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Metropolitan Hilarion gives comments about Orthodox relations... which hinges on the UGCC situation
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K
KyivAndrew
Guest
I was going to post this story yesterday but I was too angry. The new Pope hadn’t even been invested and inaugurated and the Russian Orthodox Church hierarchy in the form of Metropolitan Hilarion was off and running taking shots at the Ukrainian Catholic Church and telling the Pope how to deal with it. Unbelievable.
Met. Hilarion should worry about the attendance figures in his own church; the fact is attendance in Ukrainian Catholic Churches makes Hilarion’s Church’s attendance look bad, and that, even though in Russia the Russian Orthodox Church is officially supported by Putin’s state, and in Ukraine, the Russian Orthodox Church (disingenuously named “The Ukrainian Orthodox Church, Moscow Patriarchate”) is supported by the current thug ruling Ukraine Viktor Yanukovych, as it is in Belarus with the thug Lukashenko who also gets the Russian Orthodox Patriarch’s seal of approval.
The Ukrainian Catholic Church receives no government support in Ukraine. I note not too long ago the same Met. Hilarion asserted Stalin’s liquidation of the Ukrainian Catholic Church and forcible annexation into the Russian Orthodox Church in 1946 was basically right. And this, while the Head of his own church, Russian Orthodox Patriarch Kirill is currently praising Hugo Chavez. Yes, Hugo Chavez = good, Ukrainian Catholics = bad, in the ROC hierarchy’s world.
What expansion does Met. Hilarion complain of? Stalin deported hundreds of thousand of Ukrainian Catholics to other parts of Ukraine and the Soviet Union, and Met. Hilarion thinks if their descendants today wish to build Ukrainian Catholic Churches to worship in this is “expansion”? The Russian Orthodox Church is not forbidden anywhere in Ukraine, or in Europe for that matter from building houses of worship, and rightly so. But Met. Hilarion is terrified of Ukrainian Catholics worshiping in their own country.
His church’s hierarchy in Russia is tied in with Putin’s KGB state, and in Ukraine his church is tied in with the bandit regime of Yanukovych. With all the problems in the post-communist world - corruption, no rule of law, lack of morality in political leaders and police/militia/secret police - Hilarion feels it most important to worry about Ukrainian Catholics?
Metropolitan Hilarion should ask the head of his own Church what he was doing for the Soviet Kremlin as the Russian Orthodox prelate named to represent the ROC back in 1972 to the World Council of Churches, while Ukrainian Catholics in the Soviet Union at the time had to practice their faith illegally and risk being arrested. According to The Times in England, Patriarch Kirill’s KGB codename back then during the Brezhnev era was “Mikhailov”.
Let Hilarion worry about the state of Russia’s moral affairs from Moscow, and leave Ukraine alone. It presents no threat to him, but his comments only make life worse for believers in Christ and the Church.
Met. Hilarion should worry about the attendance figures in his own church; the fact is attendance in Ukrainian Catholic Churches makes Hilarion’s Church’s attendance look bad, and that, even though in Russia the Russian Orthodox Church is officially supported by Putin’s state, and in Ukraine, the Russian Orthodox Church (disingenuously named “The Ukrainian Orthodox Church, Moscow Patriarchate”) is supported by the current thug ruling Ukraine Viktor Yanukovych, as it is in Belarus with the thug Lukashenko who also gets the Russian Orthodox Patriarch’s seal of approval.
The Ukrainian Catholic Church receives no government support in Ukraine. I note not too long ago the same Met. Hilarion asserted Stalin’s liquidation of the Ukrainian Catholic Church and forcible annexation into the Russian Orthodox Church in 1946 was basically right. And this, while the Head of his own church, Russian Orthodox Patriarch Kirill is currently praising Hugo Chavez. Yes, Hugo Chavez = good, Ukrainian Catholics = bad, in the ROC hierarchy’s world.
What expansion does Met. Hilarion complain of? Stalin deported hundreds of thousand of Ukrainian Catholics to other parts of Ukraine and the Soviet Union, and Met. Hilarion thinks if their descendants today wish to build Ukrainian Catholic Churches to worship in this is “expansion”? The Russian Orthodox Church is not forbidden anywhere in Ukraine, or in Europe for that matter from building houses of worship, and rightly so. But Met. Hilarion is terrified of Ukrainian Catholics worshiping in their own country.
His church’s hierarchy in Russia is tied in with Putin’s KGB state, and in Ukraine his church is tied in with the bandit regime of Yanukovych. With all the problems in the post-communist world - corruption, no rule of law, lack of morality in political leaders and police/militia/secret police - Hilarion feels it most important to worry about Ukrainian Catholics?
Metropolitan Hilarion should ask the head of his own Church what he was doing for the Soviet Kremlin as the Russian Orthodox prelate named to represent the ROC back in 1972 to the World Council of Churches, while Ukrainian Catholics in the Soviet Union at the time had to practice their faith illegally and risk being arrested. According to The Times in England, Patriarch Kirill’s KGB codename back then during the Brezhnev era was “Mikhailov”.
Let Hilarion worry about the state of Russia’s moral affairs from Moscow, and leave Ukraine alone. It presents no threat to him, but his comments only make life worse for believers in Christ and the Church.
A
Aramis
Guest
HG Hilarion is about the most nay-sayer of the Russian Orthodox bishops…
… were he ever to endorse reunion, tolerance of the ECC’s, or the filoque, we’d be fairly sure he had done so under near universal threat of censure from the sobor, and universal threat from the synod…
Thing is, any reunion always creates an anti-union rump… and the resulting splinters are almost always hostile to the absorbing church.
C
ComeHome2Rome
Guest
This post is awfully offensive.
I was going to post this story yesterday but I was too angry. The new Pope hadn’t even been invested and inaugurated and the Russian Orthodox Church hierarchy in the form of Metropolitan Hilarion was off and running taking shots at the Ukrainian Catholic Church and telling the Pope how to deal with it. Unbelievable.
Met. Hilarion should worry about the attendance figures in his own church; the fact is attendance in Ukrainian Catholic Churches makes Hilarion’s Church’s attendance look bad, and that, even though in Russia the Russian Orthodox Church is officially supported by Putin’s state, and in Ukraine, the Russian Orthodox Church (disingenuously named “The Ukrainian Orthodox Church, Moscow Patriarchate”) is supported by the current thug ruling Ukraine Viktor Yanukovych, as it is in Belarus with the thug Lukashenko who also gets the Russian Orthodox Patriarch’s seal of approval.
The Ukrainian Catholic Church receives no government support in Ukraine. I note not too long ago the same Met. Hilarion asserted Stalin’s liquidation of the Ukrainian Catholic Church and forcible annexation into the Russian Orthodox Church in 1946 was basically right. And this, while the Head of his own church, Russian Orthodox Patriarch Kirill is currently praising Hugo Chavez. Yes, Hugo Chavez = good, Ukrainian Catholics = bad, in the ROC hierarchy’s world.
What expansion does Met. Hilarion complain of? Stalin deported hundreds of thousand of Ukrainian Catholics to other parts of Ukraine and the Soviet Union, and Met. Hilarion thinks if their descendants today wish to build Ukrainian Catholic Churches to worship in this is “expansion”? The Russian Orthodox Church is not forbidden anywhere in Ukraine, or in Europe for that matter from building houses of worship, and rightly so. But Met. Hilarion is terrified of Ukrainian Catholics worshiping in their own country.
His church’s hierarchy in Russia is tied in with Putin’s KGB state, and in Ukraine his church is tied in with the bandit regime of Yanukovych. With all the problems in the post-communist world - corruption, no rule of law, lack of morality in political leaders and police/militia/secret police - Hilarion feels it most important to worry about Ukrainian Catholics?
Metropolitan Hilarion should ask the head of his own Church what he was doing for the Soviet Kremlin as the Russian Orthodox prelate named to represent the ROC back in 1972 to the World Council of Churches, while Ukrainian Catholics in the Soviet Union at the time had to practice their faith illegally and risk being arrested. According to The Times in England, Patriarch Kirill’s KGB codename back then during the Brezhnev era was “Mikhailov”.
Let Hilarion worry about the state of Russia’s moral affairs from Moscow, and leave Ukraine alone. It presents no threat to him, but his comments only make life worse for believers in Christ and the Church.
C
ComeHome2Rome
Guest
This post is awfully offensive.
I was going to post this story yesterday but I was too angry. The new Pope hadn’t even been invested and inaugurated and the Russian Orthodox Church hierarchy in the form of Metropolitan Hilarion was off and running taking shots at the Ukrainian Catholic Church and telling the Pope how to deal with it. Unbelievable.
Met. Hilarion should worry about the attendance figures in his own church; the fact is attendance in Ukrainian Catholic Churches makes Hilarion’s Church’s attendance look bad, and that, even though in Russia the Russian Orthodox Church is officially supported by Putin’s state, and in Ukraine, the Russian Orthodox Church (disingenuously named “The Ukrainian Orthodox Church, Moscow Patriarchate”) is supported by the current thug ruling Ukraine Viktor Yanukovych, as it is in Belarus with the thug Lukashenko who also gets the Russian Orthodox Patriarch’s seal of approval.
The Ukrainian Catholic Church receives no government support in Ukraine. I note not too long ago the same Met. Hilarion asserted Stalin’s liquidation of the Ukrainian Catholic Church and forcible annexation into the Russian Orthodox Church in 1946 was basically right. And this, while the Head of his own church, Russian Orthodox Patriarch Kirill is currently praising Hugo Chavez. Yes, Hugo Chavez = good, Ukrainian Catholics = bad, in the ROC hierarchy’s world.
What expansion does Met. Hilarion complain of? Stalin deported hundreds of thousand of Ukrainian Catholics to other parts of Ukraine and the Soviet Union, and Met. Hilarion thinks if their descendants today wish to build Ukrainian Catholic Churches to worship in this is “expansion”? The Russian Orthodox Church is not forbidden anywhere in Ukraine, or in Europe for that matter from building houses of worship, and rightly so. But Met. Hilarion is terrified of Ukrainian Catholics worshiping in their own country.
His church’s hierarchy in Russia is tied in with Putin’s KGB state, and in Ukraine his church is tied in with the bandit regime of Yanukovych. With all the problems in the post-communist world - corruption, no rule of law, lack of morality in political leaders and police/militia/secret police - Hilarion feels it most important to worry about Ukrainian Catholics?
Metropolitan Hilarion should ask the head of his own Church what he was doing for the Soviet Kremlin as the Russian Orthodox prelate named to represent the ROC back in 1972 to the World Council of Churches, while Ukrainian Catholics in the Soviet Union at the time had to practice their faith illegally and risk being arrested. According to The Times in England, Patriarch Kirill’s KGB codename back then during the Brezhnev era was “Mikhailov”.
Let Hilarion worry about the state of Russia’s moral affairs from Moscow, and leave Ukraine alone. It presents no threat to him, but his comments only make life worse for believers in Christ and the Church.
K
KyivAndrew
Guest
You don’t think Metropolitan Hilarion’s statement that Stalin’s liquidation of the Ukrainian Catholic Church in 1946 was essentially right is offensive? Do you know how many martyrs the Ukrainian Catholic Church gave last century? How many perished in the Soviet Gulags? Do you think Metropolitan Hilarion even would mention this? And to top it off, he continually criticizes our existence as a Catholic Church. How does one actually respond to someone claiming your Church should vanish out of existence for all intents and purposes as Stalin had intended?This post is awfully offensive.
It was Metropolitan Hilarion who decided to insult our Catholic Church and the pope even before He is installed which raises some questions. I have made factual statements re: church attendance, politics, and the Church. The questions as to the KGB relationship with the current hierarchy of the Russian Orthodox Church is something Russian Orthodox priest (and dissident in the Soviet Union) Gleb Yakunin raised himself, as well as former KGB officer turned democrat Oleg Kalugin recently in a journal on Russian politics. Metropolitan Hilarion did not have to say anything at all, you know, on such a historic occasion for the Catholic Church.
K
KyivAndrew
Guest
Let’s look at some of the people who suffered in 1946 when Stalin liquidated the Ukrainian Catholic Church - a move Metropolitan Hilarion does not condemn.
Beatification of the Servants of God on June 27, 2001
Short biographies
On April 24, 2001, in the presence of His Holiness Pope John Paul II the proclamation of decrees of martyrdom and the heroic virtues and miracles of 52 Servants of God took place in the Vatican. The decrees involved 28 Servants of God of the Ukrainian Greek-Catholic Church.
By the decree the Vatican confirmed the martyrdom of 26 candidates in the archeparchial procedure which finished in Lviv on March 2, 2001. The documents on each of them sent from Lviv contained a biography, information about the martyr’s death, and also a theological analysis of his or her written works (if there were such)
list to be found here
ugcc.org.ua/35.0.html?&L=2
for instance:
Blessed Bishop and Martyr Hryhorij Khomyshyn was born on March 25, 1867, in the village of Hadynkivtsi, Ternopil’ Region. After graduating from the seminary he was ordained a priest. He continued to study theology in Vienna (1894-1899). In 1902 Metropolitan A. Sheptytsky appointed Fr. Hryhorij as rector of the seminary in Lviv. The enthronement of Fr. Hryhorij as Bishop of Stanislaviv took place in 1904 in the Cathedral of Saint George. In 1939 he was arrested by the NKVD for the first time. He was arrested the second time in April 1945 and sent to Kyiv. He died on January 17, 1947, in the NKVD prison in Kyiv.
Blessed Priest and Martyr Klymentiy Sheptytsky, younger brother of Servant of God Metropolitan Andrey Sheptytsky, was born on November 17, 1869, in the village of Prylbychi, Yavoriv District, Lviv Region. He entered the Monastery of Saint Theodore the Studite at an older age (in 1911), leaving a successful career in society. He studied theology at Innsbruck. On August 28, 1915, he was ordained a priest. He was the abbot of the major monastery in Univ for many years and from 1944 became its archimandrite. During World War II he provided shelter for persecuted Jews. On June 5, 1947, he was arrested by the NKVD and condemned to eight years’ hard labor. On May 1, 1951, he died in the Volodymyr jail.
Blessed Priest and Martyr Ivan Zyatyk was born on December 26, 1899, in the village of Odrekhova, Syanock District (now on Polish territory). After finishing theological studies in 1923 he was ordained a priest. In 1935 he entered the Order of the Most Holy Savior (Redemptorist Fathers). During the German occupation he was appointed the superior of the monastery in Ternopil’. On January 5, 1950, he was arrested. At the beginning he did his punishment in the Zolochiv prison; later he was taken to Ozerlag, in Russia’s Irkurtsk Region. On Good Friday in 1952 he was brutally tortured. On May 17, 1952, he died.
Blessed Priest and Martyr Yakym Sen’kivs’kyj was born on May 2, 1896, in the village of Haji Velyki, Ternopil’ Region. After the completion of theological studies in Lviv he was ordained a priest on December 4, 1921. He received a doctorate of theology in Innsbruck. In 1923 he entered the novitiate of the Order of St. Basil the Great in Krekhiv. After taking first vows he went to the village of Krasnopushcha, Ternopil’ Region, afterwards to the village of Lavriv, Staryj Sambir District. From 1931 to 1938 he held different positions in the Monastery of Saint Onufrius in Lviv. And then in 1939 he was appointed abbot of the monastery in Drohobych. On June 26, 1941, he was arrested by the Bolsheviks, and on June 29, according to reports, he was boiled in a cauldron in the Drohobych jail.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
People in my family actually knew some of these people who were martyred by the KGB for refusing to follow Stalin’s instructions to self-destruct and become Russian Orthodox. Were they alive, I’m not sure how they’d react to Met. Hilarion’s statement.
Beatification of the Servants of God on June 27, 2001
Short biographies
On April 24, 2001, in the presence of His Holiness Pope John Paul II the proclamation of decrees of martyrdom and the heroic virtues and miracles of 52 Servants of God took place in the Vatican. The decrees involved 28 Servants of God of the Ukrainian Greek-Catholic Church.
By the decree the Vatican confirmed the martyrdom of 26 candidates in the archeparchial procedure which finished in Lviv on March 2, 2001. The documents on each of them sent from Lviv contained a biography, information about the martyr’s death, and also a theological analysis of his or her written works (if there were such)
list to be found here
ugcc.org.ua/35.0.html?&L=2
for instance:
Blessed Bishop and Martyr Hryhorij Khomyshyn was born on March 25, 1867, in the village of Hadynkivtsi, Ternopil’ Region. After graduating from the seminary he was ordained a priest. He continued to study theology in Vienna (1894-1899). In 1902 Metropolitan A. Sheptytsky appointed Fr. Hryhorij as rector of the seminary in Lviv. The enthronement of Fr. Hryhorij as Bishop of Stanislaviv took place in 1904 in the Cathedral of Saint George. In 1939 he was arrested by the NKVD for the first time. He was arrested the second time in April 1945 and sent to Kyiv. He died on January 17, 1947, in the NKVD prison in Kyiv.
Blessed Priest and Martyr Klymentiy Sheptytsky, younger brother of Servant of God Metropolitan Andrey Sheptytsky, was born on November 17, 1869, in the village of Prylbychi, Yavoriv District, Lviv Region. He entered the Monastery of Saint Theodore the Studite at an older age (in 1911), leaving a successful career in society. He studied theology at Innsbruck. On August 28, 1915, he was ordained a priest. He was the abbot of the major monastery in Univ for many years and from 1944 became its archimandrite. During World War II he provided shelter for persecuted Jews. On June 5, 1947, he was arrested by the NKVD and condemned to eight years’ hard labor. On May 1, 1951, he died in the Volodymyr jail.
Blessed Priest and Martyr Ivan Zyatyk was born on December 26, 1899, in the village of Odrekhova, Syanock District (now on Polish territory). After finishing theological studies in 1923 he was ordained a priest. In 1935 he entered the Order of the Most Holy Savior (Redemptorist Fathers). During the German occupation he was appointed the superior of the monastery in Ternopil’. On January 5, 1950, he was arrested. At the beginning he did his punishment in the Zolochiv prison; later he was taken to Ozerlag, in Russia’s Irkurtsk Region. On Good Friday in 1952 he was brutally tortured. On May 17, 1952, he died.
Blessed Priest and Martyr Yakym Sen’kivs’kyj was born on May 2, 1896, in the village of Haji Velyki, Ternopil’ Region. After the completion of theological studies in Lviv he was ordained a priest on December 4, 1921. He received a doctorate of theology in Innsbruck. In 1923 he entered the novitiate of the Order of St. Basil the Great in Krekhiv. After taking first vows he went to the village of Krasnopushcha, Ternopil’ Region, afterwards to the village of Lavriv, Staryj Sambir District. From 1931 to 1938 he held different positions in the Monastery of Saint Onufrius in Lviv. And then in 1939 he was appointed abbot of the monastery in Drohobych. On June 26, 1941, he was arrested by the Bolsheviks, and on June 29, according to reports, he was boiled in a cauldron in the Drohobych jail.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
People in my family actually knew some of these people who were martyred by the KGB for refusing to follow Stalin’s instructions to self-destruct and become Russian Orthodox. Were they alive, I’m not sure how they’d react to Met. Hilarion’s statement.
K
KyivAndrew
Guest
Prominent American Roman Catholic George Weigel on Russian Orthodox Metropolitan Hilarion:
“More disturbing still were remarks made in Washington in February by Metropolitan Hilarion, the Moscow patriarchate’s “external affairs” officer—Russian Orthodoxy’s chief ecumenist. Hilarion is an impressive personality in many ways: He is entirely at home in English, he displays a nice sense of humor, and his curriculum vitae includes a large number of publications and musical compositions. Yet when I asked him whether the L’viv Sobor (Council) of 1946—which forcibly reincorporated the Greek Catholic Church of Ukraine into Russian Orthodoxy, turning the Greek Catholics into the world’s largest illegal religious body—was a “theologically legitimate ecclesial act,” Hilarion unhesitatingly responded “Yes.” I then noted that serious historians describe the L’viv Sobor as an act of the Stalinist state, carried out by the NKVD (predecessor to the KGB); Hilarion responded that the “modalities” of history are always complicated.”
First Things, On the Square, March 9, 2011
Yes, modalities indeed, innocent human lives.
“More disturbing still were remarks made in Washington in February by Metropolitan Hilarion, the Moscow patriarchate’s “external affairs” officer—Russian Orthodoxy’s chief ecumenist. Hilarion is an impressive personality in many ways: He is entirely at home in English, he displays a nice sense of humor, and his curriculum vitae includes a large number of publications and musical compositions. Yet when I asked him whether the L’viv Sobor (Council) of 1946—which forcibly reincorporated the Greek Catholic Church of Ukraine into Russian Orthodoxy, turning the Greek Catholics into the world’s largest illegal religious body—was a “theologically legitimate ecclesial act,” Hilarion unhesitatingly responded “Yes.” I then noted that serious historians describe the L’viv Sobor as an act of the Stalinist state, carried out by the NKVD (predecessor to the KGB); Hilarion responded that the “modalities” of history are always complicated.”
First Things, On the Square, March 9, 2011
Yes, modalities indeed, innocent human lives.
A
Aramis
Guest
@ComeHome2Rome
Met. Hillarion goes well out of his theological way to condemn Catholic uniatism and yet endorses fully Russian Uniatism. The latter likely because the Sobor and Synod do so, more than because of any personal belief.
HG Hilarion is offensive in his comments quite frequently. He endorses the dubious acts of the stalinist era Russian Orthodox, he clings to misbeliefs even his own parent synod has rejected about the Catholic Church and its beliefs.
It’s telling about the ROC that their “chief ecumenist” is hostile to all other forms of Christianity. He’s even been quick to point out flaws of other Orthodox Churches his own is in union with, too.
He’s the arch-conservative end of the ROC Synod. In a way, it’s good they put him in that role… because he reminds us that the ROC is NOT looking at unification save by subjugation and surrender, and hence sees ecumenism on those very terms.
HG Hilarion can be safely ignored by the layman… he isn’t representative of the clergy, nor the ROC as a whole. He is a good barometer of the ROC’s willingness tfor corporate reunion, nothing more, because only the furthest anti-union end matters to Rome. Rome has, for the last 40 years, wanted “all or nothing” for corporate unions, and has, since the 1917 CIC, accepted Orthodox priests as valid individually when coming into personal union.
Met. Hillarion goes well out of his theological way to condemn Catholic uniatism and yet endorses fully Russian Uniatism. The latter likely because the Sobor and Synod do so, more than because of any personal belief.
HG Hilarion is offensive in his comments quite frequently. He endorses the dubious acts of the stalinist era Russian Orthodox, he clings to misbeliefs even his own parent synod has rejected about the Catholic Church and its beliefs.
It’s telling about the ROC that their “chief ecumenist” is hostile to all other forms of Christianity. He’s even been quick to point out flaws of other Orthodox Churches his own is in union with, too.
He’s the arch-conservative end of the ROC Synod. In a way, it’s good they put him in that role… because he reminds us that the ROC is NOT looking at unification save by subjugation and surrender, and hence sees ecumenism on those very terms.
HG Hilarion can be safely ignored by the layman… he isn’t representative of the clergy, nor the ROC as a whole. He is a good barometer of the ROC’s willingness tfor corporate reunion, nothing more, because only the furthest anti-union end matters to Rome. Rome has, for the last 40 years, wanted “all or nothing” for corporate unions, and has, since the 1917 CIC, accepted Orthodox priests as valid individually when coming into personal union.
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