More old testament stuff

[ppcpilot]

Ok…so I’m reading through the old T for the first time…getting to Deuteronomy and Joshua…Really a shocker how God ordered the Isrealites to go into these towns and kill women, and children, and every living thing. This does not sound like the merciful and just God we hear about in homilies. I’m sure He has His reasons for the things back then.

With that said, I can almost see why the Jews were so reluctant to accept Jesus as the Messiah. In all of the OT stuff I read, the Jews were taught to fear God, and live by the laws of Moses that God himself had given to him…all of the ritualistic stuff…

Here comes this Jesus fellow who says He is God, but disregards a lot of Moses’ law. I must be missing something here…is there a transition area where the Jews are asked by prophets or something to start to abandon these laws in prep for a new covenant? I know Jesus began the new convenant with his death and ressurection, but why with no warning that they had to change direction…

Help me out, here!

 

[BibleReader]

Virtually every single OT story and ritual foreshadows an aspect of the NT Christian salvation process.

(1) Agony in the Gardens: Genesis 3:8 (Like the NT Adam who agonized in Gethsemane, the OT Adam retreats to the trees to hide from God’s approaching wrath); Genesis 3:19: (Like Jesus Who “earned” the Eucharist, initially by sweating blood in the Garden, God tells Adam, “By the sweat of your face shall you get bread to eat.”)

(2) Scourging at the Pillar: Genesis 30:37-43 (Jacob “scourges” sticks and places them in water troughs in front of rutting rams and sheep, who bear young with similar marks: A picture of scourged Jesus giving rise to Christ-like converts.)

(3) Crowning with thorns: Genesis 3:18 (Just as the world pressed a crown of thorns onto the head of the NT Adam, the OT Adam is told that the world would entail “thorns and thistles” for him); Genesis 22:13 (Abraham’s sacrifice of a ram with hius “head in a thicket” foreshadows the sacrifice of Christ “with his head in a thicket.”

(4) The Way of the Cross: Genesis 22:6 (Just as Isaac carries the wood of his own sacrifice on his shoulders, Christ does, too).

(5) The Crucifixion of Jesus: Genesis 17:9-12 (Just as the male organ is stripped of its “clothing” revealing the “bloodied one” in circumcision, Jesus was stipped of HIS clothing, revealing His bloodied self at the time of His crucifixion; Genesis 3:15 (Just as God predicts that the offspring of the woman would strike at serpent’s head while the serpent strikes at the offspring’s heel, the cross pierced the ground at SKULL Place (get it?) while Jesus FEET were nailed to the cross (get it?).

See? The OT is thoroughly Christian!

 

[Bobby_Jim]

The reason the Israelites were ordered to kill every last man, woman, child, etc. in the lands of the Canaanites was to eliminate even the possibility that the Israelites would worship other gods. Because if they had left some trace of the people - perhaps intermarrying and so on - they would be tempted to worship their false gods. Even their animals were to be destroyed, and the gold they used to make their idols was not to be taken, lest the Israelites be reminded of these peoples’ worship of their strange gods. Such was the fierce monotheism of the Israelites, demanded by the covenant. To even dally with anything that might cause them to stray from the true worship of God meant death.

Remember too that at that time, the punishment for adultery was death, so seriously was marriage taken. So much more serious, then, was the covenant relationship between God and Israel, that to even hint at the “adultery” of going after other gods was strictly guarded against. Even if the way this was done sounds cruel and barbaric to our modern sensibilities.

 

[Bobby_Jim]

I would point out a couple of other things too:

the “harsh, judgmental God” of the Old Testament certainly is not gone from the New Testament - the gospels and Revelation are certainly replete with references to sinners being cast into the lake of fire, or bound hand and foot and cast into the outer darkness where there is wailing and gnashing of teeth, or being cast into fiery Gehenna where the worm never dies, etc.

Nor is the “Old Testament God” all wrath and fury and judgment… certainly in Deuteronomy, and later in the prophets such as are many references to the love and mercy of God. It is in Jeremiah that we read of how God will craft a new covenant, written not on tablets of stone, but carved in his peoples’ hearts. It is in Ezekiel that we read of the Lord as Shepherd of his people (I myself will pasture my sheep; I myself will give them rest, says the Lord GOD. The lost I will seek out, the strayed I will bring back, the injured I will bind up, the sick I will heal [but the sleek and the strong I will destroy], shepherding them rightly.)

The way I read a lot of the historical books, from Genesis on down, is the story of how God has repeatedly tried to get mankind to follow him, and do what is right. Over and over again, mankind screws up. Even though God repeatedly delivers them and shows them great signs and wonders, and gives them every chance to make things right, and show them exactly what they need to do to live in covenant with him. But each time, man hardens his heart, and turns away from God. And there are consequences to that. God takes no pleasure in destroying His creation. But sometimes it was necessary to go through some pain or destruction in order to make a fresh start. But each time, God draws mankind back to Himself, offering another chance at the covenant.

And this reaches its culmination in the New Testament, when God himself becomes incarnate, and suffers and dies for our sake, to set things right, once and for all. So in that way, the New Testament follows very logically from the Old.

 

[adnauseum]

In addition to these excellent responses I would add that when God ordered the Hebrews to invade the land of Canaan, He specifically told His people that if they ever fell into paganism, idolatry, etc., then they too would be vomited out of the land. They would meet the same fate.

Justice is giving each precisely what is his due, no more, no less.

 

[ppcpilot]

Excellent posts, everyone. Thanks.

When does God change his message from mostly fear of the Lord, to Love of the Lord? Seems like the Isreaelites did everything out of fear, and not out of love…?

 

[Jav1]

PPCPILOT,

I too struggle with the stark contrasts between the OT & NT. I’m still learning, searching and praying for understanding but I have to be honest, the explanations are less obvious than ones intitial sentiments upon reading the texts.

I am Roman Catholic, of fairly strong faith (and mind) and sometimes my faith is shaken in “my” failure to understand scripture. I’m sure many go through similar trials… including the Jews. As I said, I have a strong beleif in my faith but find it hard to condemn others that are ture to their hearts and consciences.

 

[pacersFan]

ppcpilot:

Excellent posts, everyone. Thanks.

When does God change his message from mostly fear of the Lord, to Love of the Lord? Seems like the Isreaelites did everything out of fear, and not out of love…?

I was told in one of my RCIA class that the word that is translated to “fear” in the OT would probably be better translated to our concept of “awe”. It is interesting how much a simple change like that changes the perspective of God in the OT.