Mormonism or Islam

[Sam_777]

both make similar claims about Christianity

So why should someone think of believing their claim when they contradict the previous dogma!

GOD does not contradict Himself, when JESUS descended from heavens He did not contradict the OT law, He completed it without any contradiction.

But when someone later on comes and contradict the previous dogma, then there should be a big question mark on it.

 

[ComeHome2Rome]

Islam because it’s far closer to Christianity than LDS. Unlike the LDS, Islam & Christianity both believe in One God, honor Mary, teach there is a heaven & hell, know there is no “pre-existence” and practice specific daily prayers.

I want this post to be very specifically on this subject, so did not post this on the “anything goes” thread.

Mormons believe a great apostasy occurred following the death of the Apostles and lead to over a thousand years of the world be devoid of the full truth until Joseph Smith came about and thus the Book of Mormon was born.

To some degree, Muslims believe the same. After the death of Jesus (not a crucifixion according to their beliefs), the believers of Jesus hijacked his gospel and founded the Christian religion. This was not the truth and required a correct message for Gabriel to once again appear to Muhammad and thus the Koran was born.

Now…

both make similar claims about Christianity (lacking the full/ true/ complete message). Why would I choose Mormonism over Islam, or vice versa assuming I were to not be a Catholic any longer.

This is in the interest of dialogue btw. Not looking to transfer faiths.

 

[ComeHome2Rome]

They usually appeal to their personal testimony and/or change the subject.

In my admittedly limited experience, it seems that LDS missionaries are trained for a small number of planned encounters and kind of left to their own devices for anything else. They are woefully undertrained for conversing with faithful Catholics. You can really shake them up by answering “yes” to a question such as “Don’t you think the Church should be led by a prophet?” If you can successfully get them off script, you can teach them all sorts of good things.

LOL - they’re taught to revert to their personal testimony when they can’t answer a question.

 

[Janderich]

Islam because it’s far closer to Christianity than LDS. Unlike the LDS, Islam & Christianity both believe in One God, honor Mary, teach there is a heaven & hell, know there is no “pre-existence” and practice specific daily prayers.

Really? Even though they don’t believe Christ is the Savior of the world? Isn’t this the heart of Christianity?

 

[aspirant]

Isn’t this the heart of Christianity?

Not without God.

 

[ComeHome2Rome]

Really? Even though they don’t believe Christ is the Savior of the world? Isn’t this the heart of Christianity?

Yes, really. Islam does teach that Jesus was a Prophet of God. They also believe He was born to a Virgin, like Christianity teaches. But to address your question: the heart of Christianity is Christ’s teaching which was for us to worship the One True God - no other God proceeded Him & no other God follows Him.

As a member of LDS, you ought to know that your faith teaches that the # of Gods are infinite. Who you call God the Father, your faith teaches was once was a mere human-type being, who worshipped another God, who also had previously been a mere human-type being, who worshipped another God, etc., etc. While LDS teaches its members to worship only God the Father, the God of this world, it maintains the existence of an infinite # of Gods and that the men who adhere to LDS can become God themselves over their own planet. LDS teaching is not authentic Christian/Islamic monotheism.

Islam is far closer to Christianity.

 

[aspirant]

Islam is far closer to Christianity.

If we’re talking about LDS Mormons, I have to agree.

If we’re talking about the RLDS, that might be a different story.

 

[colmywaykurtz]

Islam because it’s far closer to Christianity than LDS. Unlike the LDS, Islam & Christianity both believe in One God, honor Mary, teach there is a heaven & hell, know there is no “pre-existence” and practice specific daily prayers.

Islam also teaches the importance of alms-giving to the poor. I’m sure Mormons emphasize this, too, but I’ve also noticed that people of limited economic means don’t usually stay Mormon—they tend to get weeded out, one way or another.

In Islam, by contrast, there are plenty of poor people, and they don’t usually leave, for wealth or any other reason. They tend to stick with it for life.

 

[ComeHome2Rome]

If we’re talking about LDS Mormons, I have to agree.

If we’re talking about the RLDS, that might be a different story.

RLDS reject D&C & Pearl of Great Price?

I’m only familiar with LDS through family members & FLDS through aquaintances, but am aware that there’s something like 18 or some different “Mormon” Sects that follow various different Prophets.

 

[aspirant]

RLDS reject D&C & Pearl of Great Price?

The RLDS (now called the Community of Christ) use the Bible, a different BoM, a different D&C, and do not use PGP. The RLDS affirm that God is the Creator of all things and infinite, unchanging, and eternal; that the Father is neither Adam nor a “resurrected man” and does not have a physical body or a wife; that Father and Son and Spirit are one God; that there are no other gods and human beings do not become gods of their own creations/worlds. There are many other differences as well-- the RLDS rejected polygamy, for example, and believe “the marriage covenant as understood in this life does not continue in the next.” Temples remain public houses of worship that minister to the living, not places for secret ordinances or ordinances for people who have died. RLDS do differ from us in many ways, but they’re a heckuva lot closer to us than the LDS. This is a good book for a basic comparison.

am aware that there’s something like 18 or some different “Mormon” Sects that follow various different Prophets.

If you take a tour of the original Kirtland Temple, the RLDS tour guide will happily inform you that there are somewhere between 200 and 1000 different “Mormon” denominations.

 

[Adamski]

I’ve always thought a major similarity between joesph smith and Muhammad is they said

“God spoke to me and he said I should sleep with your wife and marry you 13 year old daughter”

Very disturbing

 

[mhmtas]

İf İslamic claims are true are there any disadvantages for Christians?

İslam say Jesus is a prophet of God. Christians say Jesus is son of God. Common point is a God. According to trinity Father is the biggest and almighty God who can/do force other Gods(son, Holiy Spirit). So Christians doctirin attach faith to Father God who İslam say is unique God(Allah). So if there were not other Gods Father would make any way to rescue or test hhumanbeing. Now İslam(Allah) say that way is sending prophets beginning with Adam finishing with Muhammed.

İf Jesus is only a prophet there is no disadvantages initially for Christians, Muslims, Jews and who believe only in Fathet(Allah). Why insisting on trinity? Do you have entire valid evidences?

 

[mhmtas]

I’ve always thought a major similarity between joesph smith and Muhammad is they said

“God spoke to me and he said I should sleep with your wife and marry you 13 year old daughter”

Very disturbing

Aişe was 16-17 years old according to İslamic scholars. And in that time that was normal according to stuations that times.

İf you had had correct and full knowledge you would know the fact about prophet Muhammed marriage with Zeyneb. Zeyd and Zeyneb would being divorced because they dispute with their marriage. A woman used to got married after his husband death or divorcing. Zeyd was innocent and adopted child of Prophet. And also to correct that usage that a man can not get married with his divorced adopted child’s wife

 

[ComeHome2Rome]

According to trinity Father is the biggest and almighty God who can/do force other Gods(son, Holiy Spirit). So Christians doctirin attach faith to Father God who İslam say is unique God(Allah). So if there were not other Gods Father would make any way to rescue or test hhumanbeing. Now İslam(Allah) say that way is sending prophets beginning with Adam finishing with Muhammed.

İf Jesus is only a prophet there is no disadvantages initially for Christians, Muslims, Jews and who believe only in Fathet(Allah). Why insisting on trinity? Do you have entire valid evidences?

Pardon, but you seem to misunderstand the Trinity.

Trinity is only One, single God Whose Name is Father, Son & Holy Spirit. Father, Son & Holy Spirit are unique Persons, but are not 3 different Gods. None is greater, bigger or almighter than Another. Only One God, not three, is the Holy Trinity.

Why insist on the Trinity? Because that is what God has revealed Himself to be. It’s what the Church taught from her inception. Evidence is in the Bible and in the writings of the Church Fathers.

 

[codefro]

Pardon, but you seem to misunderstand the Trinity.

Trinity is only One, single God Whose Name is Father, Son & Holy Spirit. Father, Son & Holy Spirit are unique Persons, but are not 3 different Gods. None is greater, bigger or almighter than Another. Only One God, not three, is the Holy Trinity.

Why insist on the Trinity? Because that is what God has revealed Himself to be. It’s what the Church taught from her inception. Evidence is in the Bible and in the writings of the Church Fathers.

He has been going around each forum claiming Christianity is false and Islam is the true religion. Yet, like you said, his facts on Christianity are not true. Yet I pray his presence on the forum at least teaches him what Catholics really believe.

 

[jakasaki]

Aişe was 16-17 years old according to İslamic scholars. And in that time that was normal according to stuations that times.
~ snip ~

Well then, you better throw away Bukhari **ahadith **because Aishia said she was 6 when he married her and at the age of 9 he consummated the marriage.

Meanwhile he was 54

 

[RebeccaJ]

I’ve always thought a major similarity between joesph smith and Muhammad is they said

“God spoke to me and he said I should sleep with your wife and marry you 13 year old daughter”

Very disturbing

Claiming God wants a leader to take on the female followers as “wives”, is a major similarity of more than these two self-proclaimed “prophets”.

 

[Sam_777]

Aişe was 16-17 years old according to İslamic scholars

Again a false claim , mhmtas I’m accusing you of manipulating and using religious dissimulation to deceive the Christian on this board!!!

Which Islamic scholars you are talking about !!!, the ignorant scholars who don’t know A from Z in the Arabic language!!!, or those who are manipulating and using Taqiyya to polish Islam and try to cover Muhammed shameful acts against a 6 years old girl

Here are the authentic hadiths which refute any claim by you or the other ignorant Islamic scholars you know:

Sahih Muslim, Book 008, Number 3309:
“'A’isha (Allah be pleased with her) reported: Allah’s Messenger (may peace be upon him) married me when I was six years old, and I was admitted to his house at the age of nine. She further said: We went to Medina and I had an attack of fever for a month, and my hair had come down to the earlobes. Umm Ruman (my mother) came to me and I was at that time on a swing along with my playmates. She called me loudly and I went to her and I did not know what she had wanted of me. She took hold of my hand and took me to the door, and I was saying: Ha, ha (as if I was gasping), until the agitation of my heart was over. She took me to a house, where had gathered the women of the Ansar. They all blessed me and wished me good luck and said: May you have share in good. She (my mother) entrusted me to them. They washed my head and embellished me and nothing frightened me. Allah’s Messenger (, may peace be upon him) came there in the morning, and I was entrusted to him.”

**صحيح مسلم - النكاح - تزويج الأب البكر الصغيرة:
**تزوجني رسول الله ‏ ‏صلى الله عليه وسلم ‏ ‏لست سنين ‏ ‏وبنى بي ‏ ‏وأنا بنت تسع سنين قالت فقدمنا ‏ ‏المدينة ‏ ‏فوعكت ‏ ‏شهرا ‏ ‏فوفى ‏ ‏شعري ‏ ‏جميمة ‏ ‏فأتتني ‏ ‏أم رومان ‏ ‏وأنا على أرجوحة ومعي صواحبي فصرخت بي فأتيتها وما أدري ما تريد بي فأخذت بيدي فأوقفتني على الباب فقلت هه هه حتى ذهب نفسي فأدخلتني بيتا فإذا نسوة من ‏ ‏الأنصار ‏ ‏فقلن على الخير والبركة وعلى خير ‏ ‏طائر ‏ ‏فأسلمتني إليهن فغسلن رأسي وأصلحنني فلم ‏ ‏يرعني ‏ ‏إلا ورسول الله ‏ ‏صلى الله عليه وسلم ‏ ‏ضحى فأسلمنني إليه ‏
​

Sahih Bukhari, Volume 7, Book 62, Number 64:
“*Narrated 'Aisha:*that the Prophet married her when she was six years old and he consummated his marriage when she was nine years old, and then she remained with him for nine years (i.e., till his death).”

صحيح البخاري - النكاح - إنكاح الرجل ولده الصغار:
حدثنا ‏ ‏محمد بن يوسف ‏ ‏حدثنا ‏ ‏سفيان ‏ ‏عن ‏ ‏هشام ‏ ‏عن ‏ ‏أبيه ‏ ‏عن ‏ ‏عائشة ‏ ‏رضي الله عنها ‏
أن النبي ‏ ‏صلى الله عليه وسلم ‏ ‏تزوجها وهي بنت ست سنين وأدخلت عليه وهي بنت تسع ومكثت عنده تسعا ‏
​

 

[Sam_777]

Well then, you better throw away Bukhari **ahadith **because Aishia said she was 6 when he married her and at the age of 9 he consummated the marriage.

Meanwhile he was 54

sister in Christ for pointing that out, since it’s very easy to spread religious dissimulation through social media nowadays.

 

[colmywaykurtz]

What do you say to these documented facts, mhmtas? This is important—it is a very “teachable moment” for all the people following this thread, Catholic and non-Catholic.