Mormonism - A Catholic Perspective

[tqualey]

Hi, John,

I live in Houston … and, have yet to even bump into a Mormon… But, don’t go buying any group tickets for a charter bus to the ‘sunny south’ (how you guys manage with that snow and cold is beyond me! I heard some guy telling me that the spoken word actually freezes in mid air at -60F !!! You can tell because you wind up looking like a cartoon character with the words just suspended above you OK, OK … one of those tall Texas tales for sure!

Seriously, I just turned 62 and have come to a much deeper appreciation of Catholic Faith then I have ever had. This list is great!

God bless

I live in wyoming, Lovell to be exact. A very large Mormon and of course the R.L.D.S. Several polygamist in our valley. Being a born and raised Catholic I look upon these people as lost souls. There Zealot tendicies are disturbing to me, always at my door the young missionarys. I tell them that i am Roman Catholic and it seems to end all conversation. lol. Im more than ever in my entire life ( 57 yo. ) proud to be Catholic the true religion for me. I hope this makes sense to others . I don’t mean to offend others.
John

 

[nancy_dalrymple]

I live in wyoming, Lovell to be exact. A very large Mormon and of course the R.L.D.S. Several polygamist in our valley. Being a born and raised Catholic I look upon these people as lost souls. There Zealot tendicies are disturbing to me, always at my door the young missionarys. I tell them that i am Roman Catholic and it seems to end all conversation. lol. Im more than ever in my entire life ( 57 yo. ) proud to be Catholic the true religion for me. I hope this makes sense to others . I don’t mean to offend others.
John

Hello, Say what does RLDS believe? Are they better than LDS? Thank You Nancy Just inquiring because I know of some LDS.

 

[John_Andreoni]

Thanks to everyone who checked out my posts. As far as L.D.S. vs. R.L.D.S the L.D.S. has foregone polygamy practices, however the R.L.D.S. and the fundamentalists do practice polgamy to this day. Its interesting in this small town in Wyo. because polygamy is illegal and the fact that they cannot marry, they operate under just living conditions such as poly. dictates and are called Sister wives. Anyway enough about them. We are R.C. in my family, both sides and my Grandkids are alter servers and im proud of that. Life is good. Thank you Jesus for all. I owe ya. lol John:

 

[Jerry_Parker]

John Andreoni,
*
You wrote: I live in Wyoming, Lovell to be exact. A very large Mormon [presence] and of course the R.L.D.S. Several polygamists in our valley. Being a born and raised Catholic, I look upon these people as lost souls. Their Zealot tendencies are disturbing to me, always at my door the young missionaries. I tell them that I am Roman Catholic and it seems to end all conversation. lol. I’m more than ever in my entire life (57 yrs.) proud to be Catholic, the true religion for me. I hope that this makes sense to others . I don’t mean to offend others.*

Yes, you are lucky, John, to be a cradle Roman Catholic. By the way, the truth of Roman Catholicism does not depend on your own persuasion (“the true religion for me”); it must be true, if it be true at all, for all men. You have no residue of heretical poison (at least not from genuine Roman Catholicism) that taints your mind and soul. I come from the Western U.S., too, from Southern California, where most of my mother’s L.D.S. Mormon family moved during the Great Depression, from Utah. It took many years to rid myself of the last traces of Mormonry’s mindset and ideas from my mind; this religion is so insidious!

**You also wrote: ** As far as L.D.S. vs. R.L.D.S the L.D.S. has foregone polygamy practices, however the R.L.D.S. and the fundamentalists do practice polgamy to this day.

The R.L.D.S. sect, now called the Community of Christ, never embraced polygamy, and, indeed, strongly denounced it. However, there are some weird splinter groups from the R.L.D.S. who adopted polygamy when they accepted the putative “revelations” of Joseph Smith regarding it which the R.L.D.S. sect itself long ago had rejected. These R.L.D.S.-splinter polygamous cultists are very, very few; there are more L.D.S.-splinter (“fundamentalists”) polygamists by far.

My grandfather, L.D.S. Mormon, sort of fell into polygamy, I think without really intending to do so, from the 1930s or so till his death in the early 1960s. He ended up being married to 22 different women! It (and his other vices, e.g. alcoholism) wreaked havoc on our family. May the Lord God spare those who are in danger of falling into this practice or who already are in its thrall. Kryie eleison!

Jerry Parker

 

[John_Andreoni]

Hi Jerry, Your right i should not of generalized all of members of the R.L.D.S. into one category, the splinter groups from the R.L.D.S. are here in Lovell and do practice Poly. But anyway thank you. Still in all i do know a few and i guess they seem happy i guess. Im happy as all get out knowing my beliefs. But beleive me i have lost my way many times in my life and was truly lost, Enough about me. I hope all is well with all of you and i’m happy that i found this site and starting to meet others… John

 

[nancy_dalrymple]

I think Jerry is a wonderfull person and tells it like it is and I think you John have good qualitys and I’m so glad you bought up the subject because I didnt realy know the diference until today.I just found out what Byzantine is today. I’ll be all set when I find out what Septuagint means.There’s so much you can learn on this site,I hope you like it John love of Christ Nancy

 

[John_Andreoni]

Wow, Nancy please inform me also, we all need more enlightment on our faith. In Catholic school it seemed we learned only the highlights of our faith, and never learned the mystical side of catholiscm and there is a mystical side. I remember when i attended college in Reno, i took a world religion class given by a Jesuit priest Fr. Anis Deebs, he taught us the uniformity with islam, hindu, catholiscm and judiasm, it was so enlightening to me. I just cant figure out why we are at war with each other, our beliefs are so interrelated its awesome to me. Again i feel like a ranther sorry all. Nancy let us know of all we dont know as yet…John

 

[nancy_dalrymple]

Wow, Nancy please inform me also, we all need more enlightment on our faith. In Catholic school it seemed we learned only the highlights of our faith, and never learned the mystical side of catholiscm and there is a mystical side. I remember when i attended college in Reno, i took a world religion class given by a Jesuit priest Fr. Anis Deebs, he taught us the uniformity with islam, hindu, catholiscm and judiasm, it was so enlightening to me. I just cant figure out why we are at war with each other, our beliefs are so interrelated its awesome to me. Again i feel like a ranther sorry all. Nancy let us know of all we dont know as yet…John

Look under 06convert,he’s a new member and smart and una fides I can refere you to He’ll give you alot of information. two great people,also Korban knoes his scriptures.I;m new here to since Dec.I know some things because ive been told when I was wrong someone is watching over me Look up the members list good luck

 

[John_Andreoni]

Nancy, Thank you and i will. John

 

[well2661]

First off I will have to say that i am new to this blog but i will have to say that i was a minor seminarian a while ago so I am a bit more philosophical then theological at this point. but I will point out that there seem to be some grave misunderstandings about basic catholic teaching but i wont be a dogma beam right now (e.g. extra ecclesiam nulla salus).

 The Mormon question seem to boil down to wither there was a "great apostasy" in early church and if there was indeed such an apostasy and christ left his church in utter chaos then a question arises "how the New Testament came into being"? History states that the New Testament was put into cannon in 325 AD in the Council of Nicea. 

 Now the next logical question is how can a church, not lead by the Holy Ghost (if there was indeed a "Great Apostasy"), just so happen to put together, by happenstance, the New Testament (the same New Testament that the Mormons believe in)? When there was numerous texts going around during the early church. 

 According to LDS the "great apostasy" occurred early in the first century and this process was not a definite one. The people of the early church lost some kind of "goodness" and thus gradually lost revelation and authority (the keys that christ gave to peter for catholics reading this) but by the time of 325 AD the Catholic Church was in a utter state of apostasy. Again this is according to the LDS history.

 The questions of doctrine of the Catholic Church and the LDS are irrelevant until we can get past the question of wither there was a "great apostasy" or not.

Kyrie eleison

 

[Jerry_Parker]

Well 2661,

**You wrote: ** * Now the next logical question is how can a church, not lead by the Holy Ghost (if there was indeed a “Great Apostasy”), just so happen to put together, by happenstance, the New Testament (the same New Testament that the Mormons believe in)? When there was numerous texts going around during the early Church.

According to LDS the “great apostasy” occurred early in the first century and this process was not a definite one. The people of the early church lost some kind of “goodness” and thus gradually lost revelation and authority (i.e. the keys that Christ gave to Peter for Catholics reading this), but by the time of 325 AD the Catholic Church was [as Mormons suppose] in a utter state of apostasy. Again this is according to the LDS [own] history.

The questions of doctrine of the Catholic Church and the LDS are irrelevant until we can get past the question of whether there was a “Great Apostasy” or not. *​

Hey, great argument against Mormonism, L.D.S. or R.L.D.S.! As once L.D.S. Mormon (long ago and from a partly Mormon Utah family) I have read a lot of L.D.S. and R.L.D.S. Mormon literature as well as much anti-Mormon stuff, and I do not recall having heard this particular argument being used frequently. I’m Catholic now, for all intents and purposes, but I have to wonder, despite that, how today’s low-grade, dumbed-down Catholic seminaries and seminarians would have someone smart enough to think of this!

Jerry Parker

 

[rinnie]

Well 2661,

**You wrote: ** * Now the next logical question is how can a church, not lead by the Holy Ghost (if there was indeed a “Great Apostasy”), just so happen to put together, by happenstance, the New Testament (the same New Testament that the Mormons believe in)? When there was numerous texts going around during the early Church.

According to LDS the “great apostasy” occurred early in the first century and this process was not a definite one. The people of the early church lost some kind of “goodness” and thus gradually lost revelation and authority (i.e. the keys that Christ gave to Peter for Catholics reading this), but by the time of 325 AD the Catholic Church was [as Mormons suppose] in a utter state of apostasy. Again this is according to the LDS [own] history.

The questions of doctrine of the Catholic Church and the LDS are irrelevant until we can get past the question of whether there was a “Great Apostasy” or not. *​

Hey, great argument against Mormonism, L.D.S. or R.L.D.S.! As once L.D.S. Mormon (long ago and from a partly Mormon Utah family) I have read a lot of L.D.S. and R.L.D.S. Mormon literature as well as much anti-Mormon stuff, and I do not recall having heard this particular argument being used frequently. I’m Catholic now, for all intents and purposes, but I have to wonder, despite that, how today’s low-grade, dumbed-down Catholic seminaries and seminarians would have someone smart enough to think of this!

Jerry Parker

If I could add my :twocents: We know for a fact that could never have happened because 2 reasons. The RCC is still here, and the devil has not taken over. If he had the Church would be gone! The bible would be gone, the teaching’s would be gone. But lucky for us Jesus kept his Promise and the devil did not take over. WHY? Because we are lucky enough to have a Father who keeps his promises.

 

[RB2]

I met a mormon missionary once and asked him about the ‘Great Apostasy’ and noted to him there are not any writings of good christians or historians at the time lamenting the changes in doctrine or the influx
of pagans into the church. I made the point that this idea that the
church apostatsized was made during the reformation by people
at the time of the reformation and that these people made various time
arguments not from history(the writings of others from the time period), but from invention. At best this mormon missionary could say was that
Martin Luther said it as if he was implying the weight of great truth.

 

[tqualey]

Hi RB2,

The biggest difficulty I have with Mormonism is that, according toe them, Christ is not God and something else was needed for our salvation. Now, how they can embrace the Bible, but claim it is incomplete is simply beyond both my comprehension and my imagination.

I met a mormon missionary once and asked him about the ‘Great Apostasy’ and noted to him there are not any writings of good christians or historians at the time lamenting the changes in doctrine or the influx
of pagans into the church. I made the point that this idea that the
church apostatsized was made during the reformation by people
at the time of the reformation and that these people made various time
arguments not from history(the writings of others from the time period), but from invention. At best this mormon missionary could say was that
Martin Luther said it as if he was implying the weight of great truth.

This is in no way to question the sincerity of those who truly believe in the Mormon religion. In my opinion, thsoe who embrace the Bible had best look to Christ and His Message of Eternal Salvation through the Church He established (as opposed to Joseph Smith) as sufficient.

God bless

 

[AMDGtoo]

 The Mormon question seem to boil down to wither there was a "great apostasy" in early church and if there was indeed such an apostasy and christ left his church in utter chaos then a question arises "how the New Testament came into being"? History states that the New Testament was put into cannon in 325 AD in the Council of Nicea. 

 Now the next logical question is how can a church, not lead by the Holy Ghost (if there was indeed a "Great Apostasy"), just so happen to put together, by happenstance, the New Testament (the same New Testament that the Mormons believe in)? When there was numerous texts going around during the early church.

Maybe that’s why the LDS say that the Bible is accurate only in so far as it agrees with their explanations. (The New Testament which you say they believe isn’t really the same that we believe–it only looks that way.

IOW, there must be another way to show that there could never have been a total apostasy. Maybe the fact that somone (particularly the enemies of the Church who would have been positively gleeful had it happened) would have mentioned it if there had been, and yet history never any mentions it.

 

[BUF]

"The questions of doctrine of the Catholic Church and the LDS are irrelevant until we can get past the question of wither there was a "great apostasy" or not."

Good point, Kyrie. However, the LDS claim about a “great apostasy” is all based on an allegation by Joseph Smith, a guy who was a convicted con man (“money digging” was the actual charge). He nor anyone else had any proof whatsoever about this apostasy. It’s all based on his and his followers’ word. God’s Word prevails over all else, however.

God bless,

BUF

 

[BUF]

Hi RB2,

“In my opinion, thsoe who embrace the Bible had best look to Christ and His Message of Eternal Salvation through the Church He established (as opposed to Joseph Smith) as sufficient.”

Well said, Tom! Well said! People throughout history, Joseph Smith being one of them, have tried to place themselves above Jesus Christ, saying that they have the word of eternal salvation. If what they say is true, then Christ’s coming has no meaning, and He did not know what He was talking about. When a group constantly contradict themselves and Christ’s teachings, I pray that people would wake up and surrender themselves to Christ and truly listen to His word and not what others “claim” to be His word. Don’t listen to others. Listen to God!

God bless,

BUF

 

[tqualey]

Hi BUF,

Welcome to CAF. This ‘great aostasy’ is a red herring if ever there was one. No proof, only accusation - a 2,000 year history of the Catholic Church being there at the start when Christ gave Peter the Keys and the delegated Power of God to bind and lose. We see the followers of Christ initially calling themselvs followers of The Way and then in 107AD we find the word catholic being used as the new description.

So, who is Joe Smith? Honest. Look at his life and see that he is not the example. Here Christ tells us that from the beginning, the Plan was for one man and one woman to establish the family unit (Matt 19:4-5)

well2661;5700776:

"The questions of doctrine of the Catholic Church and the LDS are irrelevant until we can get past the question of wither there was a "great apostasy" or not."

Good point, Kyrie. However, the LDS claim about a “great apostasy” is all based on an allegation by Joseph Smith, a guy who was a convicted con man (“money digging” was the actual charge). He nor anyone else had any proof whatsoever about this claim.

BUF

Best wishes - I think you will find CAF to be a real source of blessings and inspiration.

God bless

 

[Irish_Kathy]

Actually, as a long time Osmond fan, I can’t help but like Mormons as a group of people in general. I love how family oriented you are. We Catholics can learn a thing or two about family life and togetherness from you.

But the more I get to know my own faith more, the more I’m convinced that the Great Apostasy never happened, especially when you read anything written by Dr. Scott Hahn. His books makes it perfectly clear that there never was a Great Apostasy. Also, if I were to suggest a good book for any Mormon to read it would be A Father Who Keeps His Promises. In it, Dr. Hahn puts all theological ducks in a row as far as Biblical History is concerned. If God the Father is always faithful, then the Great Apostasy never took place because He has always been faithful to us, even if we have not always faithful to Him.

 

[Dbaba]

How can drinking and gambling be such a sin, but to be pro life be left up to one discernment?