Mormon - Beliefs - A civil Discussion Please

[LAMBOFGODGIRLY]

The adherents site’s question is how many attend at least monthly, where are the numbers for attend weekly or hardly ever. Also for Italy it cites a book The Catholic Myth by Andrew Greeley which in turn cites this:

Pg. 266: "using the ISV [International Study of Values, 1981] and ISSP [International Social Survey Project, 1985] surveys… "; Pg. 269: "…proportion of men & women over 35 who attend Mass at least once a month… Belgium, 60%; Italy, 53%… " [Italy: 53% * est. 90% of pop. which is Catholic = 47.7% of total pop. attending mass monthly]

For the US it has 3 citations:

Glazer, Nathan. American Judaism (Second Edition); Chicago: University of Chicago Press (1972); pg. 114.

"In 1947, a national public opinion poll had shown that 18% of Jewish respondents attended service once a month (the comparative figures were 65% for Protestants and 85% for Catholics). " [Other sources show Catholic U.S. pop. for 1948 at 19.9%; 19.9% * 85% = 16.92%]

Greeley, Andrew M. The Catholic Myth: The Behavior and Beliefs of American Catholics. New York: Charles Scribner’s Sons (1990); pg. 266, 269.

Pg. 266: "using the ISV [International Study of Values, 1981] and ISSP [International Social Survey Project, 1985] surveys… "; Pg. 269: "…proportion of men & women over 35 who attend Mass at least once a month… Spain, 77%; the United States, 75%… " [USA: 75% * est. 25% of pop. which is Catholic, (or est. 55 million) = 18.75% of total pop. attending mass monthly]

Neusner, Jacob (ed). World Religions in America: An Introduction; Louisville, KY: Westminster/John Knox Press (1994); pg. 94.

"About a quarter of the American population is Catholic; of this number, half attend church regularly (at least several times a month) and another quarter attend at least once a month. " [50% + 25% = 75% "churchgoers. " 75% * 25% = 18.75% of U.S. pop.]

That last citations looks as though 18% of Americans attend a Catholic Mass and 75% of Catholics attend either once a month or several times a month. Statistics always seem like Lego to me, you can build what ever you want out of them

Edited to add:
No I didn’t go to Mass today, I have to work every other Sunday, it seems no one wants to work on Sunday (even though we get paid 25% more) so we all have to take a turn. But DH and DK and DMIL all went.

Are you a RN? my husband has the same type of schedule and he gets paid more if he works Sunday too.

 

[LAMBOFGODGIRLY]

I actually went to Mass yesterday and twice today! No I wasn’t serving. I just felt like going to a friend’s Mass at his church with him, it was after my own Church’s Mass. I also stood 5 hours on Picket line against abortion this week. I work full time and still can place religion in my life. I often tell “Catholic’s” that they might as well be Protestants if they aren’t going to follow the laws of our church. My church has 2,500 families (estimated 4 members per family) registered. We have 6 Masses a weekend with around 350 at each so we have many “non” registered people coming to Mass! I actually only care that I and my wife go. Others must worry about their own souls!

God Bless

You want to know something very cool about our church too? We have a mass going on every single hour and every minute of every single day all around the world!! that is wonderful!! no other church can say that!

 

[dianaiad]

Why does the Mrmon temples have a carpenters sqare, a compass, sun stone, moon stone, a pentigram, all seeing eye, and a beehive? Why no crosses, or statutes of Jesus?

Oh, Alisha…

Asked, answered, what is your point?

 

[dianaiad]

Diana, please do not take this the wrong way, but I’m apart of the Body of Christ! That’s who I am!

perhaps, Alisha, but even so, HE gets to tell YOU what He does. You don’t get to dictate to Him.

which was my point.

 

[mfbukowski]

http://www.salamandersociety.com/internet/031220straymutt_excremento.jpg

You get more extreme by the day. Burnt any chapels yet?

 

[LAMBOFGODGIRLY]

Oh, Alisha…

Asked, answered, what is your point?

I’ve never asked that before! I’m sorry if someone already has, but I didn’t see where it was posted. Send me the link or give me the post number and I will be happy to look it over.

 

[mfbukowski]

I wasn’t asking as a way to judge.

I was encouraging everyone to go to Mass. It could only help the attendance problem.

Yes but that will make it harder on the fewer and fewer priests. So lay off – they have enough trouble as it is.

 

[RebeccaJ]

I wasn’t asking as a way to judge.

I was encouraging everyone to go to Mass. It could only help the attendance problem.

Yeah well, don’t worry. If you didn’t mean it as an insult, bukowski is more than willing to tag team it for you.

 

[PaulDupre]

You get more extreme by the day. Burnt any chapels yet?

Melodramatic much?

 

[dianaiad]

Oh I’m not one to beat myself up over stuff, I probably should in some areas Mostly though I just hate working on Sundays!! Even in high-school when there were places to go and things to do on Fridays and Saturdays I preferred to work those rather than Sundays. Sunday is the day to stay home, cozy with family, and recharge for the coming week.

That’s ok…you did sound like you were ‘beating yourself up’ a bit there, and I don’t think you need to.

 

[dianaiad]

Yeah well, don’t worry. If you didn’t mean it as an insult, bukowski is more than willing to tag team it for you.

Waddaya mean, “if?”

 

[dianaiad]

Melodramatic much?

Paul, even those of us who do not speak Spanish might have figured out that posting a cartoon that calls our beliefs a load of manure (or actually, as my students translate that, a “crock of s***” ) is offensive and worth a response something like the one you got.

If you are going to deal in melodrama and that level of insult, you will have to expect a reaction.

 

[ricko]

Alisha, I haven’t finished my research yet but from what I recall Joseph Smith was once a Mason and some of the symbols on the Mormon buildings have a Mason origin. And since JS was using seer stones before the BOM the other symbols are related to the occult.

 

[PaulDupre]

Paul, even those of us who do not speak Spanish might have figured out that posting a cartoon that calls our beliefs a load of manure (or actually, as my students translate that, a “crock of s***” ) is offensive and worth a response something like the one you got.

If you are going to deal in melodrama and that level of insult, you will have to expect a reaction.

I might have expected a negative reaction, but burning chapels? Please…

 

[CJ_Nick]

Hello all,

At the great risk of getting back on " Mormon beliefs - A civil discussion " ( LOL ) As I am interested what the LDS perspective is from LDS folks.

I have a question to our LDS friends on this forum. What do you believe, as a LDS regarding the teaching of JS in the King Follet Sermon ?? Can some LDS people become a God?? Did our God used to be a man like you and I of a different Earth before he became God of ours??

Thanks in advance for any perspectives offered.

Peace,
CJ

 

[dianaiad]

I might have expected a negative reaction, but burning chapels? Please…

Paul, we are used to it.

The insults, the foul language, the picketers, the throwing things, the destruction of property…

Sorry, but…

No, I don’t think you are going to burn down any chapels, if that makes you feel better.

I’m also not going to post cartoons about Catholicism with disrespectful and foul language in them.

Just call me (and I really HATE to admit this about myself…) a little on the PC side.

Except of course that it is VERY “PC” to make fun of the Mormons. It’s downright fashionable.

 

[PaulDupre]

Paul, we are used to it.

The insults, the foul language, the picketers, the throwing things, the destruction of property…

Sorry, but…

No, I don’t think you are going to burn down any chapels, if that makes you feel better.

I’m also not going to post cartoons about Catholicism with disrespectful and foul language in them.

Just call me (and I really HATE to admit this about myself…) a little on the PC side.

Except of course that it is VERY “PC” to make fun of the Mormons. It’s downright fashionable.

We’re used to it, too. Anti-Catholicism is the last acceptable prejudice.

 

[dianaiad]

We’re used to it, too. Anti-Catholicism is the last acceptable prejudice.

Ah, no.

Remember, you got a President elected over fifty years ago. Nobody, and I mean NOBODY, would dare to criticize a Catholic politician because of his religion in the USA. Wouldn’t happen.

However, Mitt Romney’s candidacy was torpedoed by evangelicals, Catholics and just about everybody else BECAUSE of his.

Obama was forgiven his twenty year choice of separatist church affiliation, with a preacher who is about as racist a person as I’ve come across…and that was fine. Romney, however…???

So, no.

Don’t give me the 'anti-Catholicsm is the last acceptable prejudice." Because it is quite acceptable, politically, culturally and everything else to be Catholic. True, the evangelical Protestant types can get a little intolerant and all, but hey—some of them also dance with snakes and drink poison.

(shrug)

Now please remember, also, that while the Catholics and the Mormons both campaigned for Prop 8 last fall, the CATHOLICS aren’t being targeted, picketed, audited or even criticized much. Nobody is calling to have Catholic tax exemption denied.

For instance, the Knights of Columbus donated a million dollars to the Yes on 8 fund…nobody has picketed or targeted them. The No on 8 folks produced a commercial portraying two Mormon missionaries invading the home of a lesbian couple, tearing up their marriage license and intimidating them. The Huffington Post is leading a crusade to get the LDS church tax exemption revoked—and nothing even remotely like that is being done to Catholics; a firestorm of epic proportions would erupt if they did, and they know it.

And so do you.

 

[PaulDupre]

Ah, no.

Remember, you got a President elected over fifty years ago. Nobody, and I mean NOBODY, would dare to criticize a Catholic politician because of his religion in the USA. Wouldn’t happen.

You’re probably too young to remember when JFK ran for president. I’m not. There were many Americans who said that Kennedy would take his orders directly from the pope, let the Jesuits run the country, etc.

If the American people don’t trust a Mormon to be president, you should ask yourself why. It is because Mormons are secretive and and they think all non-Mormons are perverted drug addicts, and they never tell the truth when you ask them what they believe (as seen on these forums). They call Christianity an abomination. They conduct secret rituals behind closed doors, are just a few generations away from polygamy (and still believe it is the correct order of things and will be practiced in heaven), just one generation away from denying the priesthood to blacks, and are just a few years away from taking blood oaths wherein they pantomimed throat-slitting and disembowelment. That stuff makes people nervous, and unlikely to hand you the nuclear football.

 

[dianaiad]

You’re probably too young to remember when JFK ran for president. I’m not. There were many Americans who said that Kennedy would take his orders directly from the pope, let the Jesuits run the country, etc.

Trust me. I’m not too young. I remember the day he was shot, too; where I was, what I was wearing, what I was reading… The point is, he DID get elected, and fifty years later a Mormon couldn’t get anywhere near the White House. FIFTY YEARS.–and his religion played a huge part in that.

If the American people don’t trust a Mormon to be president, you should ask yourself why

Really? Could it be because intolerance is wrong no matter who it is aimed at?

. It is because Mormons are secretive and and they think all non-Mormons are perverted drug addicts, and they never tell the truth when you ask them what they believe (as seen on these forums). They call Christianity an abomination. They conduct secret rituals behind closed doors, are just a few generations away from polygamy (and still believe it is the correct order of things and will be practiced in heaven), just one generation away from denying the priesthood to blacks, and are just a few years away from taking blood oaths wherein they pantomimed throat-slitting and disembowelment. That stuff makes people nervous, and unlikely to hand you the nuclear football.

I may frame this. It is priceless. Perhaps you should think about why Americans did not trust JFK? I mean, so many people THOUGHT that he would take orders from the Pope and let Jesuits run the country…

Now why, I wonder, is the assinine nature of the worries about JFK intolerance and evil, but the equally (if not more so) idiotic charges against Mitt Romney are simply people being understandably concerned?

Did you read your own words, here?

You can’t possibly have written this seriously. Not even possibly.