Modest Dress For Women

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I agree with you both men and women are called to modesty, 100% agree. But I disagree with your assessment that modesty depends on our cultural circumstance. I was a Sociology major for 2 years, entire assumption of the discipline is morality functions different in different scenarios based on our cultural circumstance. It’s just not true and so I left the discipline, it’s also an atheist discipline at its core.

A bikini can be immodest and people can think nothing of it. Some states in the US have legalized toplessnes in public because it’s sexist to not let women be topless. First off, guys should wear shirts just as women should, the standard of modesty applies to both men and women. Just because some women think being topless in public is fine and isn’t immodest doesn’t mean the action itself isn’t immodest.

We define something’s morality not by the perception of it but rather by the intrinsic value of it. There is nothing instrinsly immodest with “showing ancle” so this was a perception of immodestly that isn’t actually immodest. But I think many of us could argue bikinis are immodest, it doesn’t matter who admits they are or aren’t. A bikini shows a particular part of the body as “the best asset” a women has, as opposed to her personality, thoughts, feeling, interests… the same goes with men wearing speedos, it’s immodest because it shows something as the “best asset” when it isn’t.
 
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No I don’t believe it is. Am I thanking her for wearing good clothes so men don’t lust? Indirectly yes this happens. But rather, I am thanking her for wearing clothes that protect her own dignity and her own respect and her own value. She is dressing in a modest way that shows guys her “best asset” isn’t her body but rather it is her personality and everything about her. While dressing this way she also protects others from lusting so it’s two-fold
 
Nothing in my mind is more attractive than a female who dresses modestly because it shows she cares about her own dignity, worth, value. I think other Catholic guys can agree? This is far and beyond more attractive than revealing clothing. At college I see females in very revealing clothing every weekend when everyone parties (I don’t party I watch sports or go on CAF, no joke 😛) and I find this very sad. It shows they don’t respect themselves as they should as as we all should.

I think everyone in this world wants attention and affection. But let’s be honest, do you want attention because you wore revealing clothes and a guy noticed and liked it? No this is lust and an attention that doesn’t value you as a person but rather as a thing. Rather, we want attention because we are funny, kind, smart…

Pope St. John Paul II says the fundamental problem with porn is not that human bodies are bad (because they aren’t) but because porn shows only part of us, only our bodies. Porn doesn’t show who we really are, our personality, likes, dislikes, everything. This is the same with modesty. We want to show everything about us, and that requires us, men and women, to dress respectively of our own dignity
 
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GospelOfMatthew said:
I was a Sociology major for 2 years, entire assumption of the discipline is morality functions different in different scenarios based on our cultural circumstance. It’s just not true and so I left the discipline, it’s also an atheist discipline at its core.
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We obviously have completely different views of the world.
 
What are people’s opinions of the modesty of leggings at the gym.

They are ubiquitous where I am… like almost no girls wear shorts or gym pants. I personally wear a pair of short loose running shorts over my leggings in a matching colour. JW what y’all do?
 
We can agree to disagree 🙂. I use to believe there stuff but I have a deep distaste for moral relativism and the idea of no objective morality. But this is beside the point of this thread 🧵(a spool of thread…)
 
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No, I am saying the logic of modestly applies across the board from what we wear to what we do to what we watch. It seems to me you disagree with my view of modesty? Which is fine, we can view it differently
 
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GospelOfMatthew said:
But I disagree with your assessment that modesty depends on our cultural circumstance.
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Then what does modesty depend on because there are an awful lot of cultures where it is perfectly acceptable for people to show a lot more skin then Eurocentric people tend to be ok with…
 
I do disagree it’s not just your view of modesty, but that you are stating that women who don’t dress to your standards of modesty lack self respect and don’t care about their own dignity, value, and worth.
 
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Nude beaches in Europe are common and acceptable in some countries. Does that mean they are modest and moral? Clearly they think there is no immodestly in nude beaches. I would say woah woah, yes this is immodest. What is modest here is modest there, we may view it different but it doesn’t change what it is.
 
So are the people shown in publications like Nat Geo, who are wearing (or not wearing) what is typical for their culture, breaking some universal modesty rule?
 
GospelOfMatthew said:
Nude beaches in Europe are common and acceptable in some countries. Does that mean they are modest and moral? Clearly they think there is no immodestly in nude beaches. I would say woah woah, yes this is immodest. What is modest here is modest there, we may view it different but it doesn’t change what it is.
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I noted that there are entire cultures that have no problem with bearing skin. Your reference to Europeans on a beach is hardly relevant and perhaps a bit offensive…
 
But if in your opinion what’s modest here is modest there, why would this be confusing?
 
GospelOfMatthew said:
But I disagree with your assessment that modesty depends on our cultural circumstance.
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Let me put it to you this way.

You said
But I disagree with your assessment that modesty depends on our cultural circumstance.
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If modesty does not depend on “cultural circumstance”, please explain why it is that a Zulu woman would be perfectly fine baring her chest in public, but a woman from England would not.
 
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I think what you describe is fine. If the shirt covers your pelvic area/butt and is only showing your legs it is no different than wearing shorts…except you are actually covered by fabric. My personal preference is to make sure it is long enough that if I bend over or reach for something I am still covered.

With that being said I will disagree that it is appropriate for one woman to wear leggings and not another. I’m not sure exactly what is meant by this but it seems like typical shaming of one body over another. I think what the OP describes would certainly be appropriate for anyone to wear. If someone doesn’t like it, they can mind their own business and keep their eyes elsewhere. Both women and men have enough battles to fight without feeling uncomfortable or judged in their own skin.
 
Who knows I’m not her. But just because she wants to do something doesn’t mean it’s moral or modest. If I want to walk down Times Square without a shirt on, I have the legal right to do so, wouldn’t we say this seems immodest. It doesn’t matter what I want to do, I didn’t create morality
 
I have two teenage girls and because they are both athletes and usually train for two hours a day after school, they like to wear relaxed, casual athletic clothes. That includes leggings. They wear sports quality leggings from good brands, which means they are made from thick fabric and are not remotely see-through. They wear them layered with shirts, sweatshirts, jackets etc. and running shoes or white Van’s style flats that are v. popular around here. They often have school spirit gear on too.

They wear clothes that transition quickly to training. My very tall 15 yr old is on Crew so she will wear her leggings straight down to the water. None of us are particularly focused on preventing boys/men lusting after them as they need to be practical. At the same time I feel my girls have a good sense of sensible but attractive dressing that is still fashionable. But they are usually too busy to get too obsessed with fashion and they leave the house so early in the morning to get to school (6:40am) the number one focus is comfort. Most of their athletic clothes are warm and practical rather than “immodest”.

Also in terms of modesty, the Qur’an teaches both sexes should be modest and not wear close fitting clothing, so in Islamic countries traditional clothing is usually modest for both sexes.
 
GospelOfMatthew said:
Who knows I’m not her. But just because she wants to do something doesn’t mean it’s moral or modest. If I want to walk down Times Square without a shirt on, I have the legal right to do so, wouldn’t we say this seems immodest. It doesn’t matter what I want to do, I didn’t create morality
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What? How would the Zulu woman know that her bare chest was immodest if every other woman in her culture was also barechested?
 
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