Morality Catechism CCC 405,418 vs CCC2347

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davleemye

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My church that CCC 2347 is negated by CCC 405,408. Basically that everyone in that place desires sinful action towards their neighbor, and between women and men as friends. I was pressured out of my lay bible study group because I was the only may there and could not enter church with others or sit among them. i do not believe that people should be so cold against others.

inclination toward sin and evil is called “concupiscence” (CCC 405, 418

**[2347 ** The virtue of chastity blossoms in friendship . It shows the disciple how to follow and imitate him who has chosen us as his friends,134 who has given himself totally to us and allows us to participate in his divine estate. Chastity is a promise of immortality.

David
 
Those two bits of the chatecism aren’t related. Could you explain more? Your post doesn’t really make any sense.

Are you saying that you felt you couldn’t remain because you were the only man in the group? Did you accidentally attend a women’s Bible Study group? If so, there is likely a men’s Bible Study group you could get involved with.
 
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davleemye said:
Basically that everyone in that place desires sinful action towards their neighbor, and between women and men as friends.
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I’d not want to be in a group where everyone desired sinful actions.

If it is a women’s group, then, no men allowed.

Perhaps you can start a men’s group, or a mixed gender group.
 
Your post doesn’t make any sense. Please clarify what your question is.
 
It seems that relationship(s) with female members of @davleemye 's parish have been a point of contention for awhile now.

I wonder if there is a language or cultural obstacle?
 
It is a posted adoration lay prayer group on the door. All are welcome including non Catholics, so it says.
Music, singing, Rosary. Fellowship after.

The question was concupiscence CCC415 vs CCC2347:

Chastity is expressed notably in friendship with one’s neighbor. Whether it develops between persons of the same or opposite sex, friendship represents a great good for all. It leads to spiritual communion. CCC 2347.
 
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One says man is affected by original sin including sexual desires.

The other says men and women can be Christian friends.

I was pressured to leave, go someplace else.

There for the wrong reasons. The reason I was there was because my neighbor invited me. She was told the mentoring of me was wrong.

It was posted on the door as open to both men and women and non Catholics.

I am Interested in the catholic faith and baptism.

Thanks
 
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Are you a non Catholic looking to convert. And did your kindly neighbour invite you along to help with this process

Has there been talk of an inappropriate or non chaste relationship between you and your neighbour within this group?

why and how were you pressured to leave?
 
I’m sorry you experienced that, but I wouldn’t let it deter you. Speak to the priest or the parish office, and they’ll be able to help you find a group you can work with.

If you’re not Catholic yet, you probably want to get into the RCIA program. That’s going to be the best way for you to learn about what the church teaches.
 
I did speak to the priest. I enjoyed perpetual adoration and that was the only one here.

Because I spoke to the priest, several are shunning me, and more have received a mailing this guy sent out. He’s a speaker at young people’s events. My neighbor is mad at me. My desire is to repair the damage.

Sunday’s I must attend a evangelical church, and my family does not want me going to a Catholic Church. I am a caregiver full time. I want a catholic baptism because it is very beautiful and meaningful. In short I am a secret catholic, but would love to receive the Eucharist someday too. RCIA is very long. I do know all those things already.
 
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davleemye said:
Because I spoke to the priest, several are shunning me, and more have received a mailing this guy sent out. He’s a speaker at young people’s events. My neighbor is mad at me. My desire is to repair the damage.
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If this is true then perhaps you should seek out another parish in your area. If that is not an option then, quite frankly, who gives a crap what those people are doing? If they are shunning you for trying to join the Church then I’m sure God will have some pretty choice words for them at their judgment. Go to mass, go to RCIA, and ignore them. They only have power over you if you let them.
davleemye said:
Sunday’s I must attend a evangelical church, and my family does not want me going to a Catholic Church.
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From the rest of your post, it sounds like you are an adult. So, again, I have to say, who cares what they think? They are trying to keep you from entering the fullness of Truth. If you must, go to their service and then attend a Catholic mass later.

Remember, what people think of you, what they say to you, what they do to you, none of it matters. What matters is that you move closer to God. Those people can’t save you, only God has that power.
 
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I 100% agree. It takes a lot of courage. I am new as I have never been churched. I am a senior citizen. You are right.
 
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A. I desired to learn and eventual Baptism. That is important. Fellowship and new friends.
I am simply a man who accepted Jesus from a radio program long ago. I was just 17 back then. I love The Lord. My neighbor taught me the Rosary as we would walk our dogs occasionally. It’s from the Bible, I like it. She is very dedicated to her faith. My family likes the lady and we support her charity. I am retired! I am a stroke victim.

Yes, that was my neighbors intention.

B. Yes. My neighbor told the guy running the group I would be attending. He asked her; How do you know this man? She told him that she was mentoring me. Praying the Rosary. This man said a single woman like her can not mentor a married man.

C: I am very Bible studied. I have studied the Catholic faith on line. I love the presence of the flesh and blood of Jesus in the Eucharist. I am very chaste all my life. Adoration chapel is so rewarding.

D: Neighbors 20 + years, there has never been talk of non chaste relationship. We are never alone ever. Never in a car, out to eat or anything. There are others who walk for exercise. I have to walk for my health and well being. I went there in my own car.

Read CCC 2347. It is simply a God approved friendship. It’s in your catechism.

There was no direct accusations. The guy only. Because of mans desire to sin and me probably not being Catholic. Who knows. Opus Dei required absolute obedience to the leader. Aspects of spiritual abuse exists here too.

E. My experience there follows. Day one: your neighbor can’t mentor you anymore…

Day Two: You can not walk with each other anytime.

Six months later: Cant enter together or sit nearby an elderly lady who was friendly.

Should attend another time period alone. Jesus alone suffices. Accused of being there for the wrong reasons. He says all is Gods will.

Currently: shunning.

I was always quiet, peaceful, respectful. Worked very hard to learn the prayers, novenas, and song materials.

God Bless, Thank you. I quit church altogether. I pray and trust God will open that door back up.

Please, please read the following from pope Francis. It will clear my intention up. It is a good read of how churches should treat people:

https://www.catholicnews.com/services/englishnews/2015/pope-says-god-never-shuts-the-door.cfm

Another site with the same bulletin.

http://www.dosafl.com/god-never-shuts-the-door-church-always-must-be-open-too-pope-says/
 
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There is a ton to unpack here. Why are you submitting yourself to this mans authority. This man is not clergy or Opus Dei.
Have you spoken to a Catholic Priest and enrolled in RCIA?

What is your wife’s intention, does she wish to become Catholic too?
 
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I left the church and rarely attend church anywhere. Watch Church on TV.

I don’t feel I submitted to his authority.

Talked to the priest at that time. Various people from other churches use the admiration chapel. Don’t know the result as to if he’s still there. He has not been active on YouTube recently. My neighbor and others shun me.

My wife was always against me trying to obtain baptism in a Catholic Church. Instead I had attended the adoration chapel because my neighbor invited me there. I always felt a tendency to investigate the catholic faith.

I desire to attend adoration chapel, feel included there, and enjoy the singing and prayers and readings. This admonishment at the front door was unexpected and was unprovoked in any way.
 
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Agree 1000%. The men would come once or twice and disappear. The group went from 15-20 with 2-3 men to 5-8 woman and just me. Two men playing guitars in worship music. They say men are reluctant to do adoration. I do the utmost to honor this any time I’m in church. He gives very precise spiritual advise to people there that is very personal getting down to a persons free will.

One issue he teaches:

Matthew 10:34-39 – Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword. For I am come to set a man at variance against his father, and the daughter against her mother, and the daughter in law against her mother in law. And a man’s foes shall be they of his own household. He that loveth father or mother more than me is not worthy of me:and he that loveth son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me. And he that taketh not his cross, and followeth after me, is not worthy of me. He that findeth his life shall lose it:and he that loseth his life for my sake shall find it. (also in Luke 12:14-53)
 
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It has been explained to me today that guitars, singing, preaching, praying rosary out loud is very strongly discouraged during adoration. So accusing me about being there to make friends, date people is pretty terrible, when it is untruthful. It does little to comfort me.
 
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It’s 3 days per week. Youth, young adults, older.

Singing to guitar (quiet religious) prayers aloud, Rosary aloud, reading written word.

Notice fellowship mentioned and friendship.

Others refused to sit nearby me, enter building with others I considered friends was not allowed for me. I was falsely accused of being there to date people which is crazy.

This was after a year of attending. I was respectful every time, every day. This is perceived that I desired normal neighborhood interaction.

My intention:

Ephesians 4:31-32 31Get rid of all bitterness, rage and anger, brawling and slander, along with every form of malice. 32Be kind and compassionate to one another, forgiving each other, just as in Christ God forgave you.

Matthew 18:15-17 “If your brother sins against you, go and tell him his fault, between you and him alone. If he listens to you, you have gained your brother. But if he does not listen, take one or two others along with you, that every charge may be established by the evidence of two or three witnesses. If he refuses to listen to them, tell it to the church."

(Please Note: This uploaded content is no longer available.)
 
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You stated above that you are retired.

The ad you show is for a Youth Group.

In the USA, Youth Groups are for teenagers. In other parts of the world, Youth can extend to College age people.

While retirees may be volunteers/chaperones for Youth Group (provided they have followed the process put in place for volunteering with Youth by their Diocese), it would not be proper for a retiree to attend Youth Group events.

If a parish has a Youth Group, I am sure they also have adult groups.
 
There are three nights:
One for teenagers

One for young adults

One for older adults.

I always attended the adult one… they are very similar groups. I didn’t send the adult one because it reveals the location and church. My point is that all adoration should be silent with no out loud Rosary, music, singing and such. Ours features two adult musicians. Actually it is very nice to sing there. I’m showing that this is all before the exposed Eucharist! These are fellowship and lay prayer group in an adoration setting. The pressure was for me leave and to go during hours where I was alone with Jesus. I also was already doing a holy hour too.

It is really hard to explain rejection there; so I humbly leave it here. Thanks for the advice.

P.S:

I never attended the youth group night at any time.

Remember, I am not Catholic with no RCIA yet. I desire to be treated in a welcoming manner even though non Catholics are supposed to be welcome. I was invited there by my neighbor, I did not invite myself. I was always the only non catholic there.

Maybe they feel that a non baptized believer who can’t take communion should not approach the exposed Eucharist in prayer and that bothers them? They won’t talk.
 
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