Mt 6:7-8: The Prayers of Pagans

[Medic_Mark]

“In praying, do not babble like the pagans, who think that they will be heard because of their many words. Do not be like them. Your Father knows what you need before you ask him.”

I have mentioned on here before that there are times I feel ashamed, perhaps guilty, by adopting Catholic practice. For instance, the Rosary and the Divine Chaplet. It was common to hear (in my Baptist days) that repetitious Hail Mary’s and Our Father’s were not only superfluous, but akin to the babbling words of the pagan.

Are there any known examples of the types of babbling prayers that the pagans of Jesus’ day offered up to their gods? How does a seasoned Catholic respond to this protestant claim?

 

[Pax]

The following is taken from an article at catholic.com.

Q: A friend of mine says that in Matthew 6:7, Jesus condemns repetitious prayers, which proves that it is wrong to pray the rosary. How do I respond?

A: Your friend read the passage a little too quickly. Jesus isn’t condemning repetition in prayer; he’s condemning vain prayer. When Jesus said, “Do not babble like the pagans, who think that they will be heard because of their many words” (Matthew 6:7, NAB), he was referring to a belief of the pagans that a god would not listen to your prayer unless you used his correct title, and the title would change every day. Thus, the pagans would begin their prayer with every title they could think of in order to make sure their prayers would be heard (e.g., “O Great Zeus, O Master of Olympia, O Great Father Zeus. . . .”) Jesus tells us this is vain because pagan gods don’t exist, and when we pray to God he hears all our prayers. We don’t have to worry about getting the right title.

In fact, Scripture gives us many examples of repetitive prayer. For example, in Matthew 26:36–46, Jesus prayed the same prayer three times. In Revelation 4:8, four living creatures are around and within the throne, and day and night they do not cease to say, “Holy, holy, holy, is the Lord God Almighty.” And then there’s the tax collector in Luke 18:9–14 who is beating his breast repeatedly and praying, “God, be merciful to me, a sinner!” And let’s not forget Luke 11:1–4, where Jesus tells us how to pray: He gives us the Lord’s Prayer. Since most Christians pray the Lord’s Prayer from time to time, they are all “guilty” of repetitious prayer. But it is not vain prayer—after all, we merely are doing as Jesus taught us.

Any prayer can be prayed in vain. What makes a prayer efficacious is the attitude of the heart (cf. CCC 2559). And sadly, “If our heart is far from God, the words of prayer are in vain” (CCC 2562; cf. Matt. 15:8–9).

You can find a series of articles that touch on this subject here:

google.com/cse?cx=008187825485874300314%3A1bfkl0u3vji&ie=UTF-8&q=repetitious+prayer&sa=Search

God bless.

 

[Cat_Herder]

[BIBLEDRB]Psalm 135[/BIBLEDRB]

(Ps 136 in most Bibles)

 

[Medic_Mark]

Thanks guys. Those are very satisfying answers to me. I did not know that about the titles.

 

[ConstantineTG]

I think one of the defenses on repetitious prayers is the parable of the corrupt judge. If a corrupt judge would give in to one who would over-and-over petition him for justice, how much more would the just Father in heaven hear the prayers of those who would petition him over and over?

Another good explanation I found is in the Jesus Prayer used by the Byzantines. There are three levels of the Jesus prayers, from praying with the lips, praying with the mind, and praying with the heart. Basically repeating the prayer over and over again moves the prayer from something you recite, to something you pray in your conciousness, to something you live, you yourself become the prayer. I think it applies in many ways to other repeated prayers. A well composed prayer is not only something that is directed towards God, its also directed towards self. As we say the prayer over and over again, we gain appreciation of the words and that we live what we pray. For example, praying “Lord have mercy,” isn’t only asking God for forgiveness, but also making ourselves realize how sinful we are.

 

[patrick457]

Are there any known examples of the types of babbling prayers that the pagans of Jesus’ day offered up to their gods?

Well, in those days many people in the Greco-Roman world often used the names of gods (any god apparently counts - even YHWH and the angels, and later Jesus, are no exception), made-up gibberish, fragments of words and phrases (often in various languages), strings of vowels and somesuch in their prayers and incantations, based on surviving examples. The well-known Ephesia Grammata is one example of a mantra-like ‘meaningless word’.

A collection of texts known as the Greek Magical Papyri, written mostly in Ancient Greek (but also in other languages such asCoptic, Demotic Egyptian, etc.) found in the deserts of Egypt, cast light in some way on the magico-religious syncretistic world of Greco-Roman Egypt and the surrounding area. There is one formula for the preparation of an amulet that specifically goes like:

After driving out the demon, hang around N. an amulet, which the patient puts on after the expulsion of the demon, with these things written on a tin metal leaf: BOR PHOR PHORBA PHOR PHORBA BES CHARIN BAUBA TE PHOR BORPHORBA PHORBABOR BAPHORBA PHABRAIE PHORBA PHARBA PHORPHOR PHORBA BOBORBORBA PAMPHORBA PHORPHOR PHORBA, protect N.

Another recipe contains more gibberish. If you’ll look closely, one of the incantations contains the names Adonaie (=Adonai), Iakob (=Jacob) and Iao (=Yahweh?), which you should be familiar with. As I’ve mentioned, syncretism is rather common in the ancient world, and some of these ‘magicians’ who devised these formulas did not hesitate to borrow from different cultures, even the Jewish one.

Take a magnetic stone which is breathing and engrave Aphrodite sitting astride Psyche and with her left hand holding on her hair bound in curls. And above her head: "ACHMAGE RARPEPSEI"; and below Aphrodite and Psyche engrave Eros standi ng on the vault of heaven, holding a blazing torch and burning Psyche. And below Eros these names: “ACHAPA ADONAIE BASMA CHARAKO IAKOB IAO E PHARPHAREI.” On the other side of the stone engrave Psyche and Eros embracing one another and beneath Eros’s feet these letters: “SSSSSSSS,” and beneath Psyche’s feet: “EEEEEEEE.” Use the stone, when it has been engraved and consecrated, like this: put it under your tongue and turn it to what you wish and say this spell:

It then goes on to give a rather lengthy spell, also replete with gibberish.

 

[patrick457]

Another example which is more explicit in its borrowing from Judaism is a curse which goes:

I invoke you daimonion spirit who lies here, by the holy name AOTH ABAOTH, the god of Abraham and IAO, the god of Jacob, IAO AOTH ABAOTH, god of Israma, hear the honored, dreadful and great name, go away to Urbanus, to whom Urbana gave birth, and bring him to Domitiana, to whom Candida gave birth, [so that] loving, frantic, and sleepless with love and desire for her, he may beg her to return to his house and become his wife.
I invoke you, the great god, eternal and more than eternal, almighty and exalted above the exalted ones. I invoke you, who created the heaven and the sea.
I invoke you, who set aside the righteous.
I invoke you, who divided the staff in the sea, to bring Urbanus, to whom Urbana gave birth, and united him with Domitiana, to whom Candida gave birth, loving, tormented, and sleepless with desire and love for her, so that he may take her into his house as his wife.
I invoke you, who made the mule unable to bear offspring.
I invoke you, who separated light from darkness.
I invoke you, who crushes rocks.
I invoke you, who breaks apart mountains.
I invoke you, who hardened the earth on its foundations.
I invoke you, by the holy name which is not spoken.
…I will mention it by a word with the same numerical equivalent and the daimones will be awakened, startled, terrified, to bring Urbanus, to whom Urbana gave birth, and unite him with Domitiana, to whom Candida gave birth, loving and begging for her. Now! Quickly!
I invoke you, who made the heavenly lights and stars by the command of your voice, so that they should shine on all men.
I invoke you, who shook the entire world, who breaks the back of mountains and casts them up out of the water, who causes the whole earth to tremble and then renews all its inhabitants.
I invoke you, who made signs in the heaven, on earth and on the sea, to bring Urbanus, to whom Urbana gave birth, and unite him as husband with Domitiana, to whom Candida gave birth, loving her, sleepless with desire for her, begging for her, and asking that she return to his house and become his wife.
I invoke you, great, everlasting and almighty god, whom the heavens and the valleys fear throughout the whole earth, through whom the lion gives up its spoil and the mountains tremble with earth and sea, and [through whom] each becomes wise who possesses fear of the Lord who is eternal, immortal, vigilant, hater of evil, who knows all things that have happened, good and evil, in the sea and rivers, on earth and mountain, AOTH, ABAOTH, the god of Abraham and IAO of Jacob, IAO AOTH, ABAOTH, god of Israma, bring Urbanus, to whom Urbana gave birth, and unite him with Domitiana, to whom Candida gave birth, loving, frantic, tormented with love, passion, and desire for Domitiana, whom Candida bore; unite them in marriage and as spouses in love for all the time of their lives. Make him as her obedient slave, so that he will desire no other woman or maiden apart from Domitiana alone, to whom Candida gave birth, and will keep her as his spouse for all the time of their lives. Now, now! Quickly, quickly!

I believe these examples would fit what Jesus was referring to: “But when you pray, do not babble like the nations, because they think that by their many words they will be heard.” This is exactly the case here: the spells are so full with nonsense words and are so wordy, because it is believed that the recitation of certain words and phrases (and repetition of certain formulas) would compel the gods and spirits to give whatever you want! Jesus continues: “So do not be like them, for your Father knows the things you have need of before you ask Him.” What is interesting is that Jesus says the Father knows what we need, not what we want.

 

[pablope]

“In praying, do not babble like the pagans, who think that they will be heard because of their many words. Do not be like them. Your Father knows what you need before you ask him.”

I have mentioned on here before that there are times I feel ashamed, perhaps guilty, by adopting Catholic practice. For instance, the Rosary and the Divine Chaplet. It was common to hear (in my Baptist days) that repetitious Hail Mary’s and Our Father’s were not only superfluous, but akin to the babbling words of the pagan.

Are there any known examples of the types of babbling prayers that the pagans of Jesus’ day offered up to their gods? How does a seasoned Catholic respond to this protestant claim?

Someone asked me this before about the Divine Mercy. My response was that the DM is a prayer asking for God’s mercy and forgiveness. So for each bead, dedicate it for every sinner your know, when you run out, dedicate it for your neighbors…and so forth…and you will not run out of sinners to dedicate each bead.