Mormon Prophet told to go to court in UK

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Monson wont go to the UK and I doubt this suit will have any traction in their courts
 
Yep - this is making quite the buzz. Here’s another source with a decent write-up:
Mormon president ordered to appear in British court Dennis Wagner, USA TODAY

Sounds like the guy is pretty much upset about religion and the notion of God in general.
Phillips challenges the biblical Book of Genesis, alleging it is fraudulent to assert that “all humans alive today are descended from just two people (Adam and Eve) who lived approximately 6,000 years ago.” In a supplemental filing, Phillips argued, “Anthropology, history and DNA studies prove this to be impossible.”
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I dont think Tom Phillips’ aim is an actual court case to be honest, but rather media exposure.

He was quite involved in LDS leadership over in Britian and even receive what is known as his “calling and election made sure” (also know as the second annointing, or second endowment in Mormon-ese)

There are many former Mormons who actively want/seek to bring to light various truths and facts about Mormonism, it’s doctrines, and history. I believe Phillips is one of them.
 
St. Paul eagerly went to the trials he was summoned to. He saw them as opportunities “to preach Christ” and give account of himself as a follower of Christ. Maybe the Mormon Prophet will take his lead, or that of the prophets who boldly went to foreign lands to call them to repentance and warn them of dangers to come. He can be expected to do the same thing. Unless he is a different kind of prophet. Inopportune, unaccountable, unbold. No, I think he would go out of (because of) the courage of his conviction of the truthfulness of the Mormon gospel. to do otherwise would not be in character with a true prophet of God, no matter what all the apologists in the world might say to the contrary.
 
Tarquin said:
St. Paul eagerly went to the trials he was summoned to. He saw them as opportunities “to preach Christ” and give account of himself as a follower of Christ. Maybe the Mormon Prophet will take his lead, or that of the prophets who boldly went to foreign lands to call them to repentance and warn them of dangers to come. He can be expected to do the same thing. Unless he is a different kind of prophet. Inopportune, unaccountable, unbold. No, I think he would go out of (because of) the courage of his conviction of the truthfulness of the Mormon gospel. to do otherwise would not be in character with a true prophet of God, no matter what all the apologists in the world might say to the contrary.
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Don’t hold your breath. LOL!
 
Tarquin said:
St. Paul eagerly went to the trials he was summoned to. He saw them as opportunities “to preach Christ” and give account of himself as a follower of Christ. Maybe the Mormon Prophet will take his lead, or that of the prophets who boldly went to foreign lands to call them to repentance and warn them of dangers to come. He can be expected to do the same thing. Unless he is a different kind of prophet. Inopportune, unaccountable, unbold. No, I think he would go out of (because of) the courage of his conviction of the truthfulness of the Mormon gospel. to do otherwise would not be in character with a true prophet of God, no matter what all the apologists in the world might say to the contrary.
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Or, he could follow in the footsteps of Joseph Smith and RUN.
 
Tarquin said:
St. Paul eagerly went to the trials he was summoned to. He saw them as opportunities “to preach Christ” and give account of himself as a follower of Christ. Maybe the Mormon Prophet will take his lead, or that of the prophets who boldly went to foreign lands to call them to repentance and warn them of dangers to come. He can be expected to do the same thing. Unless he is a different kind of prophet. Inopportune, unaccountable, unbold. No, I think he would go out of (because of) the courage of his conviction of the truthfulness of the Mormon gospel. to do otherwise would not be in character with a true prophet of God, no matter what all the apologists in the world might say to the contrary.
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I doubt the UK courts will even bother with this case. 🤷
 
Tarquin said:
St. Paul eagerly went to the trials he was summoned to. He saw them as opportunities “to preach Christ” and give account of himself as a follower of Christ. Maybe the Mormon Prophet will take his lead, or that of the prophets who boldly went to foreign lands to call them to repentance and warn them of dangers to come. He can be expected to do the same thing. Unless he is a different kind of prophet. Inopportune, unaccountable, unbold. No, I think he would go out of (because of) the courage of his conviction of the truthfulness of the Mormon gospel. to do otherwise would not be in character with a true prophet of God, no matter what all the apologists in the world might say to the contrary.
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This is exactly my thought, tarquin. What does he have to fear if he thinks he has the Truth? The Apostles glorified God for all the opportunities they had to witness to Jesus, even when that meant persecution and martyrdom. Monson should go and defend his faith if he truly believes he has the truth, otherwise, how can he possibly consider himself a true prophet if he doesn’t use this moment to reveal the truth of his churchs doctrine?
 
As an Englishman I can say fairly certainly that the Courts will not entertain this case. It is nothing but a pathetic publicity attempt.
 
Dempsey1919 said:
As an Englishman I can say fairly certainly that the Courts will not entertain this case. It is nothing but a pathetic publicity attempt.
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How does this process work? The article said some judge signed off on this, will this go to another court then and be denied? So does it matter if he chooses not to show up? I’m puzzled by what’s going on :confused:
 
Dempsey1919 said:
As an Englishman I can say fairly certainly that the Courts will not entertain this case. It is nothing but a pathetic publicity attempt.
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I’ve seen a quote by a British criminal lawyer who says the same.

I dont know anything about British law procedure. But I have no reason to doubt what those who know their system explain.
 
Dempsey1919 said:
As an Englishman I can say fairly certainly that the Courts will not entertain this case. It is nothing but a pathetic publicity attempt.
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Haven’t they already entertained the case through the actions of this judge?
 
A complaint was filed with a British magistrate, apparently a sort of lesser judge. The magistrate could ‘answer’ the complaint (decline it for very mundane administrative reasons–because the persons charged are fictional characters, for example). Or the magistrate can decide that the paperwork is in proper order.

Technically, the papers are in order. SO the allegations get bumped to a judge who can either find that the case should be dismissed as outside scope of law; or elect to proceed with evidentiary hearings. PROBABLY, at the next stage, the British judge will dismiss.

At that point, Mr. Phillips may find himself liable to pay the reasonable legal fees of the LDS Church, a common practice in UK courts I am hearing. I’m not clear if this automatically will be the case or if at this stage, the judge would have to issue a decision ordering Mr. Phillips to pay.

If the case goes to another stage, the LDS Church would certainly insist that Mr. Phillips be obliged to pay legal costs if-and-when the Court dismisses the charges. Almost no one believes there will be a trial. THE UK COURTS WILL LIKELY RESENT THIS ATTEMPT TO USE THEIR VENUE TO GRANDSTAND. Mr. Phillips is likely to be rebuked for entering a frivolous action, and may be out-of-pocket for his troubles.
 
if it were me, AND if what I was selling was the truth…then I would hop the first plane to England and address the issues with my proof.

If I knew that what I was selling was NOT true, I would call it grandstanding and/or ignore it. And then I would never let anyone excavate Cumorah…
 
TexanKnight said:
if it were me, AND if what I was selling was the truth…then I would hop the first plane to England and address the issues with my proof.

If I knew that what I was selling was NOT true, I would call it grandstanding and/or ignore it. And then I would never let anyone excavate Cumorah…
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Courts will NOT allow the LDS President to use them to 'preach the Gospel". Only to answer the charges as stated, IF such charges have merit AND are within the scope of a court’s jurisdiction to examine.

If such a case went forward it’s consequences would be far-reaching and represent potential for use of litigation to persecute all religious bodies. Whatever you think of the verities of Mormonism, it is better for all believers this case not proceed.
 
flameburns623 said:
Courts will NOT allow the LDS President to use them to 'preach the Gospel". Only to answer the charges as stated, IF such charges have merit AND are within the scope of a court’s jurisdiction to examine.

providing facts (if you have them) as answers is not preaching. It is responding. I am attorney. I know how the testimony thing works. If I had the truth, I would go give it.

If such a case went forward it’s consequences would be far-reaching and represent potential for use of litigation to persecute all religious bodies. Whatever you think of the verities of Mormonism, it is better for all believers this case not proceed.

Not to me. I would relish the chance to provide the truth to the specific points in this case…if I knew what I had was true.
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The UK is already struggling under the weight of secularism. This is another example, regardless of the denomination involved, of the secular trying to tear down the religious.

As both a Catholic and a former Mormon, the last thing those who care about religious freedom in the UK will want is this.

We hear a lot about religious freedom being attacked here in America. Im not sure why people dont see this as an attack on religious freedom in the UK?
 
This link is a little more interesting about this topic.

blog.mrm.org/

I don’t consider this action dangerous for all religions, Phillips is charging the church w/fraud to make money, because the LDS church requires a 10% tithe of its members to be in good standing. Church members have to tithe in order to receive a temple recommend, and the only way to get to the highest heaven is by going through the temple to make covenants, and keeping these sacred covenants. So if you’re a good LDS member who wants to get to the highest heaven, you have to pay your 10% tithe. Well, Phillips is saying that the Church is teaching its members fraudulent doctrines which require giving the church money, so the church is making money off its members. Most Christian churches, including the Catholic Chruch, don’t require we pay a 10% tithe in order to get to heaven. We teach good stewardhsip as a way to show our love and support for one another, but the Church doesn’t require it as the LDS church does. I think Phillips is quite angry about 33 years worth giving 10% when he no longer believes what they teach.
 
Marie5890 said:
The UK is already struggling under the weight of secularism. This is another example, regardless of the denomination involved, of the secular trying to tear down the religious.

As both a Catholic and a former Mormon, the last thing those who care about religious freedom in the UK will want is this.

We hear a lot about religious freedom being attacked here in America. Im not sure why people dont see this as an attack on religious freedom in the UK?
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I definitely understand what you’re saying. Times are getting rougher for those who are religious, we’re all being tested and refined. As for the Catholic Church, it has withstood persecutions of every stripe since the beginning, just as Christ warned us would happen.

“In this world you will have trouble, but take courage, I have conquered the world” John 16:33.

It seems we’re coming up on another round of persecution, and it’s time for all Christians to step up and be bold in their faith, that is how we witness our beliefs, and the LDS church is no different in this regard.
 
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