Mormon Doctrine that has changed

[TexanKnight]

You have the choice to believe that

Thank you

— I am not trying to change your choice to believe that — officially it is not correct.

What is not correct?

For your info — I have lots of friends, including Catholics (who are not members of the forums), non religious friends, as well as Mormons.

Never said you did not have friends. I said you are LDS

 

[theidler]

Again, so TruthLiving doesn’t miss it:

A source is here: catholicculture.org/cultu…fm?recnum=6085
I would specifically quote this part of the article:
“My parents were always disturbed with two aspects of the ceremony. First, they disliked the ritual mocking of a Catholic priest or Protestant minister, portrayed as being paid money by Satan to preach the Bible to the world.”

Also:

Marie5890:

I can affirm that is what happened in the '69 version of the endowment ceremony. It was removed for the '90 version.

I have experienced both versions.

So, TruthLiving, what happens then in the real ritual, if the above is not true or was not true in the past?

 

[TruthLiving]

TexanKnight:
Again no one has any idea what my religious beliefs are — should not matter here. The forums is open to anyone.

I recognize that I am attacked because I believe that whether Mormon, non religious, or my aunt who is a Presbyterian — everyone should be respected, particularly when another’s beliefs are not understood.

 

[Marie5890]

particularly when another’s beliefs are not understood.

Please be respectful to ME but not claiming I DONT KNOW Mormonism.

I know Mormonism. I UNDERSTAND Mormonism I KNOW the belief system.

I am very credible when it comes to Mormonism SO please STOP with the claim of “when another’s beliefs are not understood.”

**I ** understand.

 

[KathleenGee]

It does matter that you are buying the line that Mormons were never anti-Catholic or this or that…they are removing links online that prove otherwise how you are led to believe.

The Mormon Church is actively representing the Catholic Church and our deep and living commitment to the Word of God…and I already pointed out to you their King James TV program. It was shocking.The bias and insinuations and caricaturization was very evident.

 

[theidler]

Again no one has any idea what my religious beliefs are — should not matter here. The forums is open to anyone.

I recognize that I am attacked because I believe that whether Mormon, non religious, or my aunt who is a Presbyterian — everyone should be respected, particularly when another’s beliefs are not understood.

This doesn’t answer the question TruthLiving - I don’t care what your beliefs are per se, I am just asking, since you seem to be knowledgeable concerning Mormonism and are venturing a defense of it in a sense. Again, here is my question:

Again, so TruthLiving doesn’t miss it:

A source is here: catholicculture.org/cultu…fm?recnum=6085
I would specifically quote this part of the article:
“My parents were always disturbed with two aspects of the ceremony. First, they disliked the ritual mocking of a Catholic priest or Protestant minister, portrayed as being paid money by Satan to preach the Bible to the world.”

Also:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marie5890 View Post
I can affirm that is what happened in the '69 version of the endowment ceremony. It was removed for the '90 version.

I have experienced both versions.
So, TruthLiving, what happens then in the real ritual, if the above is not true or was not true in the past?

 

[TruthLiving]

Please be respectful to ME but not claiming I DONT KNOW Mormonism.

I know Mormonism. I UNDERSTAND Mormonism I KNOW the belief system.

I am very credible when it comes to Mormonism SO please STOP with the claim of “when another’s beliefs are not understood.”

**I ** understand.

 

[TruthLiving]

TruthLiving:
So I guess you are a former Mormon? Reveal that if that is true — I have no idea if you are --sorry forgot to look at my crystal ball prior. My issue are people who have a agenda to “explain what the Mormon church actually believes, officially”. You should be a official spokeperson at LDS headquarters in Salt Lake City.

Again, you can believe what you want

 

[theidler]

TruthLiving:
Again, you are dodging the question. At least contribute to the debate TruthLiving.

 

[TruthLiving]

Please be respectful to ME but not claiming I DONT KNOW Mormonism.

I know Mormonism. I UNDERSTAND Mormonism I KNOW the belief system.

I am very credible when it comes to Mormonism SO please STOP with the claim of “when another’s beliefs are not understood.”

**I ** understand.

So are you a former Mormon? Have never been a Mormon? My issue has been how did you come to be a accuracy checker about Mormon doctrine. Is it hatred, similar to those in the early years of the church who focused on trying to destroy Joseph Smith???

If you knew Mormonism, regardless of anything you may say or do, the church continues to grow and do what it has.

So why the agenda to destroy it? My religious beliefs are what they, yet I am not out to destroy Catholicism, any Protestants, Jews, etc.

 

[theidler]

So are you a former Mormon? Have never been a Mormon? My issue has been how did you come to be a accuracy checker about Mormon doctrine. Is it hatred, similar to those in the early years of the church who focused on trying to destroy Joseph Smith???

If you knew Mormonism, regardless of anything you may say or do, the church continues to grow and do what it has.

So why the agenda to destroy it? My religious beliefs are what they, yet I am not out to destroy Catholicism, any Protestants, Jews, etc.

Oy vey - talk about dodging. If your questions are pertaining to me, no I have nothing against Mormons. I have Mormon friends too. And I was raised Seventh-Day Adventist.
This is merely a questioning of Mormonism, not an attack on Mormons.

Now, can you please answer my question as pertains to the debate? You contend that the “agent of satan” practice is not true - I have found an article that proves it as true until 1990, and a member of the forum who is ex-LDS has spoken up to being a witness of it. What is your reply to this? If you are not Mormon, but are knowledgeable in the subject and wish to defend it, then please do so. Here is your chance. I am all ears.

 

[TexanKnight]

So are you a former Mormon?

Yes

Have never been a Mormon?

Nope…was LDS. Served a mission even…

My issue has been how did you come to be a accuracy checker about Mormon doctrine.

I was LDS…I studied the doctrine…I TAUGHT the doctrine…how’s that?

Is it hatred, similar to those in the early years of the church who focused on trying to destroy Joseph Smith???

Nope…just posting truth.

If you knew Mormonism, regardless of anything you may say or do, the church continues to grow and do what it has.

So? Islam grows faster…does that make it true?

So why the agenda to destroy it? My religious beliefs are what they, yet I am not out to destroy Catholicism, any Protestants, Jews, etc.

Anything that truth destroys SHOULD be destroyed…

 

[Marie5890]

So are you a former Mormon? Have never been a Mormon? My issue has been how did you come to be a accuracy checker about Mormon doctrine. Is it hatred, similar to those in the early years of the church who focused on trying to destroy Joseph Smith???

If you knew Mormonism, regardless of anything you may say or do, the church continues to grow and do what it has.

So why the agenda to destroy it? My religious beliefs are what they, yet I am not out to destroy Catholicism, any Protestants, Jews, etc.

I’ve already stated it several times in several posts.
I have said that I have experienced both the '69 and '90 versions of the temple endowment.

How did I become a fact checker?
I WAS a Mormon.
A temple recommend carrying-temple attending-BYU alumnus-tithing paying-SUnday School teacher-lived the WoW-Relief Society president-visiting teaching-lived in Prove for well over a decade-been thru all of the temples that existed in UT by '95. etc etc

I KNOW Mormonism. I have read the BoM probably 2 dozens times in that time period

And no, Mormonism is not growing. It’s bleeding members.

Read this article of only a couple of weeks ago

reuters.com/article/2012/01/30/us-mormonchurch-idUSTRE80T1CM20120130

If you clearly did not pick up all that I said and come to see that I was indeed Mormon, one thing is very clear.

You are not Mormon, or very new to it.Certainly not someone who have been thru the temple.

I clearly know Mormonism much much better than you do.

Clearly

Agenda to destroy it? Dont need to. It’s bleeding on it’s own.

 

[theidler]

Again TruthLiving, I will post it…:banghead:

A source is here: catholicculture.org/cultu…fm?recnum=6085
I would specifically quote this part of the article:
“My parents were always disturbed with two aspects of the ceremony. First, they disliked the ritual mocking of a Catholic priest or Protestant minister, portrayed as being paid money by Satan to preach the Bible to the world.”

Also:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marie5890 View Post
I can affirm that is what happened in the '69 version of the endowment ceremony. It was removed for the '90 version.

I have experienced both versions.
So, TruthLiving, what happens then in the real ritual, if the above is not true or was not true in the past?

 

[TruthLiving]

Oy vey - talk about dodging. If your questions are pertaining to me, no I have nothing against Mormons. I have Mormon friends too. And I was raised Seventh-Day Adventist.
This is merely a questioning of Mormonism, not an attack on Mormons.

Now, can you please answer my question as pertains to the debate? You contend that the “agent of satan” practice is not true - I have found an article that proves it as true until 1990, and a member of the forum who is ex-LDS has spoken up to being a witness of it. What is your reply to this? If you are not Mormon, but are knowledgeable in the subject and wish to defend it, then please do so. Here is your chance. I am all ears.

Yet, where is the solid evidence from LDS church headquarters state this practice is accurate? The ex LDS person always to me is questionable, since the ex LDS people or never been a Mormon have a agenda.

Is this article from a official LDS publication? I doubt it, continuing to make my point that Mormons can and have published things that they believe — does not make it similar to official LDS headquarters — further ex LDS or never been Mormon can believe whatever — official LDS doctrine and practice is the only I things I am seeking ---- my Mormon friends and our discussions have been accurate in light of what I read on the forums – misunderstanding and hate.

 

[theidler]

Yet, where is the solid evidence from LDS church headquarters state this practice is accurate? The ex LDS person always to me is questionable, since the ex LDS people or never been a Mormon have a agenda.

Is this article from a official LDS publication? I doubt it, continuing to make my point that Mormons can and have published things that they believe — does not make it similar to official LDS headquarters — further ex LDS or never been Mormon can believe whatever — official LDS doctrine and practice is the only I things I am seeking ---- my Mormon friends and our discussions have been accurate in light of what I read on the forums – misunderstanding and hate.

If that’s your definition of hate, then fine. There is no hate intended. Statements by such Mormon leaders like Brigham Young sound much more like hate to me:
“Shall I tell you the law of God in regard to the African Race? If the White man who belongs to the chosen seed mixes his blood with the seed of Cain, the penalty, under the law of God, is death on the spot. This will always be so.”
-Journal of Discourses
The article is written by someone who was formerly LDS. The member on the forum here has answered you in kind. So are they lying then? Perhaps you can enlighten me then as to what actually happens in the temple ceremonies. Is there no “agent of the devil” then? What is there? Did this ever exist?

 

[Marie5890]

Yet, where is the solid evidence from LDS church headquarters state this practice is accurate? The ex LDS person always to me is questionable, since the ex LDS people or never been a Mormon have a agenda.

Is this article from a official LDS publication? I doubt it, continuing to make my point that Mormons can and have published things that they believe — does not make it similar to official LDS headquarters — .

It comes from the temple ceremony. The only place that Mormons discuss the temple ceremony is in the temple.

There was a '69 film and then a '90. There was also a much earlier version that was changed in the earlier part of the 20th century.

Ask your friends about the temple ceremony.

If you really want you can actually google the temple ceremony if you so chose.

 

[TexanKnight]

Yet, where is the solid evidence from LDS church headquarters state this practice is accurate? The ex LDS person always to me is questionable, since the ex LDS people or never been a Mormon have a agenda.

Is this article from a official LDS publication? I doubt it, continuing to make my point that Mormons can and have published things that they believe — does not make it similar to official LDS headquarters — further ex LDS or never been Mormon can believe whatever — official LDS doctrine and practice is the only I things I am seeking ---- my Mormon friends and our discussions have been accurate in light of what I read on the forums – misunderstanding and hate.

Hmmm…so because we are former LDS we must be lying? Wrong. The reason I left is BECAUSE of things like this…I did not make up things like this because I left.

I speak the truth. I attended temple ceremonies prior to 1990…did you?

 

[Marie5890]

If that’s you definition of hate, then fine. There is no hate intended.
The article is written by someone who was formerly LDS. The member on the forum here has answered you in kind. So are they lying then? Perhaps you can enlighten me then as to what actually happens in the temple ceremonies. Is there no “agent of the devil” then? What is there? Did this ever exist?

Im going to give TrueLiving a break, theidler.

They clearly know very little about Mormonism and clearly dont know anything about the temple or the endowment ceremony.

It’s not their fault. Most people dont really know Mormonism and TrueLiving is demonstrating that reality.

 

[Marie5890]

Hmmm…so because we are former LDS we must be lying? Wrong. The reason I left is BECAUSE of things like this…I did not make up things like this because I left.

I speak the truth. I attended temple ceremonies prior to 1990…did you?

TrueLiving apparently doesnt know what the temple ceremony is and wont recognize it as official LDS teaching since it’s not a publication.