"Miracles" Part One, Jesus

[StrawberryJam]

Let’s start just with the ones Jesus preformed while in the flesh here with us?

Anyone have a complete list of them?

Now, let’s objectively look at this list. Is there a single one there that never happened before him?

 

[passus]

Let’s start just with the ones Jesus preformed while in the flesh here with us?

As opposed to which ones?

Anyone have a complete list of them?

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Miracles_attributed_to_Jesus

Now, let’s objectively look at this list. Is there a single one there that never happened before him?

I don’t get the question “that never happened before him?” What are you trying to demonstrate or prove?

 

[StrawberryJam]

As opposed to which ones?

 

[utunumsint]

passus;5533235:

Let me clarify. Had any of these miracles been claimed to have happened before Jesus?

Which would be unique in any way?

Edit to add: I had to adjust the quotes and still messed them up. Please ask me if you find this unclear. Lost the original reply I gave you and winged it.

I think the resurection would be unique, unless you think the ancient resurrection myths are historical.

As far as the raising of the dead (as distinct from resurrection) you could say that the incident with Lazarus was fairly unique. Most other accounts of this sort in the Bible are based on fairly recent deaths.

The walking on water is also fairly unique.

God bless,
Ut

 

[paul_c]

I think the question of whether Jesus performed any miracles uniquely is a red herring.
The point is the context in which he did them. He said he was the son of God and proved it by carrying out miracles, some great some small. Among them:

rising from the Dead
ascending into heaven
raising people from the Dead
walking on Water
being transfigured
curing lepers
curing the lame, the mute, the blind
multiplying the loaves and fish to feed 4000 and 5000
driving out demons

The purpose of the miracles was to demonstrate his divinity. Others have done miracles but not in that context . When Peter healed the lame man and St. Paul raised the boy from the dead who fell form the window, they repeated the miracles of Jesus, but did so on the basis of their faith in Jesus. When Elijah called down fire from heaven, it wasn’t to prove that he was God, but to prove that the true God was the God of Israel.

See the difference?

 

[StrawberryJam]

I think the question of whether Jesus performed any miracles uniquely is a red herring.
The point is the context in which he did them. He said he was the son of God and proved it by carrying out miracles, some great some small. Among them:

rising from the Dead
ascending into heaven
raising people from the Dead
walking on Water
being transfigured
curing lepers
curing the lame, the mute, the blind
multiplying the loaves and fish to feed 4000 and 5000
driving out demons

Thanks everyone, for the answers so far. I am simply replying to this thread so as not to reply tons of posts on this thread so I can refer to it easier for parts 2 and 3 and maybe more later.

PaulC,

I understand what you are driving at, but don’t assume why I am asking and what I am examining and what this is all leading up to. I don’t even know for sure yet lol. Well, I have a guideline in my mind, but that is it.

I’m just examining the miracles right now, not putting Jesus on trial for his divinity.

 

[paul_c]

Thanks everyone, for the answers so far. I am simply replying to this thread so as not to reply tons of posts on this thread so I can refer to it easier for parts 2 and 3 and maybe more later.

PaulC,

I understand what you are driving at, but don’t assume why I am asking and what I am examining and what this is all leading up to. I don’t even know for sure yet lol. Well, I have a guideline in my mind, but that is it.

I’m just examining the miracles right now, not putting Jesus on trial for his divinity.

Why aren’t you willing to share your goals here.

 

[StrawberryJam]

Why aren’t you willing to share your goals here.

Goals in this thread? Or in general?

I think it is best to examine the miracles of Jesus first when looking at the topic. Compare and contrast those with earlier miracles of God, and then finally the miracles post Christ.
Finally, examine what miracles if any were already believed by people, but not through the Christian God.

 

[StrawberryJam]

Okay, correct list or not I am going to guess all these miracles Jesus did, had a focal point.

I’m going to say it could be His Kingdom.

 

[utunumsint]

Okay, correct list or not I am going to guess all these miracles Jesus did, had a focal point.

I’m going to say it could be His Kingdom.

That would be a good place to start. But there are a great many topics included under that heading, not the least of which is the nature of God, and Christ’s own nature.

God bless,
Ut

 

[paul_c]

Okay, correct list or not I am going to guess all these miracles Jesus did, had a focal point.

I’m going to say it could be His Kingdom.

I would say that all the miracles were done to help people to follow Jesus.

Some were miracles done to individuals (healings,etc

and others were done in a visible way to multiple people or to crowds
(water into wine, walking on water, calming of the seas, multiplication of loaves, transfiguration, resurrection, ascension, )

All of these demonstrated his divinity (awakening them spiritually to the realities of God)
while most were also helping others with their problems (hunger, sickness, lack of wine, lack of fish (the catching of fish miracles, fear from the storms).

So he help them both corporally and spiritually, giving us an example to follow.

 

[StrawberryJam]

Okay, so we all agree the miracles show the divinity of Jesus, point to God and His Kingdom, and not all of them were particularly unique really.
I agree some were, if one accepts them all as a believer. I think that pretty much wraps up Miracles part one, Jesus for now.

Next phase: Miracles part 2 God of the OT

 

[GeorgeSword]

Actually, Strawberry… remember that Christ died so that we might achieve salvation? I would call that a miracle. And then there is the Eucharist, and that’s pretty unique, too, methinks.

 

[StrawberryJam]

Actually, Strawberry… remember that Christ died so that we might achieve salvation? I would call that a miracle. And then there is the Eucharist, and that’s pretty unique, too, methinks.

I make room for those to be included, because I do admit some were unique. I’m only saying that most were not, not trying to take away from those very important ones you mention here.

Guess it’s off to the part two which should go pretty fast, so we can get to the exciting part 3 and then the controversy that will possibly erupt there.

 

[paul_c]

I make room for those to be included, because I do admit some were unique. I’m only saying that most were not, not trying to take away from those very important ones you mention here.

Guess it’s off to the part two which should go pretty fast, so we can get to the exciting part 3 and then the controversy that will possibly erupt there.

What are you trying to lead us to? Why don’t we just cut to the chase and get to the point you want to make.

 

[StrawberryJam]

What are you trying to lead us to? Why don’t we just cut to the chase and get to the point you want to make.

I’m trying to give you guys every opportunity to comment on each aspect so if I don’t understand anything you can correct along the way. You make it sound as if I have some kind of trap set or something.

 

[paul_c]

I’m trying to give you guys every opportunity to comment on each aspect so if I don’t understand anything you can correct along the way. You make it sound as if I have some kind of trap set or something.

Trust me, we can comment on multiple aspects at once. I personally feel its most productive to let us know where you are going with something so we don’t waste a lot of time and effort in researching extraneous points.