Movie about Islam

  • Thread starter Thread starter bpbasilphx
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
This DVD was apparently also distributed in local weekly newspapers–my parents don’t subscribe to the N&O but I saw last night it came in the Cary News.

So now I have a copy. (They’re out of town and I’m watching the house.)

It looks just like an advertisement. 🤷

Is there any such thing as “radical islam?”
You tell us.


I think someone made it up.
Someone Muslim?
 
Sister Amy,

I was not aware that porn was becomming a problem over there. I am not shocked, but I am a little surprised. Isn’t that a major violation of Islam?

Radical Islam is a term coined in the west. There is not a good way to explain what these people are. We can call them Islamic extremests, Fundamentalist Muslims, or just plain evil. Members of al Quida and that guy who attempted the first world trade center bombing preach this junk.
 
**Hello,

There is no such thing as radical islam, but people who are going against Islam’s message make people think there is something wrong with the religion. But in fact, the people who they think are representing Islam are actually hurting our reputations as Muslims. Islam will never be radical and it will never be lacking. The people can either obey it or not.

People make any thing up as we see all over the news/media. Lies, stereotypes are rampant…propaganda is spreading like wild fires and people who hear this stuff take it as fact…even when Muslims tell them otherwise…media really has a problem.
Most of the populations have no idea of what the western world is really like. Most of their knowledge comes from propaganda that is fed to them from the political and religious establishment.
Actually, this is only half true. People do have brains to see the tv and the news. I guess that cnn asia is not seen in the states…trust me, it isn’t…and I have seen both…many things are not said as to what is said over here. Goes both ways in the media mayhem world.

America is here in UAE…everywhere you go it is indeed America. Have you ever been outside America and visited over here? Or perhaps these are just more things that are seconded guessed?

americanrevert (time for iftar!)

**
 
Why don’t you find me someone who claims to be preaching “radical Islam.” Or is that just a term made up in the West? What is the Arabic equivalent, do you reckon?
Some aren’t preaching it anymore, since they are in jail.

Abu Hamza al-Masri comes to mind.

Abdul Rahman Al-Sudais is the leading imam at the Grand Mosque in Mecca.

They just claim it to be “Islam”. It’s the rest of the free world that calls them “radical”.
 
Sister Amy,

I was not aware that porn was becomming a problem over there. I am not shocked, but I am a little surprised. Isn’t that a major violation of Islam?
Yes, it is. Porn is addictive though and even when people know it’s bad and want to stop they have a difficult time stopping. It’s really psychological.
Radical Islam is a term coined in the west. There is not a good way to explain what these people are. We can call them Islamic extremests, Fundamentalist Muslims, or just plain evil. Members of al Quida and that guy who attempted the first world trade center bombing preach this junk.
I’m taking a class on terrorism right now actually and in discussions with other students I’ve began to say that radical islam is just a myth. I’m not somebody who has no knowledge of Islam, or no experience with Muslims. To the contrary, I attend the mosque regularly, and I mean several times a week.

So if anyone should know what radical Islam is… then shouldn’t I know?

If you say extremist–how can someone be an Islamic extremist when Islam always teaches moderation?

If you say fundamentalist–how can a Muslim not be a fundamentalist when choosing to follow Islam? How can you follow Islam without fundamentals?

If you say evil–how can a person who is Muslim preach evil when they are commanded by the Qur’an to command to the good and forbid the evil?

And how do you really know what anyone is preaching? Do we have spies sitting in the study circles of Al-Qaida? Do they have gatherings to acquire knowledge that we can observe?

I don’t say this flippantly, I really want you to know that. And I think someone will quote me on this statement and call me a liar or worse, but I’m going to say this anyway. I really think that someone is just trying to make out Muslims to be bad guys without any real reason. And that even some Muslims are falling for it. I don’t think there is any such thing as “radical Islam” or “Islamic extremists.” But I do think that someone is benefiting from creating an enemy, and is trying very hard to label it ‘Islam.’
 
Why don’t you find me someone who claims to be preaching “radical Islam.”
No one claims to be preacing “radical Islam.” Just “Islam.”

that’s the problem.
Or is that just a term made up in the West?
That’s our (the Christians/West/non-Muslims) question.
What is the Arabic equivalent, do you reckon?
تطرف

راديكالية
(that’s a borrowing, obviously).

Traditionally غلو
 
Some aren’t preaching it anymore, since they are in jail.

Abu Hamza al-Masri comes to mind.

Abdul Rahman Al-Sudais is the leading imam at the Grand Mosque in Mecca.

They just claim it to be “Islam”. It’s the rest of the free world that calls them “radical”.
Imam Sudais???

Seriously?
 
have YOU seen the movie? if so, how long is it? i watched the trailer.
i hope it is current and not a movie made right after 9/11. what can you tell me about it?


**I first heard about this movie a year or two ago.

I have seen the trailer and excerpts. I have not been able to afford the movie, and I don’t want to buy a one-time view, hence I have not seen it.

Yet.**
 
Some aren’t preaching it anymore, since they are in jail.

Abu Hamza al-Masri comes to mind.

Abdul Rahman Al-Sudais is the leading imam at the Grand Mosque in Mecca.

They just claim it to be “Islam”. It’s the rest of the free world that calls them “radical”.
“Rest?” You mean “the Free Word.”
 
Yes, it is. Porn is addictive though and even when people know it’s bad and want to stop they have a difficult time stopping. It’s really psychological.

I’m taking a class on terrorism right now actually and in discussions with other students I’ve began to say that radical islam is just a myth. I’m not somebody who has no knowledge of Islam, or no experience with Muslims. To the contrary, I attend the mosque regularly, and I mean several times a week.

So if anyone should know what radical Islam is… then shouldn’t I know?

If you say extremist–how can someone be an Islamic extremist when Islam always teaches moderation?

If you say fundamentalist–how can a Muslim not be a fundamentalist when choosing to follow Islam? How can you follow Islam without fundamentals?

If you say evil–how can a person who is Muslim preach evil when they are commanded by the Qur’an to command to the good and forbid the evil?

And how do you really know what anyone is preaching? Do we have spies sitting in the study circles of Al-Qaida? Do they have gatherings to acquire knowledge that we can observe?

I don’t say this flippantly, I really want you to know that. And I think someone will quote me on this statement and call me a liar or worse, but I’m going to say this anyway. I really think that someone is just trying to make out Muslims to be bad guys without any real reason. And that even some Muslims are falling for it. I don’t think there is any such thing as “radical Islam” or “Islamic extremists.” But I do think that someone is benefiting from creating an enemy, and is trying very hard to label it ‘Islam.’
Good grief!

Agitprop much? Yes, there certainly are strains of “Islamic extremism”, as old as Islam. Not that Islam is unique, in that respect, many people have held hateful or selfish views and wrapped it in the veil of faith.

Muslims are not monolithic in their beliefs. The average Muslims doesn’t view the world as a bin Laden or Qutb does.

“Radical Islam” exists, and to deny it is willfully ignorant.
 
Imam Sudais???

Seriously?
WND isn’t the best source, but there is a reason the evil Canadians denied him a passport.
Last April, before 2 million followers, al-Sudais, the chief cleric of the Grand Mosque in Mecca, prayed to God to “terminate” the Jews whom he called “the scum of humanity, the rats of the world, prophet killers … pigs and monkeys.”
Al-Sudais also urged Arabs and Muslims to abandon peace initiatives with Israel.
“We must say farewell to peace initiatives with these people [Jews],” he told worshippers at the Grand Mosque in Mecca.
The sheikh has also characterized Jews as “evil,” “evil forefathers,” a “continuum of deceit,” and full of “tyranny” and “treachery.”
worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=36482
 
Fair questions.
Yes, it is. Porn is addictive though and even when people know it’s bad and want to stop they have a difficult time stopping. It’s really psychological.
Very True! Porn and its addiction is insidious.
I’m taking a class on terrorism right now actually and in discussions with other students I’ve began to say that radical islam is just a myth. I’m not somebody who has no knowledge of Islam, or no experience with Muslims. To the contrary, I attend the mosque regularly, and I mean several times a week.
Myth may be the wrong word for it. Overblown may be more correct. As I watch a news story about an Embassy bombing in Yeman.
So if anyone should know what radical Islam is… then shouldn’t I know?
Maybe not. First, you are in America, and we have a very small percentage of the vocal ones. Second, you seem to be the kind of person who does not tolerate hate. I doubt that you would be attracted to those kinds of people, or that you would stay around them for long. You also seem smarter than to fall for the lines they use.
If you say extremist–how can someone be an Islamic extremist when Islam always teaches moderation?
The extreme nature is in how they interpret the faith. They say that non-Muslims should either convert or be enslaved. They hold that if it is not Islam, it is evil by its nature. They will ignore anything to the contrary.
If you say fundamentalist–how can a Muslim not be a fundamentalist when choosing to follow Islam? How can you follow Islam without fundamentals?
The term is used here in the same way it is about Christianity. It is not about following the fundamentals, it is about defining them in such a way as to force a world view.
If you say evil–how can a person who is Muslim preach evil when they are commanded by the Qur’an to command to the good and forbid the evil?
The claim jihad allows them to kill women, children, innocent lives. They allow women to be killed for not covering or for trying to run out of a burning school. They beat a girl who was raped for being alone with a boy. Tell me, is this evil or good? Is this Islam?
And how do you really know what anyone is preaching? Do we have spies sitting in the study circles of Al-Qaida? Do they have gatherings to acquire knowledge that we can observe?
Sometimes. More common, they tape it for distribution.
I don’t say this flippantly, I really want you to know that. And I think someone will quote me on this statement and call me a liar or worse, but I’m going to say this anyway. I really think that someone is just trying to make out Muslims to be bad guys without any real reason. And that even some Muslims are falling for it. I don’t think there is any such thing as “radical Islam” or “Islamic extremists.” But I do think that someone is benefiting from creating an enemy, and is trying very hard to label it ‘Islam.’
I see your point. What you cannot deny is that there are Muslims who want me to change to be like them. This is called compulsion. They hold that if logic cannot convert me, the gun can. Yes, it is more political than religious, but Islam is both. These people want to destroy the West. There is no doubt about it. DO you think that it was Jews and Christians who destroyed the World Trade Center? Or just blew up the Embassy in Yemen? I do not hold that these are rank and file Muslims, but they are Muslims none the less.
 
Good grief!

Agitprop much? Yes, there certainly are strains of “Islamic extremism”, as old as Islam. Not that Islam is unique, in that respect, many people have held hateful or selfish views and wrapped it in the veil of faith.

Muslims are not monolithic in their beliefs. The average Muslims doesn’t view the world as a bin Laden or Qutb does.

“Radical Islam” exists, and to deny it is willfully ignorant.
Agitprop? Had to look that one up. For the uninitiated, like myself:

agitprop - agitation and propaganda, esp. for the cause of communism; an agency or department, as of a government, that directs and coordinates agitation and propaganda.

Sounds very Orwellian. I thought I’d be called a liar or worse and you called me an agitpropist… ookay. hehe.

I still don’t understand the concept of “Islamic extremism.” If something is extreme, it’s not Islam. And for my part, I’m not sure what these teachings are which you or anyone considers to be extreme, evil, radical, or whatever.

But I have noticed that frankly, somebody wants to attack Islam. And they are using all means at their disposal. When someone says Islam to you, what first comes to your mind? Probably terrorism or violence, thanks to the use of this term “radical Islam” which is still, in my opinion, an unproven myth.
 
Yes, it is. Porn is addictive though and even when people know it’s bad and want to stop they have a difficult time stopping. It’s really psychological.

I’m taking a class on terrorism right now actually and in discussions with other students I’ve began to say that radical islam is just a myth.
So the picture is doctored?

I’m not somebody who has no knowledge of Islam, or no experience with Muslims. To the contrary, I attend the mosque regularly, and I mean several times a week.
So if anyone should know what radical Islam is… then shouldn’t I know?
Yes, you should.
If you say extremist–how can someone be an Islamic extremist when Islam always teaches moderation?
Evidently it does. Sorry, Muslim apologists always make the claim that there are no clergy in Islam and no pope, etc. (not true, but that would be a digression). So whatever Muslim claims to represent Islam, as Usamah b. Ladin et alia, we have to take him at their word.

If you can’t or won’t distinguish, then you will be lumped with them.
If you say fundamentalist–how can a Muslim not be a fundamentalist when choosing to follow Islam? How can you follow Islam without fundamentals?
That a question you Muslims have to answer. We will respond accordingly.
If you say evil–how can a person who is Muslim preach evil when they are commanded by the Qur’an to command to the good and forbid the evil?
Ah, the devil is in the details. Most find forcing your son to divorce his wife so you can marry him, well…
And how do you really know what anyone is preaching? Do we have spies sitting in the study circles of Al-Qaida? Do they have gatherings to acquire knowledge that we can observe?
Do you get al-Jazirah? (btw, the station is NOT as anti-American as made out, it is NOT the mouthpiece of al-Qaidah, and it often gives the Christians a visible part in Arab media).
I don’t say this flippantly, I really want you to know that. And I think someone will quote me on this statement and call me a liar or worse, but I’m going to say this anyway. I really think that someone is just trying to make out Muslims to be bad guys without any real reason.

And that even some Muslims are falling for it. I don’t think there is any such thing as “radical Islam” or “Islamic extremists.”
So you all are all one happy family. We’ll respond accordingly.
But I do think that someone is benefiting from creating an enemy, and is trying very hard to label it ‘Islam.’
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/a/af/Bin_laden_12_27a.jpg
 
Agitprop? Had to look that one up. For the uninitiated, like myself:

agitprop - agitation and propaganda, esp. for the cause of communism; an agency or department, as of a government, that directs and coordinates agitation and propaganda.

Sounds very Orwellian. I thought I’d be called a liar or worse and you called me an agitpropist… ookay. hehe.

I still don’t understand the concept of “Islamic extremism.” If something is extreme, it’s not Islam. And for my part, I’m not sure what these teachings are which you or anyone considers to be extreme, evil, radical, or whatever.

But I have noticed that frankly, somebody wants to attack Islam. And they are using all means at their disposal. When someone says Islam to you, what first comes to your mind? Probably terrorism or violence, thanks to the use of this term “radical Islam” which is still, in my opinion, an unproven myth.
That’s a huge assumption on your part. You skipped over my mention of Abu Hamza and went straight to Al-Sudais.

Tell me, are Hamza’s sermon’s “extreme”? Do they represent Islam in general, or is he a person who has interpreted it to mean something most don’t believe it to, and has taken to an “extreme” level?

I believe the latter.

“Radical Islam” isn’t a myth. Islamic Terrorism is a testament to that fact. Whether you like it or not (their form) of Islam is the motivation in a good deal of these attacks.
 
Fair questions.

Very True! Porn and its addiction is insidious.

Myth may be the wrong word for it. Overblown may be more correct. As I watch a news story about an Embassy bombing in Yeman.

Maybe not. First, you are in America, and we have a very small percentage of the vocal ones. Second, you seem to be the kind of person who does not tolerate hate. I doubt that you would be attracted to those kinds of people, or that you would stay around them for long. You also seem smarter than to fall for the lines they use.

The extreme nature is in how they interpret the faith. They say that non-Muslims should either convert or be enslaved. They hold that if it is not Islam, it is evil by its nature. They will ignore anything to the contrary.

The term is used here in the same way it is about Christianity. It is not about following the fundamentals, it is about defining them in such a way as to force a world view.

The claim jihad allows them to kill women, children, innocent lives. They allow women to be killed for not covering or for trying to run out of a burning school. They beat a girl who was raped for being alone with a boy. Tell me, is this evil or good? Is this Islam?

Sometimes. More common, they tape it for distribution.

I see your point. What you cannot deny is that there are Muslims who want me to change to be like them. This is called compulsion. They hold that if logic cannot convert me, the gun can. Yes, it is more political than religious, but Islam is both. These people want to destroy the West. There is no doubt about it. DO you think that it was Jews and Christians who destroyed the World Trade Center? Or just blew up the Embassy in Yemen? I do not hold that these are rank and file Muslims, but they are Muslims none the less.
A couple of points. I’ve never heard Muslims advocate the things you claim. I’m listening. I’m listening to teachers from Saudi Arabia, I’m listening to a student of Imam Sudais for example, but also students of many other scholars in KSA. So with my ear there shouldn’t I be hearing these things? And I’m not.

That non-Muslims should convert or be enslaved? I have absolutely never heard a Muslim advocate that. Never.

That anything outside of Islam is evil? Okay I have heard a scholar say that women can’t ride dirt bikes and I thought that was kind of wacky… lol. In Islam (i.e., Shari’ah) everything fits in to 5 categories. Obligatory, recommended, permissible, disliked, and forbidden. There is no category called “evil.” And all things are considered to be permissible unless there is proof that they are disliked or forbidden. So in general things aren’t evil just for not being “in Islam.”

I have never seen any proof that if a woman doesn’t cover she should be killed. And in Islam, something like that would require proof. But what I do see, quite often, is people sensationalizing certain events, tying them to Islam, calling the players involved by different labels. And it’s fundamentally unfair to view these situations from only one side and make assumptions. Some things in Islam are forbidden–absolutely forbidden–but in life or death situations it becomes not just permissible, but even obligatory to do them. To preserve life. That is Islam.

But what you see taped isn’t Islam. It’s politics. And to say Islam is more politics than religion shows a misunderstanding of Islam at a fundamental level, and a misunderstanding of global affairs today, I think.

And lastly–it is not compulsion to just want someone to convert. I’m sure many people on this forum would like me to become a Catholic. But they do not compel me to do so. There is no compulsion. And as everyone on this board should have read by now, ‘there is no compulsion in religion’ is explicit in the Qur’an. And if anyone thinks he can kill people for not converting, and call it jihad, then he does not understand jihad and he doesn’t understand the Qur’an. It’s that simple.
 
If WND isn’t the best source (and it’s a terrible source) then find me a better one. One that’s actually believable.
No quotes, specifically, but he was denied entry into pretty tolerant Canada:

antisemitism.org.il/eng/events/9162/Canada_%E2%80%93_A_Saudi_Imam_is_Banned_From_Entering_the_Country

This appears to be a translation of his sermons, and is an Islamic site:
Read the history to know that yesterday’s Jews are evil predecessors and today’s Jews are worse successors. They an ingrate people, they altered God’s words, worshipped calf, killed Messengers and denied their Messages. They are exiled people and the worst of mankind. Allaah cursed them and cast His wrath upon them. He turned some of them to monkeys and pigs and worshippers of creatures. They are worst in position and are astray from the right path.
History of Jews is full of deception, trickery, rebellion, oppression, evil and corruption. They always seek to cause mischief on the earth and Allaah loves not the mischief-makers. They even insulted Allaah. The Quraan says,
“The Jews say: ‘Allaah’s Hand is tied up (i.e. He does not give and spend of His Bounty). Be their hands tied up and be they accursed for what they uttered.’”…

Entire sermon is long, and of the same tone. I would also again mention this is an Islamic site.
Not exactly what I would call the view of the “average Muslim”.

Other quotes from news sources:
MR. RUSSERT: But it went on and on, and you mention imams in Saudi Arabia. This is what a top Saudi Arabian religious leader said, using inflammatory anti-Semitic rhetoric – “Pray to Allah to terminate Jews. Urge all Muslims to shun peace with Israel.” Shaikh Abdelrahman al-Sudais, one of the top imams in Saudi Arabia, called on Muslims to say farewell to peace initiatives with these people, Jews. He prayed to the Muslim God to terminate the Jews, whom he called the scum of humanity, rats of the world, prophet killers, pigs and monkeys.
MR. AL-JUBEIR: That’s also incorrect. And he was reprimanded for this.
saudiembassy.net/2003News/Statements/TransDetail.asp?cIndex=190

From the Saudi Embassy site, no less.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top