Mormons: What do you think about Galations 1:6-10?

[AndrewJMason]

Just sitting here think about the “Church of Jesus Christ and Latter-Day Saints.”

I don’t wish to insult my beloved separated brothers in Christ, but I must know what you think of this?

Obviously when Christ gave us his blood (The Transfigured wine) he said that his blood (taking the form of WINE) was the blood of the new and everlasting covenant with God. The Covenant that renewed Abraham’s.
Yet, through your gospel you renewed his blood with water.

What is your take on Galations 1:6-10. Because, obviously you’re teaching a new gospel…

May you find Peace and Grace through the love of our LORD, Jesus Christ.

 

[DeMarcus_Era]

Just sitting here think about the “Church of Jesus Christ and Latter-Day Saints.”

I don’t wish to insult my beloved separated brothers in Christ, but I must know what you think of this?

Obviously when Christ gave us his blood (The Transfigured wine) he said that his blood (taking the form of WINE) was the blood of the new and everlasting covenant with God. The Covenant that renewed Abraham’s.
Yet, through your gospel you renewed his blood with water.

What is your take on Galations 1:6-10. Because, obviously you’re teaching a new gospel…

May you find Peace and Grace through the love of our LORD, Jesus Christ.

Wine was used in Mormonism’s earlier days. It’s impractical to have 15-year old teachers in the back room preparing the eucharist with alcoholic beverages.

 

[SteveVH]

Wine was used in Mormonism’s earlier days. It’s impractical to have 15-year old teachers in the back room preparing the eucharist with alcoholic beverages.

What is impractical is to have 15 year old priests. Christ instituted the sacrament and told us what to do. He didn’t say we could use another substance if it was practical to do so. Also, there are no laws prohibiting the sacramental use of wine by minors.

 

[Guitarjesus7]

What is impractical is to have 15 year old priests. Christ instituted the sacrament and told us what to do. He didn’t say we could use another substance if it was practical to do so. Also, there are no laws prohibiting the sacramental use of wine by minors.

They’re not priests, they’re called teachers. They prepare it, while the priests bless it. And you have to remember that in the Mormon church there is no real presence, it’s all symbolic. So to them it doesn’t matter What is used as long as the sacrament prayer is said correctly.

 

[SteveVH]

They’re not priests, they’re called teachers. They prepare it, while the priests bless it. And you have to remember that in the Mormon church there is no real presence, it’s all symbolic. So to them it doesn’t matter What is used as long as the sacrament prayer is said correctly.

Thanks for the correction. May I ask what is involved in becoming a Mormon priest? What are the age requirements and what degree of training and education do they undergo before they are ordained?

Thanks.

 

[Guitarjesus7]

Thanks for the correction. May I ask what is involved in becoming a Mormon priest? What are the age requirements and what degree of training and education do they undergo before they are ordained?

Thanks.

Well first off, a priest in the Mormon church isn’t the same thing as a priest in the catholic church. A mormon bishop is somewhat equivalent to a catholic priest, and a mormon stake president is more closely related to a catholic bishop. In the Mormon church there are two “priesthoods” that any worthy man can hold. Once a boy turns 16 he is interviewed very thoroughly by his bishop, who then is supposed to pray, and with the help of the holy spirit, determine whether or not the boy is eligible. During the Mormon sacrament services the boy is sustained by the congregation and, if anyone sees a problem with the boy becoming a priest, they are invited to take up their concerns with the bishop, who will then speak to the boy about the issue, and guide the boy through the repentance process (if there was a serious sin committed). Then the boy is expected to follow all the rules set out for him in the doctrine and covenants, priesthood manuals, and his bishop. He is expected to attend seminary, and to attend all of his quorum meetings. If he fails to follow these rules, he is suspended from his obligations as a priest until he has fully repented.

Source: I was Mormon until last year

 

[SteveVH]

Well first off, a priest in the Mormon church isn’t the same thing as a priest in the catholic church. A mormon bishop is somewhat equivalent to a catholic priest, and a mormon stake president is more closely related to a catholic bishop. In the Mormon church there are two “priesthoods” that any worthy man can hold. Once a boy turns 16 he is interviewed very thoroughly by his bishop, who then is supposed to pray, and with the help of the holy spirit, determine whether or not the boy is eligible. During the Mormon sacrament services the boy is sustained by the congregation and, if anyone sees a problem with the boy becoming a priest, they are invited to take up their concerns with the bishop, who will then speak to the boy about the issue, and guide the boy through the repentance process (if there was a serious sin committed). Then the boy is expected to follow all the rules set out for him in the doctrine and covenants, priesthood manuals, and his bishop. He is expected to attend seminary, and to attend all of his quorum meetings. If he fails to follow these rules, he is suspended from his obligations as a priest until he has fully repented.

Source: I was Mormon until last year

Wow! You are very informative. Thanks for that. Exactly what are the duties and obligations of a Mormon priest? I am aware that “priest” does not mean the same to a Mormon as it does to a Catholic, but I have always had a difficult time imagining a priest who still lives at home with mom and dad, has the hots for little Suzy in his geometry class, and is worried about his face breaking out.

I have found that between Catholics and Mormons one almost needs a translator when using even fairly common words such as “priest”. We are worlds apart in our definitions and understanding in many areas. But I would like to know about the function of a Mormon priest. Scripurally, a priest is one who offers sacrifice to God. A Catholic priest offers the one sacrifice of Jesus Christ to the Father at each Mass. Do Mormon priests offer sacrifice?

 

[flyonthewall]

Just sitting here think about the “Church of Jesus Christ and Latter-Day Saints.”

I don’t wish to insult my beloved separated brothers in Christ, but I must know what you think of this?

Obviously when Christ gave us his blood (The Transfigured wine) he said that his blood (taking the form of WINE) was the blood of the new and everlasting covenant with God. The Covenant that renewed Abraham’s.
Yet, through your gospel you renewed his blood with water.

What is your take on Galations 1:6-10. Because, obviously you’re teaching a new gospel…

May you find Peace and Grace through the love of our LORD, Jesus Christ.

Galatians 1:6-10, is speaking about the apostacy that was going on within the church amongst the Galatians.

As for the Sacrament/Eucharist, Jesus gave His blood in the garden and on the cross. What He gave the Apostles was the emblems to be used in the ordinance in rememberance of His body and blood.
As was stated before, originally wine was used, but we now use water.
Jesus Christ is the Living Waters, and whosoever drinks from the waters that He gives, shall never thirst.
As you can see, water takes nothing away from the rememberance that Jesus Christ explained was the purpose of the ordinance, in fact, adds more depth to it.

 

[flyonthewall]

Wow! You are very informative. Thanks for that. Exactly what are the duties and obligations of a Mormon priest? I am aware that “priest” does not mean the same to a Mormon as it does to a Catholic, but I have always had a difficult time imagining a priest who still lives at home with mom and dad, has the hots for little Suzy in his geometry class, and is worried about his face breaking out.

I have found that between Catholics and Mormons one almost needs a translator when using even fairly common words such as “priest”. We are worlds apart in our definitions and understanding in many areas. But I would like to know about the function of a Mormon priest. Scripurally, a priest is one who offers sacrifice to God. A Catholic priest offers the one sacrifice of Jesus Christ to the Father at each Mass. Do Mormon priests offer sacrifice?

In our scriptures, D&C 20 outlines the duties of each office:

46The priest’s duty is to preach, teach, expound, exhort, and baptize, and administer the sacrament,

47And visit the house of each member, and exhort them to pray vocally and in secret and attend to all family duties.

48And he may also ordain other priests, teachers, and deacons.

49And he is to take the lead of meetings when there is no elder present;

50But when there is an elder present, he is only to preach, teach, expound, exhort, and baptize,

51And visit the house of each member, exhorting them to pray vocally and in secret and attend to all family duties.

52In all these duties the priest is to assist the elder if occasion requires.

 

[SteveVH]

Galatians 1:6-10, is speaking about the apostacy that was going on within the church amongst the Galatians.

And being corrected by Paul on behalf of the Church which possessed the truth of the gospel, and still does. It is a condemnation of anyone departing from the teachings of the Apostles and accepting another gospel from anyone, even an angel from heaven. Do you know of any comments from Joseph Smith regarding this passage?

As for the Sacrament/Eucharist, Jesus gave His blood in the garden and on the cross. What He gave the Apostles was the emblems to be used in the ordinance in rememberance of His body and blood.

I don’t recall the Scriptures referring Christ using “emblems”, or anything close to that meaning, at the last supper. How do you come to that conclusion?

As was stated before, originally wine was used, but we now use water.
Jesus Christ is the Living Waters, and whosoever drinks from the waters that He gives, shall never thirst.

As you can see, water takes nothing away from the rememberance that Jesus Christ explained was the purpose of the ordinance, in fact, adds more depth to it.

I can appreciate the significance of water. When our priests consecrate the wine, a couple of drops of water are poured into the chalice as well. When the spear was thrust into Christ’s side, water and blood poured out. But was this the reason for the change from wine to water in the Mormon sacrament or was it that there was a conflict between the prohibition against drinking of alcoholic beverages and then passing around wine during the sacrament?

Would you agree that Christ used wine and commanded us to do what He did?

 

[wmscott]

They’re not priests, they’re called teachers. They prepare it, while the priests bless it.** And you have to remember that in the Mormon church there is no real presence, it’s ***all *****symbolic. So to them it doesn’t matter What is used as long as the sacrament prayer is said correctly.

For some reason the bolded part of you statement hit me like a hammer. wow this can be taken many ways. Praise God I am catholic.

 

[Guitarjesus7]

Wow! You are very informative. Thanks for that. Exactly what are the duties and obligations of a Mormon priest? I am aware that “priest” does not mean the same to a Mormon as it does to a Catholic, but I have always had a difficult time imagining a priest who still lives at home with mom and dad, has the hots for little Suzy in his geometry class, and is worried about his face breaking out.

I have found that between Catholics and Mormons one almost needs a translator when using even fairly common words such as “priest”. We are worlds apart in our definitions and understanding in many areas. But I would like to know about the function of a Mormon priest. Scripurally, a priest is one who offers sacrifice to God. A Catholic priest offers the one sacrifice of Jesus Christ to the Father at each Mass. Do Mormon priests offer sacrifice?

When someone becomes a priest in the mormon church they are simply advancing through “offices of the priesthood.” deacons in the mormon church are only 12 years old. A priest in the mormon church doesnt do nearly the same things that a priest in the catholic church does. If there were 16 year old boys in charge of running wards (the equivilant of a parish) then it would be a catostrophic failure.The duties of a priest in the Mormon church are:

1. Teach the gospel.
2. Baptize. (although this very rarely happens, its usually either the father of the child getting baptized, or a missionary, or a bishop)
3. Administer the sacrament.
4. Visit the members.
5. Ordain others to the Aaronic Priesthood. (this also very rarely happens. Bishops do this)
6. Assist in missionary work.

priests in the Mormon church offers no sacrifice literal sacrifice to god. I have heard it explained as a personal sacrifice to serve god. Its all a matter of opinion as to whether or not this constitutes a true, biblical sacrifice.

 

[Guitarjesus7]

For some reason the bolded part of you statement hit me like a hammer. wow this can be taken many ways. Praise God I am catholic.

Amen

 

[ParkerD]

Just sitting here think about the “Church of Jesus Christ and Latter-Day Saints.”

I don’t wish to insult my beloved separated brothers in Christ, but I must know what you think of this?

Obviously when Christ gave us his blood (The Transfigured wine) he said that his blood (taking the form of WINE) was the blood of the new and everlasting covenant with God. The Covenant that renewed Abraham’s.
Yet, through your gospel you renewed his blood with water.

What is your take on Galations 1:6-10. Because, obviously you’re teaching a new gospel…

May you find Peace and Grace through the love of our LORD, Jesus Christ.

Andrew J Mason,

What one should well do as they read the Bible, is keep reading beyond a set number of verses to fit a meaning into a context.

Verse 12 ties right back to what the Savior told Peter about how Peter had received his knowledge that Jesus is the very Christ who had been prophesied to come to earth, as in Isaiah 61:1-3. Paul says he received the gospel “by the revelation of Jesus Christ”–meaning by the power of the Holy Ghost revealing truth to Paul, as well as by the vision he had of the living Savior and Redeemer.

Joseph Smith was a witness also of the living Savior and Redeemer, so that is the very same gospel that Paul preached. The Galatians, it is clear, were seeking to “persuade men” and to “please men” (v. 10), and that is precisely what they were being warned against doing.

Wishing you peace and great opportunities of service in the course of your life, Andrew.

 

[SteveVH]

In our scriptures, D&C 20 outlines the duties of each office:

46The priest’s duty is to preach, teach, expound, exhort, and baptize, and administer the sacrament,

47And visit the house of each member, and exhort them to pray vocally and in secret and attend to all family duties.

48And he may also ordain other priests, teachers, and deacons.

49And he is to take the lead of meetings when there is no elder present;

50But when there is an elder present, he is only to preach, teach, expound, exhort, and baptize,

51And visit the house of each member, exhorting them to pray vocally and in secret and attend to all family duties.

52In all these duties the priest is to assist the elder if occasion requires.

I think No. 51 is a duplicate of No. 47, but I get the gist. I am a youth minister in my parish and work with teenagers, from 14 to 18 years old. We have some very bright teens who know their stuff (which makes me very proud). I have heard some profound thoughts expressed by our teens. I would not, however, consider any one of them to be qualified to preach or teach the congregation in any official capacity (nor would they be allowed to do so). This is the job of the priest who has had extensive training, six to eight years of higher education and seminary, in most cases. A Deacon may also preach and teach, but again, he has had at least four years of theological and philosophical training in addition to any other higher education. I’m sorry, but I would really have a hard time being taught by a sixteen year old who has not even completed high school just from a mauturity standpoint. Do you get a lot out of their teaching and preaching?

 

[TheExorcist]

I think No. 51 is a duplicate of No. 47, but I get the gist. I am a youth minister in my parish and work with teenagers, from 14 to 18 years old. We have some very bright teens who know their stuff (which makes me very proud). I have heard some profound thoughts expressed by our teens. I would not, however, consider any one of them to be qualified to preach or teach the congregation in any official capacity (nor would they be allowed to do so). This is the job of the priest who has had extensive training, six to eight years of higher education and seminary, in most cases. A Deacon may also preach and teach, but again, he has had at least four years of theological and philosophical training in addition to any other higher education. I’m sorry, but I would really have a hard time being taught by a sixteen year old who has not even completed high school just from a mauturity standpoint. Do you get a lot out of their teaching and preaching?

In reality the Young Men in the ward do very little teaching, at least at the ward (congregational) level. They may in their quorum (a name for a group of LDS priesthood holders holding the same office who meet together the third hour of church) and they could also give talks in sacrament meeting, but so does the entire congregation. Nobody really “preaches” in the LDS church as Catholics would understand it. LDS General Authorities do get quite preachy in their talks to members however.

 

[SteveVH]

In reality the Young Men in the ward do very little teaching, at least at the ward (congregational) level. They may in their quorum (a name for a group of LDS priesthood holders holding the same office who meet together the third hour of church) and they could also give talks in sacrament meeting, but so does the entire congregation. Nobody really “preaches” in the LDS church as Catholics would understand it. LDS General Authorities do get quite preachy in their talks to members however.

Welcome to CAF. You sound like you have some experience with this. If what you say is the case, then what real function do Mormon priests have? As a Catholic I believe in the “common priesthood” of all members of the Church by virtue of being a member of the Body of Christ. The ordained or concecrated priesthood, however serves a different and unique function. Is there any parallel to this in the LDS Church?

 

[flyonthewall]

I think No. 51 is a duplicate of No. 47, but I get the gist. I am a youth minister in my parish and work with teenagers, from 14 to 18 years old. We have some very bright teens who know their stuff (which makes me very proud). I have heard some profound thoughts expressed by our teens. I would not, however, consider any one of them to be qualified to preach or teach the congregation in any official capacity (nor would they be allowed to do so). This is the job of the priest who has had extensive training, six to eight years of higher education and seminary, in most cases. A Deacon may also preach and teach, but again, he has had at least four years of theological and philosophical training in addition to any other higher education. I’m sorry, but I would really have a hard time being taught by a sixteen year old who has not even completed high school just from a mauturity standpoint. Do you get a lot out of their teaching and preaching?

The Priests carry out their duties under the direction of a Melchizedek priesthood holder, an Elder or Hight Priest.
We have a “Home Teaching” program in our church, where a Melchizedek priesthood holder and a Aaronic priesthood holder, Teacher or Priest, visit families of the ward/congregation monthly, and give a lesson or a spiritual thought to the family, and see if there is anything they can help with, either spiritually or temporally. The pair take turns preparing the lesson or spiritual thought each month. The lesson usually is taken from the church magazine The Ensign or Liahona, where the Leadership of the church provide a Home Teaching message. They can use the one in the magazine or prepare their own, but the message is personlized for each family.
So the teaching and preaching the youth do, is more re-emphasizing spiritual concepts and encouragement, not coming up with a sermon all on their own.

As you can see, trying to overlay a positions from our church on top of positions of the same name in your church, don’t work.

 

[TheExorcist]

Welcome to CAF. You sound like you have some experience with this. If what you say is the case, then what real function do Mormon priests have? As a Catholic I believe in the “common priesthood” of all members of the Church by virtue of being a member of the Body of Christ. The ordained or concecrated priesthood, however serves a different and unique function. Is there any parallel to this in the LDS Church?

Thanks for the welcome! I am currently LDS and have been for almost 17 years. I married an EXTREMELY staunch LDS girl and we have a little boy so leaving the church isn’t really possible right now. I feel most united to the Catholic church and hope to be able to make the Tiber swim one of these days. Just wanted to give a quick introduction.

You’ve seen the LDS Doctrine and Covenants quoted a few posts back so you know their “official” duties. In practicality they bless the sacrament and participate in home teaching (also see previous post). The title of priest is incidental and has no analogue in the Catholic church. There is no consecrated life in the LDS church. The closest thing the LDS church has is to be “called” as a full time General Authority. This is all best defined by a copy and paste from the church website:

*General Administration

The Lord guides His covenant people today through the President of the Church, whom we sustain as prophet, seer, and revelator. The President of the Church presides over the entire Church. He and his counselors, who are also prophets, seers, and revelators, form the Quorum of the First Presidency.

Members of the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles are also prophets, seers, and revelators. They, along with the First Presidency, are “special witnesses of the name of Christ in all the world” (D&C 107:23). They act under the direction of the First Presidency “to build up the church, and regulate all the affairs of the same in all nations” (D&C 107:33). They “open the door [to the nations] by the proclamation of the gospel of Jesus Christ” (D&C 107:35).

Members of the Quorums of the Seventy are called to proclaim the gospel and build up the Church. They work under the direction of the Twelve Apostles and the leadership of seven brethren who are called to serve as the Presidency of the Seventy. Members of the First and Second Quorums of the Seventy are designated General Authorities, and they may be called to serve anywhere in the world.

The Presiding Bishopric is the presidency of the Aaronic Priesthood throughout the Church. The Presiding Bishop and his counselors serve under the direction of the First Presidency to administer the temporal affairs of the Church.

The Young Men, Relief Society, Young Women, Primary, and Sunday School organizations all have presidencies on the general level to provide instruction and direction.

Area Administration

An area is the largest geographic division of the Church. The First Presidency assigns the Presidency of the Seventy to directly supervise selected areas of the Church under the direction of the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles. In other areas of the Church, the First Presidency assigns Area Presidencies to preside. An Area Presidency consists of a president, who is usually assigned from the First or Second Quorum of the Seventy, and two counselors, who may be assigned from any Quorum of the Seventy. Area Presidencies serve under the direction of the First Presidency, the Quorum of the Twelve, and the Presidency of the Seventy.

Some brethren are ordained to the office of Seventy but do not serve as General Authorities. They are called Area Seventies, and they are assigned to quorums other than the First or Second Quorums of the Seventy, according to geographic location. Their jurisdiction is limited to the general region in which they live. Some Area Seventies serve in Area Presidencies.*

Those listed above are the only members of the church “paid” for their work.

 

[DeMarcus_Era]

Having a mostly lay clergy has its advantages (moneysaver) and disadvantages (no theology, you have to train and retrain).

The nicest perk is that the clergy is usually staffed by professionally succesful people. They can hook you up with good career opportunities. For example, my Stake President owned a PR firm and got my younger sister an internship.