D
DCD
Guest
I was wondering if anyone had any thoughts on this verse? And why or what he is trying to tell us?
Peace,
David
Peace,
David
- Status
Z
zachh
Guest
Zechariah 9:9:
It was a fulfillment of that prophecy.
W
water
Guest
Jesus teaches us to be humility and to bring peace among ourselves.
D
DCD
Guest
I’m still confused as to why he would refer back to Zec.9:10 when that text is still a future event. Is that correct?
Peace,
David
Peace,
David
F
Fidelis
Guest
If by “a future event” you mean Zech 9:10 refers to the End Times, then, no, that is not correct. The prophecies of the Old Testament refer primarily a) the restoration of Israel after the Babylonian Exile and b) the coming of the Messiah, which was fulfilled in Jesus Christ.
To try to definitively project them into **our **future is a childish exercise in vanity and futility, one often practised in the Protestant error of Dispensationalism, popularized by Hal Lindsay, Tim Lahaye and other doomsday prophets of the “Left Behind” ilk.
Maybe people are just putting the wrong verse in.
D
DCD
Guest
I thought Mt.21:2-5 was a reference to Zec.9:9-10. if not I stand corrected. I am not interested in the future events what I am trying to discern is what if any are the literary rules for refrencing a OT passage?
Peace,
David
Peace,
David
L
Liberian
Guest
DCD,
In Matthew 21:2-5, Jesus is instructing His disciples to go get a donkey from a particular spot. Jesus Himself is not quoting Zechariah, Matthew (writing after the fact) is. Matthew is pointing out that by His actions, Jesus was fulfilling Zechariah’s prophecy.
Dorothy L. Sayers, in her play cycle Man Born to be King, speculates–and I emphasize that this is speculation–that a Jewish revolutionary group was offering to hitch their armed might to Jesus. In her play, she has the Baruch the Zealot (the leader of the revolutionaries) dictating a message to Jesus: “In the stable of Zimri, at the going-up into the City, is a war-horse saddled and ready. Set yourself upon him, and you shall ride into Jerusalem with a thousand spears behind you. But if you refuse, then take the ***'s colt that is tied at the vineyard door, and Baruch will bide his time till a bolder Messiah come. Say only: The Master has need of him, and the beast is at your service.”
I have heard that during World War I a British general (Allenby, I think) conquered that part of the Middle East from the Ottoman Empire. He cabled headquarters asking for permission to enter the Old City of Jerusalem on a horse. They responded “A Greater One than you has ridden in on a donkey. You can walk.”
In Matthew 21:2-5, Jesus is instructing His disciples to go get a donkey from a particular spot. Jesus Himself is not quoting Zechariah, Matthew (writing after the fact) is. Matthew is pointing out that by His actions, Jesus was fulfilling Zechariah’s prophecy.
Dorothy L. Sayers, in her play cycle Man Born to be King, speculates–and I emphasize that this is speculation–that a Jewish revolutionary group was offering to hitch their armed might to Jesus. In her play, she has the Baruch the Zealot (the leader of the revolutionaries) dictating a message to Jesus: “In the stable of Zimri, at the going-up into the City, is a war-horse saddled and ready. Set yourself upon him, and you shall ride into Jerusalem with a thousand spears behind you. But if you refuse, then take the ***'s colt that is tied at the vineyard door, and Baruch will bide his time till a bolder Messiah come. Say only: The Master has need of him, and the beast is at your service.”
I have heard that during World War I a British general (Allenby, I think) conquered that part of the Middle East from the Ottoman Empire. He cabled headquarters asking for permission to enter the Old City of Jerusalem on a horse. They responded “A Greater One than you has ridden in on a donkey. You can walk.”
- Liberian
R
runandsew
Guest
there are two senses of scripture, the literal and the spirtual.
The literal sense is what the author at that time was trying to say.
The spirtual sense is broken into three parts
The literal sense is what the author at that time was trying to say.
The spirtual sense is broken into three parts
- anagogical - refers to the end times or heaven
- allegorical - looks forwards to Jesus
- moral - how we apply it in our lifes
D
DCD
Guest
Liberian,
Are you saying that we are to make a distinction between Jesus and Matthew in scripture in regards to interpretation? Take this verse for instance Mt. 27:46. In order to understand this verse we have to go back and read all of Psalm 22 in order to understand Christ in Mt. 27:46. So I am still confused why I do not have to do the same in Mt.21:2-5. I am sorry for not being clear. Thanks for the help.
Peace,
David
Are you saying that we are to make a distinction between Jesus and Matthew in scripture in regards to interpretation? Take this verse for instance Mt. 27:46. In order to understand this verse we have to go back and read all of Psalm 22 in order to understand Christ in Mt. 27:46. So I am still confused why I do not have to do the same in Mt.21:2-5. I am sorry for not being clear. Thanks for the help.
Peace,
David
L
Liberian
Guest
David,
I’m not completely clear as to what you are asking. Certainly we need to recognize that Jesus did not write Matthew’s Gospel; Matthew did. And Matthew provided some explanatory notes. (Mark does the same thing in Mark 13:14 with the brief parenthesis “let the reader understand.”) The difference between Matthew 21:4-5 and Matthew 27:46 is that the latter verse records Jesus’ actual words while the former verses do not.
I’m not completely clear as to what you are asking. Certainly we need to recognize that Jesus did not write Matthew’s Gospel; Matthew did. And Matthew provided some explanatory notes. (Mark does the same thing in Mark 13:14 with the brief parenthesis “let the reader understand.”) The difference between Matthew 21:4-5 and Matthew 27:46 is that the latter verse records Jesus’ actual words while the former verses do not.
- Liberian
T
TOME
Guest
DCD,
I think what you are asking about is the use of “TYPE” as found in the scriptures. “Type” (and this is a very simple explanation bordering on the simplistic) is a way of seeing how a person or event prefigures something that happens later.
One example, Melchizedek is seen as a TYPE prefiguring Christ and the Eucharist. Another, is what has been discussed concerning Mt 21 and Jesus’ entry into Jerusalem where we find prefirgures this event in Isa 62:11 and Zech 9:9.
When considering the use of this literary devise (type) is it very important to remember several things among which are:
(1) the Gospels are post resurrectional documents (2) the Apostolic Church in Her Post Resurrection experience of Christ Jesus and filled with the Holy Spirit understood the workings of God in the history of man and that this Salvation History was found in the Scriptures. Therefore, the Apostles and later the Evangelist were able to see how God working throughout human history and in a unique way through the Hebrew/Jewish people could use people and events that were ultimately pointing to the Christ event (Jesus’ Ministry,Passion, Death and Resurrection) and expressed this understanding in the scriptures of the NT.
Later, the Church,under the guidance of the Holy Spirit and through the teachings of the Fathers of the Church, was able to deepen Her understanding and connections of what happened in the life and ministry of Christ Jesus and the OT.
Hopefully I haven’t confused things so I would stroongly suggest that you do some more reading on the literary use of “TYPE” in the study of scriptures.
I think what you are asking about is the use of “TYPE” as found in the scriptures. “Type” (and this is a very simple explanation bordering on the simplistic) is a way of seeing how a person or event prefigures something that happens later.
One example, Melchizedek is seen as a TYPE prefiguring Christ and the Eucharist. Another, is what has been discussed concerning Mt 21 and Jesus’ entry into Jerusalem where we find prefirgures this event in Isa 62:11 and Zech 9:9.
When considering the use of this literary devise (type) is it very important to remember several things among which are:
(1) the Gospels are post resurrectional documents (2) the Apostolic Church in Her Post Resurrection experience of Christ Jesus and filled with the Holy Spirit understood the workings of God in the history of man and that this Salvation History was found in the Scriptures. Therefore, the Apostles and later the Evangelist were able to see how God working throughout human history and in a unique way through the Hebrew/Jewish people could use people and events that were ultimately pointing to the Christ event (Jesus’ Ministry,Passion, Death and Resurrection) and expressed this understanding in the scriptures of the NT.
Later, the Church,under the guidance of the Holy Spirit and through the teachings of the Fathers of the Church, was able to deepen Her understanding and connections of what happened in the life and ministry of Christ Jesus and the OT.
Hopefully I haven’t confused things so I would stroongly suggest that you do some more reading on the literary use of “TYPE” in the study of scriptures.
- Status