Mormon leader explains LDS position on scriptural canon

[MomblessedX3]

I read the entire talk. I have to admit that Holland is very well spoken. I have to agree that he doesn’t support his stance very well. If a person doesn’t whole heartedly agree with the BOM, Pearl of Great Price, and the D&C there is nothing convincing about his talk. However, since the talk wasn’t given for the general public but for the LDS it only makes sense.

As I read through many of the talks given I just kept thinking “how can so many educated people buy this stuff?”

FYI there is another talk that talks briefly about the Great Apostacy. Once again it doesn’t give any proof…only that it occured after the original 12 apostles either died or went their own way.

 

[Prince_Hal]

Brother Holland says that the canon of revelation is still open, the mormons believe it, but it would appear that Christendom does not. And yet this apparently is the same god, the one who is so merciful in giving the LDS people revelation today throught his prophets, who left the world alone and devoid of these same prophets and apostles of revelation for over 1500 years during the so-called “great apostacy”. This is an odd and changing god. No prophets, no church, no mormon temple ceremonies for over 1500 years - but now having closed this channel of revelation for so long, he wakes from his sleep and gives us revelation today.

What was actually happening ? Christ taught His apostles, they taught bishops, Linus, Polycarp, through the Church Fathers, Athanasius, Jerome, Ignatius, the Church Councils, the Papal Encyclicals. Revelation upon revelations, physical signs that God was and is directing His Church.

It is an interesting question that MomBlessedX3 asks as to why these very educated men can continue to preach such untruths and mistruths, misleading people with half an argument. Why ? Some are prideful wanting the upper seat at the feast - perhaps like Brother Holland enjoying his being part of the Brethren. Perhaps other are genuinely mislead by an evil spirit. Perhaps other know who they are being led by. Don’t know.

But, what I do know is that thousands are fooled each year because they do not know anything different, and have never read the Bible and have no foundation. And so they are easily caught by such fables as Brother Holland gives. I agree he is an impressive speaker, but only in form and not content.

God Bless,

Hal.

 

[Prince_Hal]

Brother Holland’s opening line talked of the “singular message” that the new prophet Monson gave at the Sunday morning session of conference. Holland said:

“As the first of the Brethren invited to speak following your singular message to the Church this morning, may I say something on behalf of all your Brethren of the General Authorities and indeed on behalf of all the Church.”

Here is I suppose according to Holland an example of the heavens being open and God speaking through His annointed.

Here’s the link to Monson’s talk:

lds.org/conference/talk/display/0,5232,23-1-851-29,00.html

It is an interesting story, and I do not deny the terrible ordeals that these people went through. God holds them in the palm of His hands as much as any of us. But is was it “singular”.

And here is the link to his closing talk of conference:

lds.org/conference/talk/display/0,5232,23-1-851-38,00.html

The words of a prophet of God, speaking the words of God, adding to the canon of revelation, scripture to be studied for the next 6 months until the next General Conference ?

Compare to this:

Spe Salvi:

vatican.va/holy_father/benedict_xvi/encyclicals/documents/hf_ben-xvi_enc_20071130_spe-salvi_en.html

or to Deus Cariatas Est:

vatican.va/holy_father/benedict_xvi/encyclicals/documents/hf_ben-xvi_enc_20051225_deus-caritas-est_en.html

Listen out to what the Pope has to say during his visit to the USA and compare this to the revelation and the open canon of prophet Monson or Hinckley. Here is what the the LDS god is revealing to us today (I am giving the full link so you can read it in context), but concerning abortion:

“The [LDS] Church has not favored or opposed legislative proposals or public demonstrations concerning abortion.”

newsroom.lds.org/ldsnewsroom/eng/public-issues/abortion

The LDS god speaks and hear his words !! Some truth and then the error. Oh let the mormons believe Brother Holland if they want to regarding the canon of revelation, but what does it lead to ? Belief in statements and policies like the one above. There is the danger. Cuddly grandfather Monson who is so ditzy that his wife cannot let him use the microwave - cute, nice, fuzzy, warm. And yet this same man authorises the canon of revelation to continue with policy that allows children to be cut to pieces in their mother’s womb. Not so cuddly now, but I am sure that moloch would approve.

Why do we who have once been LDS continue like this ? Because we were there and by the singular grace of God we escaped error and found Him. I taught that doctrine on abortion when I was a mormon bishop. Please God that no one listened to such “revelation”.

God bless,

Hal.

 

[zerinus]

I read the entire talk. I have to admit that Holland is very well spoken. I have to agree that he doesn’t support his stance very well. If a person doesn’t whole heartedly agree with the BOM, Pearl of Great Price, and the D&C there is nothing convincing about his talk.

The object of his talk was not to convince people of the truth of LDS scriptures. The object of his talk was to refute the objection to an open canon of scripture, which I think he did a very good job of. His arguments would be valid even if Mormonism never existed. Even if there were no LDS Church, the idea of a “closed canon” is false, heretical, and unbiblical. That is what he was trying to show.

However, since the talk wasn’t given for the general public but for the LDS it only makes sense.

It was addressed to the general public as well as the Church. The LDS Church has now reached a sufficient level of prominence that lots of people take notice of what it says who are not Mormons.

As I read through many of the talks given I just kept thinking “how can so many educated people buy this stuff?”

Can you be more specific and give examples?

FYI there is another talk that talks briefly about the Great Apostacy. Once again it doesn’t give any proof…only that it occured after the original 12 apostles either died or went their own way.

I gave plenty of “proof” in my blog post, which generated the following thread:

forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=231038

That will keep you occupied for a long time.

zerinus

 

[MomblessedX3]

Zerinus,
I read pretty much everything you posted. I am just going to agree to disagree with you. I feel differently than you. I believe that the Church was never in apostacy…some people yes - but the church was not. Without the Church being in a state of apostacy there was no need for a restoration.

I have learned a lot from reading what you have to say. It helps me to more clearly understand what my husbands beliefs are.

Thanks

 

[zerinus]

Zerinus,
I read pretty much everything you posted. I am just going to agree to disagree with you. I feel differently than you. I believe that the Church was never in apostacy…some people yes - but the church was not. Without the Church being in a state of apostacy there was no need for a restoration.

I have learned a lot from reading what you have to say. It helps me to more clearly understand what my husbands beliefs are.

Thanks

Thank you too. I take it you are married to a Mormon then. I guess the next best thing to being a Mormon is being married to one!

zerinus

 

[MomblessedX3]

Thank you too. I take it you are married to a Mormon then. I guess the next best thing to being a Mormon is being married to one!

zerinus

I am married to a mormon…for almost 15 years…he is pretty great!

 

[zerinus]

I am married to a mormon…for almost 15 years…he is pretty great!

Glad to hear it. Mormons usually are! Just look at me!

zerinus