Most Holy Family Monestary

[n8pzo]

n8pzo;3174681:

If I was the Pope and I wanted to show to the world that I was the rightful successor of Peter and that I carry the same cross he did. I might have upside down crosses, but since im not I don’t.

I’ve been reading different things and through out history of the church, the hierarchy of the church and the leaders sometime fall into worldy desires. Where they want women, money, and secular power. The purist forms of Christ’s church that I have seen is when the leaders or people went around trying to obtain these worldly posessions is the faith of the lower clergy. Monks who made wine and liquor, monks who built schools and shealters, and monks who showed the grace of God to the sick and poor and did this all with love and not condeming or judging people, but instead they would pray and hold firm to the truth of the Church and pray for the souls of the corrupt that they may soften their hearts and open their eyes back to the Lord.

Pope John Paul II
Wrote 14 Encyclicals

1. Redemptor Hominis “The Redeemer of Man”
2. Dives in Misericordia “Rich in Mercy”
3. Laborem Exercens “On Human Work”
4. Slavorum Apostoli “The Apostles of the Slavs”
5. Dominum et Vivificantem “The Lord and Giver of Life”
6. Redemptoris Mater “Mother of the Redeemer”
7. Sollicitudo Rei Socialis “On Social Concerns”
8. Redemptoris Missio “Mission of the Redeemer”
9. Centesimus Annus “The Hundredth Year”
10. Veritatis Splendor “The Splendor of Truth”
11. Evangelium Vitae “The Gospel of Life”
12. Ut Unum Sint “That They May Be One”
13. Fides et Ratio “Faith and Reason”
14. Ecclesia de Eucharistia “The Church of the Eucharist”

Each of these are used to explain certain aspects of the Christian Faith in relation to worldly problems. John Paul stressed the need of bringing the message of God to “all cultures, all ideological concepts, all people of good will” with a proper “missionary attitude.” This attitude, he insists, must first begin with a proper regard of “what is in man,” again stressing the personalist theme. He stresses that a proper expression of the missionary attitude is not destructive, but rather begins with building on what is already there.

The angle of his missionary work is what the dimond brothers criticize. If you understand the reason for the words used was to bring everyone to a basic understanding of why man does stuff. Then show them the importance of Jesus Christ to share with all people the truth the church has upheld for the last 2000 years.

This may have been seen by some as conforming to modernism but it is not it is about preaching to a different world. In the time of Christ and the early church there was a seperation of classes people knew who was rich and who was poor and they gave them a reason to live and prosper. Today these lines of who is rich and poor has changed instead man now today can be born dirt poor and become the richest person in the world and they can do this without God. John Paul II mission was to address this new world and keep the understanding of Christ relevent today without changing the church to match the times. The changes made to the church and how it pracitices its faith publicly adjust to the modern world slightly but not neccicarly the modern world but the societies around the world that make up the Church. Services in America will be slightly different then those done in France. The adjustments made to the mass was to have a more uniformal practice around the world.

I’m sorry but I don’t have the time to refute all of JPII’s falsehoods. but his ministry (if you want to call it that) was to water down Christianity so that he could spread indifferentism. This all in the name of ecumenism. True ecumenism is the purest act of true charity, to bring people into the true faith out of the darkness . Which by the way John P II never tried to do. Also, by the way is all the MFHM do with their time (missionary work). The Church can never change, no matter how much someone tries to change it.
Although some popes have been immoral, there are alot of people out there who like to defame the Church. Also there is a difference between immoral behavior and preaching heresy. Sin can be forgiven but heresy will place you outside the Church.

 

[n8pzo]

Furthermore let’s clarify a few more Popes for the Dimond “Brothers”:

Catechism of the Council of Trent (edited by St. Charles Borromeo (A.D. 1584):

 

[n8pzo]

Here’s one from Ven. Pius XII:

“those who do not belong to the visible Body of the Catholic Church … We ask each and every one of them to correspond to the interior movements of grace, and to seek to withdraw from that state in which they cannot be sure of their salvation.[Cf. Pius IX, Iam Vos Omnes, 13 Sept. 1868] For even though by an unconscious desire and longing have a certain relationship with the Mystical Body of the Redeemer, they still remain deprived of those many heavenly gifts and helps which can only be enjoyed in the Catholic Church.” (Mystici Corporis # 103)

 First of all, this passage from Mystici Corporis has been incorrectly translated by many

to further weaken and to pervert the actual words of Pius XII. The phrase (ab eo statu se
eripere studeant, in quo de sempiterna cuiusque propria salute securi esse non possunt) which is correctly translated as “…extricate themselves from that condition in which they cannot
be secure about their own eternal salvation,” has been mistranslated as “look to
withdrawing from that state in which they cannot be sure of their salvation.”622 This
mistranslation gives the clear impression that non‐Catholics have an outside chance at
gaining salvation where they are.

 It’s very interesting that even a heretical defender of Protocol 122/49, Msgr. Fenton,

admits that “sure” is a seriously misleading translation.

Msgr. Joseph Clifford Fenton, The Catholic Church and Salvation, 1958, p. 88:
“Many of the published translations of the Mystici Corporis Christi employ the
expression ‘in which they cannot be sure of their salvation’ in rendering this
clause into English. This terminology is both inexact and seriously
misleading.”623

 Fenton goes on to point out that the mistranslation gives the impression that

Catholics can be sure of their salvation, which is a heresy condemned by the Council of
Trent (Trent, Sess. 6, Chap. 9). (Outside the Catholic Church there is Absolutely No Salvation p.250-51; Bro. Peter Dimond O.S.B.)

And the fact that this made its way into the Acta Apostolicae Sedis:

“In the present economy there is no other way of communicating [sanctifying grace] to the child who has not yet the use of reason [other than Baptism]. But, nevertheless, the state of grace at the moment of death is absolutely necessary for salvation. Without it, it is not possible to attain supernatural happiness, the beatific vision of God. An act of love can suffice for an adult to obtain sanctifying grace and supply for the absence of Baptism; for the unborn child or for the newly born, this way is not open.” (Address to Midwives, Oct. 29, 1951)

So, besides Blessed Pius IX, we’ve got three formally “heretical” Popes here. If the Dimond Brothers are right then they better be consistent, but alas they are not, therefore THEY ARE WRONG.

Again this is a speech and does not meet the requirements for Infallibility.

From now on I will only be responding to your replies if you can bring up something Infallible to argue your opinion. If you can I will humbly accept BOD, BOB, and Invincible Ignorance.

 

[BarbG]

I’m not sure where all of you are “coming from” but I was under the impression that this site had to do with “most holy family monastery” – and that is why I went into this discussion I don’t know where I got this site but was absolutely flabbergasted when I “clicked” into it – many observations that Pope John Paul was a heretic? and other Popes were heretics??? I couldn’t believe it – I was in St. Peter’s Square when Pope John Paul celebrated his 25th anniversary – I was totally amazed and thrilled – I am a “cradle” Catholic, in my 80’s, and I just love the Church – in fact, I go to Mass every day to receive the Eucharist and know that Christ is with me all day – it’s the only thing that keeps me going.

 

[n8pzo]

I’m not sure where all of you are “coming from” but I was under the impression that this site had to do with “most holy family monastery” – and that is why I went into this discussion I don’t know where I got this site but was absolutely flabbergasted when I “clicked” into it – many observations that Pope John Paul was a heretic? and other Popes were heretics??? I couldn’t believe it – I was in St. Peter’s Square when Pope John Paul celebrated his 25th anniversary – I was totally amazed and thrilled – I am a “cradle” Catholic, in my 80’s, and I just love the Church – in fact, I go to Mass every day to receive the Eucharist and know that Christ is with me all day – it’s the only thing that keeps me going.

Well ma’am, I am glad that you love the Church. It is unfortunate that you are not attending a real Mass, but the abomination of desolation as predicted in the book of Daniel, and Christ is not present in its bread, as He is in the Traditional Latin Mass. This is because of the sins of the world that the mass would be hard to come by as St. Alphonsus predicted.
JPII unfortunately was an anti-pope. He taught contrary to the Church’s teachings. In fact all the way back to John XXIII we have been without a pope.
Vatican II started the false Church in Rome that is Predicted in the book of Revelation as the Whore of Babylon, i.e. the false bride of Christ.
I think that God was leading you to the Most Holy Family Monastery’s website to show you the Church’s true teachings, which they have many posted. These Dogmas are not taught anymore because the false Vatican II church has suppressed them to a certain extent.
My advice, as someone who cares about your soul, is to go to the site read the material with an honest mind and a sincere heart looking always for the truth. Also, pray the 15 decades of the Rosary each day and ask the Holy Mother to lead you to the truth. And definitely stop going to the “Novus Ordo” mass immediately as it is a blasphemy against Christ and not the true Mass.

 

[Sure]

-The name is Most Holy Family Monastery
-They are an Order of St. Benedict
-Yes they accept donations because they make almost no money off of their material (eg. 100 dvd’s for $6). Usually just charge for shipping
-They’re in Fillmore, NY
-There are about 5 guys at the monastery
-They are all Brothers and no Priests so there is no need for anyone to “attend there regularly”
-As to the size of them and the rest of the true followers of Catholic Doctrine I think St. Gregory sums it up fine:
“Where are they who revile us for our
poverty and pride themselves in their riches? They who define the Church by numbers
and scorn the little flock?” St. Gregory Nazianz (+380), Against the Arians (William Jurgens, The Faith of the Early Fathers, Vol. 2, p. 33. )

Hmmm…they are not a registered legal entity or not for profit corporation in Fillmore, NY…interesting. I wonder if the IRS knows they are collecting donations?

They also are not affiliated with the Order of St. Benedict or a Catholic diocese.

Does anyone have a picture of this monastery? or is it just a trailer on the Dimond family farm?

How are these guys any different from Pope Michael in his mom’s basement?

So, which one or you Peter or Michael???

 

[SemperFidelis]

So, we’re going to deny the truth now, to return your sarcasm. If you are going to be honest, you would admit that “Singulari Quadem” is an allocution. The definition of which is “a formal speech giving advice or warning”. What’s in Denzinger is a transcription of that speech. A speech to cardinals does not fulfill the requirements for an Ex Cathedra statement.
Even though, there is nothing in it that is against Catholic Teaching. All Pius IX is saying is that those that are truly invincibly ignorant will not be faulted and damned for this reason. But since there is no remission of sins outside the Catholic Church these invincibly ignorant individuals, assuming they remain outside the Church, will be damned for other sins.

So we’re going to blatantly deny that Bl. Pius IX is not saying what he is in fact saying? Well that’s gonna help your cause. You’re denying the obvious here again. Yes it’s not an infallible statement, but if we’re going to go by that logic, then the Popes from Bl. John XXIII to now could not have been anti-Popes because they haven’t made any infallible statements. Being a formal heretic doesn’t just require an infallible statement. If that was the case, there would be no sedevacantists because no Pope since Ven Pius XII has done so. Just for arguments sake, if teaching the invincibly ignorant can be saved is a rejection of EENS and is heresy (which it’s not, but it is according to you), then teaching it in two encyclicals (both of which are in Denzinger) would constitute said Pope being a formal heretic. If teaching it in two encyclicals doesn’t make him a formal heretic according to you, then I don’t know what would. It doesn’t take an ex cathedra or infallible statement to do so does it? Your logic, as that of the Dimond “brothers,” makes absolutely no since, knowing what we know about sedevacantists. It is not in the least consistent. It’s plain and clear for everybody to see: if Feeneyism is right then Bl. Pius IX was a formal heretic on two accounts for twice teaching the invincibly ignorant “can attain eternal life.” (his words, not mine) Once again:

HOW LONG ARE YOU GOING TO DENY THE OBVIOUS?

 

[SemperFidelis]

Here again there is nothing against Catholic Teaching on the Dogma “Outside the Catholic Church there is No Salvation”.
First of all, you notice where Pius IX says it’s a grave error of those " who believe that men living in error, and separated from the true faith and from Catholic unity, can attain eternal life"
Interesting that he would go on and say just the opposite as you would like everyone to think.
Then he explains that those who are obedient, honest, upright and keep the natural law can attain eternal life. This is obviously because God would never allow one of His elect to go to hell. He would show this invincibly ignorant person the Church by the “operating power of divine light and grace”.
If not then the first part of the paragraph would be a contradiction.
Are you saying the pope contradicted himself?
This idea takes trust in divine providence which is almost non-existent anymore.

The above can only be equated to what I would describe as “verbal gymnastics.” Come on now, it couldn’t be any clearer:

“It is known to Us and to you that they who labor in invincible ignorance of our most holy religion and who, zealously keeping the natural law and its precepts engraved in the hearts of all by God, and being ready to obey God, live an honest and upright life, can, by the operating power of divine light and grace, attain eternal life,”

This would clearly make Bl. Pius IX a heretic according to you. The fact that you don’t regard him as such makes your position inconsistent, and therefore untenable and WRONG.

The Pope said nothing in contradiction to the teaching of the Church. All the Catholics you quote that have speculated on BOD and BOB and In. Ig., I can quote as many that have held to the Church’s dogma. If this dogma is so-called “feenyism” then I guess all those saints are feenyites. Please, in the future read all of my responses so that I don’t have to repeat myself. Thanks

Yes and I could probably find a quote for everybody you quote where they speak about BOD and BOB. BOD AND BOB DO NOT IN ANY WAY SHAPE OR FORM CONTRADICT EXTRA ECCLESIAM NULLA SALUS.

Note: Please, in the future, make more sense.

And I’ve read all your responses. Your just repeating yourself because your out of arguments.

 

[SemperFidelis]

First of all, this passage from Mystici Corporis has been incorrectly translated by many
to further weaken and to pervert the actual words of Pius XII. The phrase (ab eo statu se
eripere studeant, in quo de sempiterna cuiusque propria salute securi esse non possunt) which is correctly translated as “…extricate themselves from that condition in which they cannot
be secure about their own eternal salvation,” has been mistranslated as “look to
withdrawing from that state in which they cannot be sure of their salvation.”622 This
mistranslation gives the clear impression that non‐Catholics have an outside chance at
gaining salvation where they are.

 It’s very interesting that even a heretical defender of Protocol 122/49, Msgr. Fenton,

admits that “sure” is a seriously misleading translation.

Msgr. Joseph Clifford Fenton, The Catholic Church and Salvation, 1958, p. 88:
“Many of the published translations of the Mystici Corporis Christi employ the
expression ‘in which they cannot be sure of their salvation’ in rendering this
clause into English. This terminology is both inexact and seriously
misleading.”623

 Fenton goes on to point out that the mistranslation gives the impression that

Catholics can be sure of their salvation, which is a heresy condemned by the Council of
Trent (Trent, Sess. 6, Chap. 9). (Outside the Catholic Church there is Absolutely No Salvation p.250-51; Bro. Peter Dimond O.S.B.)

For the last time, it wouldn’t just take an ex cathedra statement to make a Pope a formal heretic. If that was the case Bl. John XXIII onward would have to be real Popes, as they’ve made no infallible statements. According to the ACTUAL definition of formal heretic, and knowing what I know about Feeneyites, then Popes Bl. Pius IX, St. Pius X, Benedict XV, and Ven. Pius XII would ALL HAVE TO BE ANTI-POPES. The fact that the Dimond “brothers” don’t “think” so, is telling.

From now on I will only be responding to your replies if you can bring up something Infallible to argue your opinion. If you can I will humbly accept BOD, BOB, and Invincible Ignorance.

I have. It’s called the Ordinary Magisterium. Clearly you and the rest of the Feeneyites are in denial about this. Trent is also infallible, and you clearly deny that it says what it in fact says. The Church has spoken on this issue for centuries. Get out of la-la-land, the Church is not Feeneyite.

 

[n8pzo]

Hmmm…they are not a registered legal entity or not for profit corporation in Fillmore, NY…interesting. I wonder if the IRS knows they are collecting donations?

They also are not affiliated with the Order of St. Benedict or a Catholic diocese.

Does anyone have a picture of this monastery? or is it just a trailer on the Dimond family farm?

How are these guys any different from Pope Michael in his mom’s basement?

So, which one or you Peter or Michael???

What’s the matter, are you upset that you can’t refute any of the MHFM’s claims so you have to resort to petty calumny.
I am neither Peter nor Michael, nor am I affiliated with them. They are too busy to bother with ridiculous claims like the ones leveled against them on these forums. They are ever trying to save souls.
I like to defend truth in my spare time, that’s the only reason I’m here. Saving souls is the most important type of Charity.
Thanks

 

[Sure]

What’s the matter, are you upset that you can’t refute any of the MHFM’s claims so you have to resort to petty calumny.
I am neither Peter nor Michael, nor am I affiliated with them. They are too busy to bother with ridiculous claims like the ones leveled against them on these forums. They are ever trying to save souls.
I like to defend truth in my spare time, that’s the only reason I’m here. Saving souls is the most important type of Charity.
Thanks

I don’t need to refute them just like I don’t need to refute people who claim they are aliens or that a secret world government is monitering our brainwaves (got your tinfoil hat?). As Semper Fidelis has aptly demonstrated they utterly lack consistency and either willfully or (even more comically) accidently misread important church documents.

One other thing, if they wanted to look credible they should rebuild their website because right now the layout look like the lunatic ravings of a madman…of course, maybe that’s the look they’re going for, I don’t know.

 

[Jo_Benedict]

Note:

This thread is closed. Thanks to all who participated in the discussion.