Millions in Egypt see Our Lady

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redrosetea said:
I might be wrong but my guess is that the Catholic church became interested because Catholics also witnessed the event as did Protestants and Muslims and Jews

In my opinion the more diverse the people that said it happened ,the better. It means that other faiths saw it happen, and they can testify to the reality of it

I am sorry I posted this. I did it because I felt that it was important for Our Lady, and then I am treated to bashing of what others hold sacred…I am off this thread and this forum
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Don’t be so thin-skinned. No matter the topic, there will always be as least two points of view, and many more opinions. You should not take it personal.

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redrosetea said:
I might be wrong but my guess is that the Catholic church became interested because Catholics also witnessed the event as did Protestants and Muslims and Jews

In my opinion the more diverse the people that said it happened ,the better. It means that other faiths saw it happen, and they can testify to the reality of it

I am sorry I posted this. I did it because I felt that it was important for Our Lady, and then I am treated to bashing of what others hold sacred…I am off this thread and this forum
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I am not sure who bashed you. These forums are meant for discussion and that means that there are most likely multiple opinions on each question.
 
What is the Church’s judgment on these apparitions? Documents please. And thank you

**The Coptic Catholic, the Coptic Orthodox, and Greek Orthodox patriarchs of Alexandria all have accepted thee visions as worthy of credence and have entered a commemoration of them into their respective calendars.

These visions resulted in many Muslims being baptized at peril of their lives. Should this not indicate their origin?

BTW–it’s been my privilege to meet several people who were present at these apparitions.**

This is a Coptic Orthodox apparition. It occured around a Coptic Orthodox Church. Why would the pope of Rome even be involved?

Both the Copti and Greek Orthodox Patriarchs of Alexandria have as part of their full title “Pope and Patriarch of the God-protected city of Alexandria”, so “papal” in this context could easily NOT be referring to Rome.
 
bpbasilphx said:
**
These visions resulted in many Muslims being baptized at peril of their lives. Should this not indicate their origin?

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No.

This is hardly the indicator of divine or saintly intervention.

Is there any information as to what these Muslims learned or accepted about Catholicism prior to their baptism. If they entered the Church without proper disposition or if they do not pursue continuing education, they are bringing peril on themselves - worse perhaps than retribution from other Muslims.

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For future reference, here’s a list of approved and non-approved sites:

http://www.apparitions.org/#apparitions

Zeitoun is spelled wrong, but listed, with a nice gold star by its name, meaning approved.

That said, it is private revelation. Take it or not.

The title of the thread is kind of- kind of- misleading, as this happened in 1968-1971.
 
MrS said:
No.

This is hardly the indicator of divine or saintly intervention.

Is there any information as to what these Muslims learned or accepted about Catholicism prior to their baptism. If they entered the Church without proper disposition or if they do not pursue continuing education, they are bringing peril on themselves - worse perhaps than retribution from other Muslims.

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Yes, I’m sure they were baptized right then and there on the spot with no more formal process involved. :rolleyes:
 
At least the apparitions don’t involve any kind of “third secret” or supposedly improperly done consecrations to the Blessed Mother’s ‘immaculate heart’ for conspiracy theorists to obsess over… seems safe enough for anyone. 👍
 
**
This is hardly the indicator of divine or saintly intervention. **

**Yes, it is.

Jesus said, “By their fruits you will know them.”**
 
bpbasilphx said:
**
This is hardly the indicator of divine or saintly intervention. **

Yes, it is.

Jesus said, "By their fruits you will know them."
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So, these Muslim converts have produced which fruits? Is there any report on their conversions, or on anything God is doing in their lives.

The conversion is great… but now what.
 
**So, these Muslim converts have produced which fruits? Is there any report on their conversions, or on anything God is doing in their lives.

The conversion is great… but now what.**

**The fruit of these apparitions IS precisely the conversion of Mohammedans.

Now, first tell us about the fruit of your own life befor you inquire about the fruit in other people’s.**
 
bpbasilphx said:
**So, these Muslim converts have produced which fruits? Is there any report on their conversions, or on anything God is doing in their lives.

The conversion is great… but now what.**

The fruit of these apparitions IS precisely the conversion of Mohammedans.

Now, first tell us about the fruit of your own life befor you inquire about the fruit in other people’s.
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Well, let’s see… for one, I enjoy two dozen grandchildren - all christians. Their future lives, their effect (or lack thereof) in sharing the Gospel is unknown. If they do, that will be by the grace of God. Not because they are my “fruits”.

If one or more of the Muslim converts is responsible for teaching error and leading others astray, where is the “fruit” of their seeing an apparition?

You are right, “…by their fruits you will know them…”

The point is that it is by their fruits. Apparations do NOT convert. Only God converts. If He in fact used the sight as a means, great. But the sight did not convert.

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MrS said:
The conversion is great… but now what.
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That’s a great question for all of us… there’s no assurance that anyone who converts or any Christian by birth might not at some time lose the faith, lead people astray. Neither is there any assurance that they’re going to do anything great by which you can judge the sincerity of their conversion or committment to the faith.

Let’s simply be glad when conversions take place and not judge or demand proof. St Paul was converted by a heavenly vision, why is it so difficult to believe others might be?
 
MrS said:
The point is that it is by their fruits. Apparations do NOT convert. Only God converts. If He in fact used the sight as a means, great. But the sight did not convert.
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And if God uses this or any other means, what is it to us? No one is saying that you must believe in this apparition or be convinced of its heavenly origin. So don’t believe it, fine. 👍
 
If you turn to Catholicism at risk of your life, that shows you’re sincere right there. Jesus said that there is no greater love than that which is in a man who gives up his life for his friends. He also said that we should pick up our cross and follow him. Almost anyone who converts from Islam to Christianity in Egypt bears a cross to do so.

We don’t need to question further fruits. The act of conversion in this climate is powerful evidence supporting the godly nature of these visions.
 
Don’t forget: Of all the thousands of Muslims who saw the apparitions, they could not legally be told what they were seeing. For a Christian to tell a Muslim anything about Christianity could be considered an attempt to convert a Muslim away from Islam. The government had to look the other way and allow the Christians to tell their story, because there were too many questions.

One result is that Egypt has been getting the largest number of conversions to Christianity of any other Muslim country in the region. This is known not by the official numbers (since officially it is illegal to change your faith from Islam to another religion) but by self-reporting by the Christians themselves and their leaders. It’s one reason why Egypt in recent years has seen a strong crackdown on Christian activity.

<><
 
Can you see her feet?

It’s an Irish Catholic saying. What it means is that if you can’t see her feet then it’s probably a demon. They have cloven hooves and they try to hide them.

No joke meant.

If it’s real, it’s probably a demon masquerading as The Lady intending to draw people away from God.
 
Starwynd said:
Can you see her feet?

It’s an Irish Catholic saying. What it means is that if you can’t see her feet then it’s probably a demon. They have cloven hooves and they try to hide them.

No joke meant.

If it’s real, it’s probably a demon masquerading as The Lady intending to draw people away from God.
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Ok if that’s seriously an Irish saying, but do you honestly believe that demons have cloven hooves? Gimme a break! Anyone check for a pointy tail? :rolleyes:

How on earth do you figure those apparitions have drawn anyone away from God? There weren’t even messages like some of these other more famous Catholic Church approved apparitions… I don’t understand how your statement is supposed to make sense. “I believe I saw the Virgin Mary, that sure does weaken my faith!” :confused:
 
Nicholas82 said:
How on earth do you figure those apparitions have drawn anyone away from God? There weren’t even messages like some of these other more famous Catholic Church approved apparitions… I don’t understand how your statement is supposed to make sense. “I believe I saw the Virgin Mary, that sure does weaken my faith!” :confused:
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Lol! That’s great :D.

I suspect that Starwynd is a Protestant? Or if not Protestant, one of those that believes Catholicism to be evil, apostasy or some such? And all saintly apparitions are really necromancy?

That’s the only way I can figure such a view making sense.
 
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