Don’t look at me. God commanded that we pay tithing. Christ certainly did not revoke it; in fact, He was rather adamant that it be paid.in mormonism tithing is directly related to ones ability to enter the celestial kingdom. if you don’t tithe 10% of your income you can not enter the temple with a temple recommend, if you can’t be “temple worthy” you can’t go to the celestial kingdom.
think how this flat tithe policy overwhelmingly favors the rich while making it exceedingly difficult for the poor to enter the celestial kingdom.
if a man grossed one million dollars and he tithes 100K he still has 900K to live on, a ton of money. however if another man made only 30K and tithed 3K he only has 27K to live on. if you’re living on 30K a year and raising a family it would be near impossible to come up with 3 grand to tithe appropriately. however if wealthy it would barely even bother you.
maybe god only wants the wealthy in the celestial kingdom???
That is precisely what the church says. And does.I think the Mormon would tell the poor person to pay tithing and if you don’t have enough after paying tithing the church will help you with your bills.
so what other old testament laws do you follow? certainly you follow all sabath laws from sundown on friday until sundown on saturday, and of course you keep kosher right? in fact if you believe tithing to be mandatory to all christians then you certainly follow the 600+ levitical laws too right?Don’t look at me. God commanded that we pay tithing. Christ certainly did not revoke it; in fact, He was rather adamant that it be paid.
So quarrel with Him.
As for me, given what the government does to us, I think that our Father in Heaven is being exceedingly fair–especially when you consider the blessings that come along with paying tithing.
Just so you know, there in the “non-Jew” part…Mormons believe they are members of the house of Israel, and call non-Mormons (including Jews) “Gentiles”.so what other old testament laws do you follow? certainly you follow all sabath laws from sundown on friday until sundown on saturday, and of course you keep kosher right? in fact if you believe tithing to be mandatory to all christians then you certainly follow the 600+ levitical laws too right?
your argument is very flawed… current tithe rules on christians have to do with their own churches rules on tithing and nothing to do with the old testament laws. if your argument is god commands tithing to non-jews then you must obey all the old testament laws like an orthodox jew would for your argument to hold any water.
As a former ward clerk I would question whether it always does. And I’m not sure it always should either. This varies widely from Bishop to Bishop – some Bishops are softer touches than other Bishops.That is precisely what the church says. And does.
Well, I don’t see that Jesus told the Pharisees to keep any of the other ones; in fact, He had some rather choice things to say about those who went nuts about keeping the Sabbath. He did, however, have something to say about tithing.so what other old testament laws do you follow? certainly you follow all sabath laws from sundown on friday until sundown on saturday, and of course you keep kosher right? in fact if you believe tithing to be mandatory to all christians then you certainly follow the 600+ levitical laws too right?
your argument is very flawed… current tithe rules on christians have to do with their own churches rules on tithing and nothing to do with the old testament laws. if your argument is god commands tithing to non-jews then you must obey all the old testament laws like an orthodox jew would for your argument to hold any water.
of course we give to our churcha nd support it, however in the catholic church we aren’t required to go over our tithing for the year in order to be considered worthy of the temple which in effect can keep your out of the celestial kingdom.
and i have no problem with that at all, my only voice of criticism which is from a non-member of your faith so take it with a grain of salt is that the tithing policy seems to favor the wealthy over the poor. and again i didn’t write the policy nor am i under it so my opinion is just that. if poor mormons have no issue with it then so be it.(shrug)
As well, it’s a matter of faith; we happen to believe that there are modern day prophets who have direct dealings with our Father in Heaven. They have told me that God said to pay tithing, and I have confirmed that in my own way, so…
(again, shrug) your opinion is noted.
The original policy, tithing on your surplus, did not discriminate against the poor. That’s why the quotes I’ve included in my early posts on this thread are so interesting. If you only pay tithing on your income after necessary expenses are subtracted, the poor won’t be discriminated against.and i have no problem with that at all, my only voice of criticism which is from a non-member of your faith so take it with a grain of salt is that the tithing policy seems to favor the wealthy over the poor. and again i didn’t write the policy nor am i under it so my opinion is just that. if poor mormons have no issue with it then so be it.
but could imagine if the US tax system worked the same way? the country wouldn’t be able to function, and if the dunderheads in washington can realize that it is easier for the wealthy to pay 10% of their income than someone who is poor, i would imagine god could see this too…
i have no issue with your faith, i don’t have a faith and point out things like this in every religion.
Actually, the wealthy pay FAR more than 10%, though I only paid the government 9.7% this year.and i have no problem with that at all, my only voice of criticism which is from a non-member of your faith so take it with a grain of salt is that the tithing policy seems to favor the wealthy over the poor. and again i didn’t write the policy nor am i under it so my opinion is just that. if poor mormons have no issue with it then so be it.
but could imagine if the US tax system worked the same way? the country wouldn’t be able to function, and if the dunderheads in washington can realize that it is easier for the wealthy to pay 10% of their income than someone who is poor, i would imagine god could see this too…
i have no issue with your faith, i don’t have a faith and point out things like this in every religion.
I’d rather have a sales tax. Then the drug dealers and the prostitutes would have to pay taxes too. It’s no business of the government how much money I make.Actually, the wealthy pay FAR more than 10%, though I only paid the government 9.7% this year.
As for me, I’m a proponent of the flat tax. You know, everybody pays a flat 10% or so of their income, but then they don’t have to pay tax on anything else. Period. No deductions other than business expenses (reasonable ones), and no sales taxes, inheritance taxes, nuttin’.
Problem with a sales tax is that it hits the poor a LOT harder than it does the wealthy.I’d rather have a sales tax. Then the drug dealers and the prostitutes would have to pay taxes too. It’s no business of the government how much money I make.
As a catholic, there are many apostolates and missions not supported directly by the church that I also give to. And there are other non-catholic charities I give to as well. Sending that whole amount to the bishop would rob those ministries of funds.I know there are different legitimate views on this. Let me offer one:
Look at the biggest number on your paycheck. Divide by ten. Send that amount to the good bishop. That night, kneel with your spouse beside your bed, say your prayers, go to bed and,with your clear conscience, have a good night’s sleep. After some experimentation with alternatives, my wife and I recommend this for happiness. I do not see why this would not work for Catholics as well as for Mormons. Do Catholics disagree?
Yes. It’s called “faith.”That does not sit well with me. First off, it makes him dependent on his church to live. If he makes his house payment, and gives whats left to the church, he’s still giving what he can to God. If he pays his tithing, he’s giving up his independence in order to give to the church. And then he’s dependent on the church in order to live.
Look at it another way; what your ‘friend’s church’ was doing was enabling him to obey one of God’s commandments. I was in the same situation waaaay back in the seventies; my husband was ill and had lost his job. We had a choice; pay tithing or pay the mortgage and utilities. We went to the Bishop–and he said, ‘pay tithing.’ We did.If I needed help I would go to my church and ask, yes. But I wouldn’t put myself in the position of having to ask the church because I donated more $$ than I could afford. Giving should be something you do as a return to God for his blessings and to thank Him. And it should be something you do to give to Him. What my friend’s church was doing to him was compelling giving in return for ‘salvation(?)’, and it is turning that giving to God into giving to the church.
Each to his own experiences. I would ask you, however, not to condemn a process that you don’t really ‘get.’ Like the fact that Mormons are not ‘dependent,’ they are ‘interdependent.’ We help one another–and if one feels shame about accepting aid when one needs it, then doesn’t that make service to others a little–condescending?Which makes me happy that I am catholic and I can give to God as a thanks and gratitude. And I can do so not only in $$ to my church, but to God, and in time and service as well. Not because I am compelled to do so to remain in good standing.
Me either. It is called codependency.That does not sit well with me. First off, it makes him dependent on his church to live. If he makes his house payment, and gives whats left to the church, he’s still giving what he can to God. If he pays his tithing, he’s giving up his independence in order to give to the church. And then he’s dependent on the church in order to live.
I would call it dependence. And it would make me uneasy, especially when that dependence is also tied to access to what the mormon church claims is the means to salvation.Yes. It’s called “faith.”
Diana ~ (Not intending to criticize but) you left out Social Security taxes ~ those are the ones that everyone pays. The flat tax would eliminate that tax also. That would really help the poor, most of whom no longer pay income taxes.Actually, the wealthy pay FAR more than 10%, though I only paid the government 9.7% this year.
As for me, I’m a proponent of the flat tax. You know, everybody pays a flat 10% or so of their income, but then they don’t have to pay tax on anything else. Period. No deductions other than business expenses (reasonable ones), and no sales taxes, inheritance taxes, nuttin’.