I see the point there.
I see what you are saying. Right now the fact that he is still married is what eats at me. My view is, it doesn’t matter what he says or feels. Until he’s shown SOME attempt to annul his marriage (he has not even begun the civil process) he is Married. The Church assumes his Marriage as valid, and so must I as a Catholic. So the true question is, can I show even implicit support for a Married man to be spending time with another woman with whom he has a love interest? Polki’s response resounds in my heart right now the loudest.
Please pray for my wife and me as we discern the emotions we have right now.
So, let’s put this into perspective: Let’s say he is happily married instead of “seeking” divorce. Would it be okay for him to go to Turkey Day dinner, without his wife, with an old flame who was “the love of [his] life” for decades? Why, or why not?
That’s right. Since it’s going to happen at some point, we don’t see the need to rush it along.
My 4, 6, and 8 years old will not understand this. I do not want to be in a situation where I must explain to my children that their Catholic grandmother, whom they love and greatly admire, should not be doing something that they see her doing. That is not fair to her or to them. That is scandal.
And if he does not receive an annulment and they cannot get married, what? Oops, he was actually married to another woman when he was holding Grandma’s hand and they were taking walks in the moonlight! We had no idea! My bad.
It would not damage our relationship with her. MIL has a history of many, many boundary issues with us, for many, many years. Just last year, when Thanksgiving was at our house, she informed my wife and me days in advance that boyfriend may be coming to dinner, without asking our thoughts. We gently explained why this was not ok in our home. She knew this, and yet today, after my wife and the kids had lunch with her at her place of work, while my wife was saying goodbye and walking to her car/wrangling four kids, this was when MIL chose to drop this on her, knowing how we feel about the situation. She also has asked multiple times if boyfriend may store his ATV and tools on our property while he lives in another state, because she says he wants to move to our area eventually to be near her. These are just a few of the boundary issues that involve this situation. Boundaries have been an ongoing problem with her in many different departments. *
You explain to your children that Grandma is not making the best decision, that you and your wife do not condone what their grandmother is doing, but that she is still their grandmother and they are to treat her with respect.
Well, you only invited your mother-in-law, not the boyfriend. If she wants to bring him, she should take that up with your brother and sister-in-law. It’s not your responsibility then, especially since you found out about the boyfriend coming AFTER you invited her. If anyone accuses you of being involved in scandal, tell them that.
I get what you are saying, but I’m not ready to have to explain that to my kids. Plus, I think it’s uncharitable to MIL for me to tell my children that she is doing something that we, as Catholics, cannot condone, while she disagrees and does it anyway, and she is also Catholic. It’s correct, but it makes us criticize her if we say it. And I’m not ready to plop that into my kids’ laps. I am not comfortable with being put into a position where I have to either potentially damage their relationship with her, or lie to them. Not fair. They have a wonderful relationship with her, and this would cause them to view her differently from now on. To avoid that situation, we are asking Grandma to refrain from flaunting the relationship in front of our children (not to mention three of our godchildren) so that there is no inappropriate behavior to need to explain. What she does on her own time is her business, obviously.
This probably sums up best how my wife and I ended up feeling about the whole thing. I think we know what we have to do.
If he is happily married his wife would clearly see it as an act of betrayal and so be deeply hurt by it. However the fact that this marriage has already broken down and sounds as though it is a simple lack-of-form case I think it’s pretty safe to view it as not a marriage. The fact that he has another previous marriage is a little more worrisome, and that first marriage of his is the one I would be concerned about. Since you still seem to think divorce makes a difference I will point out that he is in fact divorced from the woman we as Catholics are obliged to consider his real wife, the first woman he married.
Which is, as I pointed out, up to you and your wife to determine what you think is best. I’m not trying to override that authority you have here. I’m giving you another perspective from which to look at the situation while ultimately leaving the decision up to your prudence and judgement.
Children are capable of understanding a lot, but of course you would have to modify exactly how such a thing is explained according to what each child can understand. It really is not a terrible thing for children to learn that someone they love is on a misguided path. I had to learn that when I was about 8 with my own father. When explained gently it can be a great opportunity for kids to learn that people aren’t perfect, even good people make mistakes, and that we must love them anyway. As for the scandal, it is only scandal if it leads them to believe such an action is moral and so leads them into sin in the future. That is why it is a really good idea to ensure they are introduced to the mistakes others make * as* mistakes while they still have you to guide them. Again, the decision of when they are ready is ultimately up to you and your wife. You know your kids and where they are at, I don’t, s o I’m not going to try to tell you what you should do, just put what might be a new perspective out there for you to think about.
Yes, then you explain that MIL made a mistake. That she thought it was ok but it really wasn’t. But has now fixed her mistake. As I mentioned before, it is a great opportunity to teach kids how to love the sinner but hate the sin. To disapprove of the action while still loving and accepting the person.
The boundary issue is another, though real issue for you to deal with. Although I will point out that the fact that you and your wife have set up a boundary that MIL not bring her friend to thanksgiving at your house does not mean that your brother and Sil have set the same boundaries. So the fact that she plans to bring her friend to SIL’s house is not a breaking of that particular boundary you have set up. Honestly, at this point, I think it is something for brother and SIL to deal with, not you and your wife. Let them know she plans to bring her friend, perhaps voice your concerns and let them deal with it as they please, it is their house after all, and so it is their rules and boundaries that matter.
I appreciate your opinion, but we dont’ share this opinion. I don’t see it as trouble at all to stand up for Truth while potentially having to cut ties for some amount of time, regardless of what time of the year it is. But that’s a moot point right now because this is just your opinion vs. my opinion, and I already decided what I was going to do (and did it).
My own life is proof to the contrary. What you are giving is the secular answer to a spiritual problem. I prefer the Catholic one, which is found in the Gospels. THAT answer says that Truth is worth defending, even if it means cutting earthly ties to even our father, mother, or brother, according to Jesus. ( Lk 12:49-53) I’ve employed Christ’s example of defending Truth in my own family before. IT resulted in cut-off communication for over a year. Guess what? Now, 3 years later, those family members and I are closer than we have ever been. We have a profoundly deeper relationship with one another than we ever had in all my life of growing up with them. The secular answer that you offer leads to sweeping things under the proverbial rug, where they fester and mutate into new and more problems. The Catholic answer, which I employed, addresses issues head-on focusing only on Truth and, in the end, actually cures the ailment.
I have to say no, but I admit I might nto have been clear, here. Bro/SIL are on my side of the family, while MIL is wife’s mom. Bro/SIL hardly know MIL and live far, far, away. I can almost guarantee they’d have had no problem inviting this other person. But, THEY don’t bear the burden of explaining to their kids what gradma is doing with a married man. My wife and I do. You see, MIL live pretty close to us and our kids spend LOTS of time with grandma.
You also know better than we do the extent to which your MIL gives scandal when she is around this friend of hers. If they only displayed a platonic friendship around your children, then there would be no questions and you would have more latitude. It is OK for a married man to have thanksgiving dinner with the family of a woman friend. In some cases, his absent wife might not even find it cause for jealousy! If they are obviously carrying on a romance even though the children know the fellow is married, that paints you into a corner with respects to keeping your children from being scandalized when they ought to remain innocent, not to mention providing your MIL with a near-occasion of sin by providing her with a venue for wishful thinking about what kind of relationship she is in.