Miracles, Athiests & Agnostics

[christcnection1]

KarenNC:

The followers of those other religions certainly seem to think it does.

It’s possible I would too. I just hope it’s not based on the miraculous alone.

Do I believe that the Gods are capable of doing things that are outside the abilities of humans to reproduce and that They may choose to do so on occasion? Yes, I do.

You mentioned “Gods” How do you define “Gods?” Is there a Most High God? Did they all exist from all eternity? Just curious what your beliefs are on this.

Perhaps. As I said, I have yet to see any compelling evidence that shows that He is any different than any other God.

Jesus Christ claimed to be God. He was raised from the dead. He was prophesied for centuries before His coming that He will be the Messiah and the Savior of the world.

These are clearly extraordinary things. I’m not aware of any prophet or teacher that fit all these points.

As someone once said, “just because it’s sacred, doesn’t mean we humans have any business inviting it in and letting it make our decisions for us without applying a moral test to our acts. Just because it’s a god doesn’t mean it’s right, or just, or kind… we are responsible for the gods we choose to worship.” - Cat Chapin-Bishop

Ideas have consequences.

I certainly know that that is not what Christianity teaches. Given the frequency with which I encounter arguments based on numbers, I am not sure that that is not what many Christians seem to actually believe.

Fair enough. I just believe it was relevant to a holistic argument.

Not sure what you are getting at here. Do you mean “would not have spent”? Why? Christians spend a great deal of time working to debunk the claims of religions that they do not believe to be either true or unique. Is that fact that they seek to debunk them proof of their validity?

No, my only point is that the skeptics try to disprove Christianity because of its uniqueness. If the worldview didn’t challenge individuals and civilization is such a profound way, it’s unlikely they would spend so much time trying to debunk it.

This could be applied to other worldviews as well.

If you cannot see anything unique about Jesus Christ, the Bible, or the Catholic Church, this conversation was not reasonable to start with. (from my last post)

Oh, well. Shame, really.

There is something unique and different about all religions. They are not the same. At times, the messages are profoundly and fundamentally different. If they were all the same, there would be no need for dialogue such as this.

Why? Because I have found a different answer than yours?

No, because God Himself said it. (John 18)

36Jesus said, “My kingdom is not of this world. If it were, my servants would fight to prevent my arrest by the Jews. But now my kingdom is from another place.”

37"You are a king, then!" said Pilate.
Jesus answered, “You are right in saying I am a king. In fact, for this reason I was born, and for this I came into the world, to testify to the truth. Everyone on the side of truth listens to me.”

38"What is truth?" Pilate asked.

This includes you Karen. Jesus also said that He is “the way, the truth, and the life” and that “no one comes to the Father except through Him.”

Don’t reject the truth because of my own wretched sinfulness. I apologize if my directness has come off in the wrong way. It’s most certainly born out of love for you.

Karen, I wish you the best on your journey. I hope to see you on the other side. (from my last post)

…and if I’m wrong and I see you on the other side, I will look you in your eyes and give you a huge and sincere apology.

Peace and Blessings,
JB

 

[christcnection1]

How do you define “unique”? In one sense, every religion is unique, in the sense that it teaches beliefs and practices that are not found in other religions, or at least are communicated differently than they are communicated in other religions.

Indeed all religions are unique. Here is a good way to describe what I mean.

"We look back upon history, and what do we see? Empires rising and falling. Revolutions and Counterrevolutions. Wealth accumulated and wealth disbursed. Shakespeare has written of the rise and fall of great ones, that ebb and flow with the moon. I look back upon my own fellow countrymen, once upon a time dominating a quarter of the world, most of them convinced, in the words of what is still a popular song, that the God who made them mighty, shall make them mightier yet.

"I’ve heard a crazed, cracked Austrian announce to the world the establishment of a Reich that would last a thousand years. I have seen an Italian clown say he was going to stop and restart the calendar with his own ascension to power. I’ve heard a murderous Georgian brigand in the Kremlin, acclaimed by the intellectual elite of the world as wiser than Solomon, more humane than Marcus Aurelius, more enlightened than Ashoka.

"I have seen America, wealthier and in terms of military weaponry, more powerful than the rest of the world put together, so that had the American people so desired, they could have outdone a Caesar, or an Alexander in the range and scale of their conquests.

"All in one lifetime, all in one lifetime, all gone. Gone with the wind. England part of a tiny island off the coast of Europe, threatened with dismemberment and even bankruptcy. Hitler and Mussolini dead, remembered only in infamy. Stalin a forbidden name in the regime he helped found and dominate for some three decades. America haunted by fears of running our of those precious fluids that keeps their motorways roaring, and the smog settling, with troubled memories of a disastrous campaign in Vietnam, and the victories of the Don Quixotes of the media as they charged the windmills of Watergate. All in one lifetime, all in one lifetime, all gone. Gone with the wind.

“Behind the debris of these solemn supermen, and self-styled imperial diplomatists, there stands the gigantic figure of one, because of whom, by whom, in whom and through whom alone, mankind may still have peace: The person of Jesus Christ. I present him as the way, the truth, and the life.” (Malcom Muggeridge)

Do you know of any other prophet or teacher that was prophesied to be the Messiah and Savior of the world, claimed to be God, did countless miracles, and was resurrected from the dead?

The list goes on, but you get the idea.

Indeed, there is no figure in the world even close to Jesus Christ.