below the response of Fr. Serpa to a similar question.
Is arousal without impure thoughts and actions or pornographic stimuli a sin?

 

[JRKH]

Sorry James, but that’s not quite the case here.

What we have is a grave temptation that, because of God’s grace, is resisted and denied and therefore does not qualify as the necessary consent. Had he consented, he would have carried on with the sinful act, but he did not, and so it cannot be a mortal sin. If anything, it appears to be a fulfillment of James 4:7 which says, “Be subject therefore to God, but resist the devil, and he will fly from you.”

Your advice to take this to his confessor is the best that any of us can offer.

Notice below the response of Fr. Serpa to a similar question.
Is arousal without impure thoughts and actions or pornographic stimuli a sin?

CM…
My post above was actually made solely in response to the second post by the OP - made before the merging of the two threads. Obviously the information in the first post of this, now merged, thread places a different picture on things overall…

But - to be sure…this needs to be taken to his confessor…

Peace
James

 

[thistle]

Hello all- I just posted a long convoluted story earlier today and I don’t blame anyone for not responding, so I will re-phrase my question here.

I struggle with purity (it’s a winning battle right now because of devotion to the Blessed Mother, daily Mass, etc.), especially at night time when I’m tired and especially if it has been an exhausting day. My question is if I begin an act of sin, take for instance, masturbation (or it can be any sin like theft for example), if I come to my senses during the sin and do not complete the act of sin (in the theft example for instance you do not actually steal the item or you begin to steal and then return it shortly after) would this still be considered a mortal sin? If I begin to masturbate and drop to my knees and pray after realizing what I’m doing and then do not sin any further, do I still commit a mortal sin?

Thank you and God Bless.

In terms of being a sin of grave matter masturbation does not require the act to be completed. The fact you masturbated and knew that it was a sin of grave matter means you committed a mortal sin.

 

[Church_Militant]

CM…
My post above was actually made solely in response to the second post by the OP - made before the merging of the two threads. Obviously the information in the first post of this, now merged, thread places a different picture on things overall…

But - to be sure…this needs to be taken to his confessor…

Peace
James

 

[Blue_Horizon]

In terms of being a sin of grave matter masturbation does not require the act to be completed. .

Agreed.

The fact you masturbated and knew that it was a sin of grave matter means you committed a mortal sin.

I don’t think so. Sins of concupiscence (e.g. of the flesh), by that reason, are more likely to mean that full consent is not always given. This means an examination of circumstances and context is important before making black and white judgements which easily lead to unncessary despair in the pious - especially teenagers.

I note the OP said “when I came to my senses” … doesn’t sound like full consent to me.

Persons who are otherwise God-fearing and mindful, esp if young and full of hormones, do not seriously fall in and out of sanctifying grace every 14 days or so - which is what would be happening with significant numbers of pious, confessing Catholic teenage boys (and young men) if what you say were true.

It is theologically far more sound to assume that such young men are held within the love of God constantly over time provided they are battling, though they may be sinning venially. In moral theology we distinguish between the “acts of a man” (e.g. sleep-walking)and “human acts”. Sin only applies re the latter. Human behaviour always lies on a gray continuum between the two.

If one is tired or (innocently) under the influence of concupiscence, hormones etc then behavious starts edging towards “acts of a man” which means what would normally be considered mortal may in fact be venial. However a wise person will not give themselves the benefit of the doubt in photofinish situations!

Regardless, in above case, venial sin at least should be presumed.
Because we are dealing with grave matter we must not get blazee in this area. Losing a battle doesn’t mean losing the war. But we must still keep battling and seriously, sometimes over many years.

We must aim to win every battle even if we don’t. To intend otherwise is to begin a course that will indeed one day end in mortal sin. We must also learn wisdom and avoid circumstances that will send us down a path we know we cannot control (e.g. lewd images at bed time when we are tired).

I am not at all sure of the wisdom of talking so much with your girlfriend on the phone before bed - esp when you are tired. Just because you are appearing to be doing a good thing (Rosary) does not make it wise. That is a little naiive.

God expects us to learn, from our mistakes, if we are being foolish. If we do not learn this wisdom then it becomes culpable in time, leading to mortal sin. I think you are being a bit foolish here.