Methodist and Catholics

[Lemonylyons]

I am new to this forum, but am hoping to find guidance and answers. I have attended a Methodist Church all of my life and am very active. I am recently remarried to a man who has two children. Their mother is Catholic by her own profession. The children have not been to church since I have known them, except with me. The older child is 11 and has received her first communion. Not knowing the Catholic belief that Catholics should not take communion at other churches, I asked her mother if Sarah could take communion at our church. Her mother said yes, but that the younger brother could not as he had not had his first communion yet. Sarah has taken communion at our church several times, I now know it is against Catholic law and will not allow it again.
My question is this. . . is there anything in the beliefs of the Methodist and Catholic church that would be detrimental or confusing to these children. I have attended church every Sunday for as long as I can remember, and my husband attends with me now. Suddenly, the children’s mother is saying we cannot take them to church because they are being raised Catholic. They are with us every other weekend. This poses a huge dilemma for our family. I do not want to do anything to confuse or jeopardize the kids’ spiritual well-being. However, I do not believe there is anything we teach in our Children’s Church that is contrary to the Catholic beliefs. We teach basic Biblical beliefs, basic Christianity. We do not get into Church theology or doctrine. We will not allow the kids to take Communion and will explain that they are Catholic and cannot take communion in other churches, just as we cannot take communion in their church.
Please give me your thoughts. . . and please be kind. I do not want to be lectured or chastised. I want what is best for the children who have parents with different church preferences. I know at the upper level, the Methodist and Catholic churches are in dialogue to seek communion (not the sacrament) between all Christians. I am hoping to achieve this in our blended family as well.
Thank you all in advance for your words of wisdom.
God bless
Lemony

 

[DebChris]

I often attend services with other denominations. “There is more that unites us than divides us.”
What is important to remember is that a Catholic must attend Sunday Mass before attending service with another denomination. As has already been mentioned, Catholics are not to receive Holy Communion in non-Catholic churches. This has to do with the lack of unity that remains between Catholics and non-Catholics and the severing of the apostolic line of succession at the Reformation. For a Catholic, the priesthood represents a direct succession from the Apostles. Therefore, only a Catholic priest can consecrate the bread and wine.
The only thing I see that may be confusing has to do with the Sacraments. The Catholic Church numbers seven while many non-Catholic churches only recognize two.

 

[puzzleannie]

we have this situation frequently in our parish religious education program for Catholic children. The kids spend alternate weekends in households with differing religious practices. You are to be applauded for your sensitivity to the needs of the children, and making that a priority. I wish more parents saw it that way. It depends on your state laws and custody agreement, but usually the custodial parent decides how their religious education will be handled, and it is for the other parent to make sure that those wishes are carried out, if possible, during their visitation times.

Some points that might help you:
Catholic parents who request baptism for their children are obligated in the most grave, solemn binding way to raise their children in the Catholic Church, which includes seeing that they receive religious education throughout their school years, and that they are prepared for and celebrate the sacraments at the appropriate age. Nothing that happens later, even the unfortunate circumstance of divorce, can change that obligation, and the parents will be held accountable before God in this duty.

You are better able to judge how well this is being done for the children than we are, but it sounds like even the custodial Catholic parent, for whatever reason, is trying but still not quite meeting that obligation. That you are willing to help says volumes about your care and concern for these children.

Once a Catholic child makes their first communion, and really once they reach the age of reason (about 7) they are obliged by church law to confess grave sins, to participate in Mass (and non-Catholic worship does not substitute for this) on Sundays and Holy Days. That a child is not brought to church is certainly not his fault, but it is the parent’s obligation. They are of course not forbidden to attend services at any other church, but they may not receive communion (since belief and teaching about communion vary so widely among denominations) and that would imply a unity which, sadly, does not exist yet among denominations.

You are doing what you can, and it really is the children’s parents who will have to step up and make sure the children are not deprived of their baptismal rights as Catholics. Continue to be as supportive as you have been, but you are not obligated to change your own belief and practice, it is the father’s responsibility (if he is Catholic).

to answer your first and underlying question, yes, unfortunately, it can be very confusing for children to hear conflicting messages from each household and each set of parents. We share so much in common, and there is so much to applaud in the Methodist practice, but there are still such fundamental differences in our views on how Christ acts within His Church, especially through the sacramental economy.

 

[Pug]

Lemony,

Your typical Methodist service and a Catholic service have much in common, so likely the children will not find that aspect overwhelming. If the children are receiving religious education while with the Catholic parent, they will be told that they ought to go to mass every Sunday and every Holy Day of Obligation (there are only a few of these each year, Christmas, for example) and that they should go to confession if they do a big sin. This is different from the Methodist practice. Methodists are not obligated to confess to the pastor (although they often do confide in the pastor), so this one of the things that I think you are asking about. Also, a Catholic who deliberately skips Sunday or a Holy Day will go to confession to confess this. That is kind of complicated for children, though, because they are not in charge of where they are taken, so it is not their fault if no one sees to it that they are able to attend mass. The child does not need to confess having missed mass if people aren’t taking them to mass!! Don’t let them fret that way, if that comes up. If they ask to go to confession for some reason, though, it would be kind of you to take them. It only takes a few minutes. They don’t have to tell you what they think they did wrong, though.

You might also notice that women cannot be priests, but, at least with United Methodists, a woman can be a pastor. This is something that might come up if the children are seeing a woman pastor at your church.

Also, if they are with you during Lent once they are 14yrs old, you might serve them fish or a vegetarian meal on Ash Wednesday, and all of the Fridays until and including Good Friday. Catholics abstain from meat on those days. Sometimes children younger than 14 are used to it, though, because their family does it together, as a whole, which is why I mention it.

You are correct that the tradition of John Wesley is very similar to Catholics when talking about Jesus, heaven, hell, sanctification, the Holy Spirit, service (Catholics call it acts of charity) etc. Most of what they hear will not be confusing. You may also notice the children asking a saint to pray for them. This is different from Methodist practice.

I grew up United Methodist, so if you have any more questions, feel free!

 

[Cat]

I hope this post sounds kind. It certainly isn’t pleasant, but the truth often isn’t.

I think the most confusing thing to the children would be the differences between the two churches on abortion and the sanctity of life.

The Methodist Church takes the following pro-choice stand:

umc.org/site/c.lwL4KnN1LtH/b.2294683/k.B1A4/Church_and_Society.htm

(Read “The Nurturing Community” section of this link).

The Catholic Church never condones abortion, no matter what the circumstances. All life is sacred from conception to natural death.

While children are young, this won’t be an issue. But it will be an issue when they are older and know about sex and babies. The UMC teaches a soft “pro-choice” attitude that makes it easy for a person to justify having an abortion or supporting abortion rights. According to the UMC, some babies don’t have a right to life, if they “create a tragic conflict in life.” How vague! Any teenager will eat this up and use it as an excuse to be pro-choice.

Some UMC members say that their personal church doesn’t teach this. Well, the denomination does teach it, as the link above demonstrates. Since UMC pastors are assigned by bishops, you never know when you will lose a wonderful pro-life pastor and the new pastor WILL start teaching the pro-choice stance of the UMC denomination.

 

[O.S.Luke]

The Methodist Church takes the following pro-choice stand

More accurately, the United Methodist Church takes this stand:

The beginning of life and the ending of life are the God-given boundaries of human existence. While individuals have always had some degree of control over when they would die, they now have the awesome power to determine when and even whether new individuals will be born.

Our belief in the sanctity of unborn human life makes us reluctant to approve abortion. But we are equally bound to respect the sacredness of the life and well-being of the mother, for whom devastating damage may result from an unacceptable pregnancy. In continuity with past Christian teaching, we recognize tragic conflicts of life with life that may justify abortion, and in such cases we support the legal option of abortion under proper medical procedures. We cannot affirm abortion as an acceptable means of birth control, and we unconditionally reject it as a means of gender selection.

We oppose the use of late-term abortion known as dilation and extraction (partial-birth abortion) and call for the end of this practice except when the physical life of the mother is in danger and no other medical procedure is available, or in the case of severe fetal anomalies incompatible with life. We call all Christians to a searching and prayerful inquiry into the sorts of conditions that may warrant abortion. We commit our Church to continue to provide nurturing ministries to those who terminate a pregnancy, to those in the midst of a crisis pregnancy, and to those who give birth. We particularly encourage the Church, the government, and social service agencies to support and facilitate the option of adoption. (See ¶ 161.K.)

Governmental laws and regulations do not provide all the guidance required by the informed Christian conscience. Therefore, a decision concerning abortion should be made only after thoughtful and prayerful consideration by the parties involved, with medical, pastoral, and other appropriate counsel.

• From The Book of Discipline of The United Methodist Church - 2004. Copyright 2004 by The United Methodist Publishing House. Used by permission.

O+

 

[Hellisreal]

I thought in most states now, it is specifically determined as to which parent has full custody. That parent is given the right to determine the child’s religious upbringing, unless there is another agreement.

 

[Harpazo]

The beginning of life and the ending of life are the God-given boundaries of human existence. While individuals have always had some degree of control over when they would die, they now have the awesome power to determine when and even whether new individuals will be born.

Our belief in the sanctity of unborn human life makes us reluctant to approve abortion. But we are equally bound to respect the sacredness of the life and well-being of the mother, for whom devastating damage may result from an unacceptable pregnancy. In continuity with past Christian teaching, we recognize tragic conflicts of life with life that may justify abortion, and in such cases we support the legal option of abortion under proper medical procedures. We cannot affirm abortion as an acceptable means of birth control, and we unconditionally reject it as a means of gender selection.

We oppose the use of late-term abortion known as dilation and extraction (partial-birth abortion) and call for the end of this practice except when the physical life of the mother is in danger and no other medical procedure is available, or in the case of severe fetal anomalies incompatible with life. We call all Christians to a searching and prayerful inquiry into the sorts of conditions that may warrant abortion. We commit our Church to continue to provide nurturing ministries to those who terminate a pregnancy, to those in the midst of a crisis pregnancy, and to those who give birth. We particularly encourage the Church, the government, and social service agencies to support and facilitate the option of adoption. (See ¶ 161.K.)

Governmental laws and regulations do not provide all the guidance required by the informed Christian conscience. Therefore, a decision concerning abortion should be made only after thoughtful and prayerful consideration by the parties involved, with medical, pastoral, and other appropriate counsel.

• From The Book of Discipline of The United Methodist Church - 2004. Copyright 2004 by The United Methodist Publishing House. Used by permission.

The above boldened and underline statement says it all. I can’t believe I never heard of this as a member of the Methodist tradition. I agree with Cat. It’s statements like these where people can rationalize abortion.

I’m just in shock…

Pace e Bene
Andrew

 

[MariaG]

I am new to this forum, but am hoping to find guidance and answers. I have attended a Methodist Church all of my life and am very active. I am recently remarried to a man who has two children. Their mother is Catholic by her own profession. The children have not been to church since I have known them, except with me. The older child is 11 and has received her first communion. Not knowing the Catholic belief that Catholics should not take communion at other churches, I asked her mother if Sarah could take communion at our church. Her mother said yes, but that the younger brother could not as he had not had his first communion yet. Sarah has taken communion at our church several times, I now know it is against Catholic law and will not allow it again.
My question is this. . . is there anything in the beliefs of the Methodist and Catholic church that would be detrimental or confusing to these children. I have attended church every Sunday for as long as I can remember, and my husband attends with me now. Suddenly, the children’s mother is saying we cannot take them to church because they are being raised Catholic. They are with us every other weekend. This poses a huge dilemma for our family. I do not want to do anything to confuse or jeopardize the kids’ spiritual well-being. However, I do not believe there is anything we teach in our Children’s Church that is contrary to the Catholic beliefs. We teach basic Biblical beliefs, basic Christianity. We do not get into Church theology or doctrine. We will not allow the kids to take Communion and will explain that they are Catholic and cannot take communion in other churches, just as we cannot take communion in their church.
Please give me your thoughts. . . and please be kind. I do not want to be lectured or chastised. I want what is best for the children who have parents with different church preferences. I know at the upper level, the Methodist and Catholic churches are in dialogue to seek communion (not the sacrament) between all Christians. I am hoping to achieve this in our blended family as well.
Thank you all in advance for your words of wisdom.
God bless
Lemony

I think many Methodist churches are very compatible with Catholic teachings. But at age 11, some of the questions children are starting to ask can get into finer points of theology, that truly are better answered from the same theological doctrine.

And respectfully, the mother has no say on whether or not her ex takes the children to a non-Catholic church or not unless specifically addressed in custody issues. Although, for the sake of not confusing the children, have you thought of attending a Catholic Church as a family on the weekends they come? But did the children’s father promise to help raise them Catholic at their baptism?

God Bless,
Maria

 

[O.S.Luke]

The above boldened and underline statement says it all. I can’t believe I never heard of this as a member of the Methodist tradition. I agree with Cat. It’s statements like these where people can rationalize abortion.

People can rationalize anything. That certainly doesn’t make it right.

O+

 

[YADA]

You did not say what their father’s faith is [minimally - he must have acquiesed to the catholic baptism for both of his children]. What is his faith?

I would suggest taking the children to Mass at a Catholic Church on the weekends they are with you. That way you will be supporting the spiritual needs of the children in the faith to which their parents [mother and father] had them baptized.

Putting the children first is an act of charity and the duty of the father. Unity in the spiritual up bringing should not fall victim to the parents inability to remain together…

I realize this will be hard for you, a person who seems more dedicated to a faith life then either parent appears [based upon your post - which is limited - at best]. perhaps this is the sacrafice you must make…afterall, you as an adult, are probably better disposed to attend a different faith tradition than two children who are infants in their faith. if you feel that basic christian teachings and hering the holy scriptures at church are good things than attending mass will be a joyful experience and will expand your horizons.

I will pray for you and the children…I fear that you are the real spiritual rock these two children have…perhaps your example will encourage their parents to seek a life of faith.

 

[Hellisreal]

Where are the godparents in all this?

If I were one of the godparents, we would be having a much different conversation about all this now. No offence to the efforts of the OP.

But, you would be dealing with me on that one if I were.

 

[Verisimilitude]

I am new to this forum, but am hoping to find guidance and answers. I have attended a Methodist Church all of my life and am very active. …Not knowing the Catholic belief that Catholics should not take communion at other churches, I asked her mother if Sarah could take communion at our church. Her mother said yes, …I now know it is against Catholic law and will not allow it again.

I must commend you on such integrity.

My question is this. . . …I am hoping to achieve this in our blended family as well.
Thank you all in advance for your words of wisdom.
God bless
Lemony

I don’t know. I like the answers that suggest you take the children to a Catholic Mass when you have them. You would be welcome at our parish and I think most (all) others. I assume the father (your husband) is not Catholic.

This would be a good question/answer on the Ask an Apologist section of this site, or if you are more willling, to go and speak to the local priest yourself.

 

[Lemonylyons]

Thank you all so much for your very helpful advice.

I am learning so much from this site and from your posts. I am realizing the the mother’s intent in most of this is not necessarily to have her children raised Catholic as much as it is to cause problems between my husband and I.

I have considered attending Catholic Mass. However, I am head of the Children’s Ministry Team at my own church and lead our Children’s Church. In order to attend another church, i would have to relinquish these duties.

Both parents committed to raising thier children Catholic at their baptisms. However, neither parent is following that vow. The mother has not attended church since I have known her. She does not go to confession . . . and there are other lifestyle choices she is making that are not very Catholic (or Christian, for that matter). Scott and I have been attending church together, and this aggravates her. They never attended as a couple.

Again, I do not want to cause issues between them, or problems for the children. However, I want to continue my involvement in my church. . . and I want to be able to include them in my faith. I hope we could all agree that being Christians should be a priority over being Methodist or Catholic. Eternal salvation is of utmost importance. . . and hearing the Gospel is what helps them learn the importance of that.

For those who pointed out faults with the Methodist beliefs, I am aware of those things. They have come to pass since I have been a part of the church and I do not agree with them. My local church does not agree with the abortion issue. I know if we have a new pastor, things could change, and I might be forced to consider my options. However, at the level of Children’s Church, I know what is taught. I am responsible for planning what is taught. I can assure you, none of our teaching conflict with Catholic beliefs. We do not teach about Communion, the Sacraments, or abortion. We teach Bible stories, the Beatitudes, the Lord’s Prayer, etc.

I will keep all of your thoughts in mind as we go forward and would be glad to hear further thoughts. I stress, I do want what is best for the kids. . .

Thanks again,

Lemony

 

[DebChris]

People can rationalize anything. That certainly doesn’t make it right.

O+

The Roman Catholic Church does accept the termination of a pregnancy when the lives of both mother and child are endangered. Every reasonable effort must be made to save both lives. A prime example is an ectopic pregnancy in which case neither mother nor child will survive unless the pregnancy is terminated.

Without life there is no liberty. This of course is a matter of Catholic social teaching.

When it comes to teaching about the life and times of Jesus Christ, there is little distinction.

 

[YADA]

LEmony,

Perhaps you husband should attend Mass with his children on those Sundays when they are with you [if you are unable or unwilling to give up your church responsibilities on Sundays]. Or, even better, you can attend Mass on the Saturday Vigil as a family and then you can attend your church on Sundays to teach Sunday School.

If your husband attends church with you, he should be seeing the value of faith in family life. You should encourage him to do the right thing with his children. Afterall, if he does not want to fullfill his commitment to them what does that say about his level of commitment to you [and any children you may have together]?

While being Christian is important - one of those children is of the age to be recieving the Eucharist - this is not just a symbolic action but Life Giving nourishment - the Body and Blood of Christ. You should not hamper the reception, nor down play the importance. The other child should be instructed in the faith in preparation for the Eucharist. Time passes so fast the day for his First Holy Communion will be upon you before you know it.

And you should pray for their mother and her faith life…And, you may or may not know what is stirring in her spiritual life - …

She could go to confession and begin attending mass at any moment [or even without your knowledge], something that you should pray for and would benefit these children…

 

[Bruised_Reed]

Thank you all so much for your very helpful advice.

I am learning so much from this site and from your posts. I am realizing the the mother’s intent in most of this is not necessarily to have her children raised Catholic as much as it is to cause problems between my husband and I.

I have considered attending Catholic Mass. However, I am head of the Children’s Ministry Team at my own church and lead our Children’s Church. In order to attend another church, i would have to relinquish these duties.

Both parents committed to raising thier children Catholic at their baptisms. However, neither parent is following that vow. The mother has not attended church since I have known her. She does not go to confession . . . and there are other lifestyle choices she is making that are not very Catholic (or Christian, for that matter). Scott and I have been attending church together, and this aggravates her. They never attended as a couple.

Again, I do not want to cause issues between them, or problems for the children. However, I want to continue my involvement in my church. . . and I want to be able to include them in my faith. I hope we could all agree that being Christians should be a priority over being Methodist or Catholic. Eternal salvation is of utmost importance. . . and hearing the Gospel is what helps them learn the importance of that.

For those who pointed out faults with the Methodist beliefs, I am aware of those things. They have come to pass since I have been a part of the church and I do not agree with them. My local church does not agree with the abortion issue. I know if we have a new pastor, things could change, and I might be forced to consider my options. However, at the level of Children’s Church, I know what is taught. I am responsible for planning what is taught. I can assure you, none of our teaching conflict with Catholic beliefs. We do not teach about Communion, the Sacraments, or abortion. We teach Bible stories, the Beatitudes, the Lord’s Prayer, etc.

I will keep all of your thoughts in mind as we go forward and would be glad to hear further thoughts. I stress, I do want what is best for the kids. . .

Thanks again,

Lemony

I don’t know what the visitation details are but what I typically see is Friday afternoon/evening to Sunday afternoon evening. You could take the children to Mass Saturday evening for the Vigil Mass, usually around 5:00 -5:30. Encourage your husband to come with and all go out to dinner afterward or have something ready in the slow cooker when you get home. Taking them to Mass the evening before will help them fulfill their Sunday obligation and you should still be able to fulfill your duties at your church.

I also commend you for your thoughtful concern in this matter.

 

[BrewMax]

I am new to this forum, but am hoping to find guidance and answers. I have attended a Methodist Church all of my life and am very active. I am recently remarried to a man who has two children. Their mother is Catholic by her own profession. The children have not been to church since I have known them, except with me. The older child is 11 and has received her first communion. Not knowing the Catholic belief that Catholics should not take communion at other churches, I asked her mother if Sarah could take communion at our church. Her mother said yes, but that the younger brother could not as he had not had his first communion yet. Sarah has taken communion at our church several times, I now know it is against Catholic law and will not allow it again.
My question is this. . . is there anything in the beliefs of the Methodist and Catholic church that would be detrimental or confusing to these children. I have attended church every Sunday for as long as I can remember, and my husband attends with me now. Suddenly, the children’s mother is saying we cannot take them to church because they are being raised Catholic. They are with us every other weekend. This poses a huge dilemma for our family. I do not want to do anything to confuse or jeopardize the kids’ spiritual well-being. However, I do not believe there is anything we teach in our Children’s Church that is contrary to the Catholic beliefs. We teach basic Biblical beliefs, basic Christianity. We do not get into Church theology or doctrine. We will not allow the kids to take Communion and will explain that they are Catholic and cannot take communion in other churches, just as we cannot take communion in their church.
Please give me your thoughts. . . and please be kind. I do not want to be lectured or chastised. I want what is best for the children who have parents with different church preferences. I know at the upper level, the Methodist and Catholic churches are in dialogue to seek communion (not the sacrament) between all Christians. I am hoping to achieve this in our blended family as well.
Thank you all in advance for your words of wisdom.
God bless
Lemony

If this were me in your situation, I would take the children to church with me every Sunday and allow them to fully participate in all church activities. I presume that the children are well fitted in your church and like going there. I think that it would be very confusing and distracting to put barriers up for these kids. I understand what the Catholic church says regarding communion. That is not in question. If these children have not been in church with their mother in years, I would seriously question her standing with the Catholic church. I think that the kids would be much better off with you in the Methodist church. Thats my opinion.

 

[ElizabethAnne]

Both parents committed to raising thier children Catholic at their baptisms. However, neither parent is following that vow.

Does this mean that your husband is Catholic? Because if he is, he should be attending Catholic Mass every Sunday and setting a good example for his children in that way.

Lemonylyons, I am so glad you have come here to ask questions, and I am very impressed by how hard you are trying to do the right thing. My parents put me in the same position these children are in. I was baptized Catholic and not much else. I never even received first communion, so already their mother has done more than my parents did. And she must be sending them to some kind of religious instruction or they would not be able to make first communion. Anyway, I really wish that somebody had stepped in and done the right thing for me, making sure I learned about the Catholic faith and attended Mass every week. By the grace of God I was led to the Catholic Church in college, but my brother has not yet been so blessed. He is still searching and seems to have no faith at all.

God bless you.

 

[BlestOne]

OK… I have read all the posts and while some have given you useful information, others have not. I am going to give you a perspective from the other side of the fence and maybe that will help.

I have a step daughter that we see every other weekend. When she was younger, her mother was not interested in her spiritual development so her father and I asked permission for her to go to Catholic PSR and receive first communion at our church. Her mother agreed. Since her mother has her most of the time, we were concerned about many of the same things you are as well. I would say that since mom has her most of the time, you will need to comply with reasonable requests from mom.

Personally, I don’t think her request that you don’t take her to your service is reasonable. In our case, my step daughter goes to mass when she is with us, we make sure she goes to confession and she also receives communion at our church. When she is with her mom, she goes to their Methodist service but does not go to communion. Now here is the kicker… when she is old enough to go through confirmation prep, she HAS to go to mass every week. Whether she is with mom or us, this is mandatory. So, when this comes up… my step daughter will literally have to choose what she is willing to do to be Catholic.

Going to a Methodist service is a little bit different than Catholic mass. If you want to respect the faith your step daughter is being brought up in… when things come up, or questions are asked, about the differences… be honest, if you don’t know say so, but encourage her to ask anyway! Some of the differences that pertain to a child’s catechisis would be things like the number of sacraments and the difference in the teachings about true presence.

Do you understand why she may not receive communion at your church? The reason is that Catholics believe in the true body and blood in the Eucharist. We also believe that to receive communion in a non Catholic church would be like saying we are in communion with the teachings of that church and they are in communion with the Catholic church.

I have to go right now but I will try to write more later about some of the conflicts and how we have settled them and stuff like that.