Idon’t know enough about Isalm to really answer this. But I will anyway. I don’t think it is the Islamic scripture that works as a static binding “last word” on women’s rights. I think it is the Islamic culture.Yes mohammad did increase women’s rights back in the dark ages, but what do you think about the unwitting side-effect of islam’s static qualities which limits women’s rights to what is written in the koran & hadiths?
i agree with you. That’s why i said “limits”. And also, it depends on which women belonging to which background, since many during his time lead a very successful life, before Islam. So yes he forbade burrying women (which some pagans did) but he allowed beating women (not found in any divine book), for example. So it is not accurate to say Muhammad and women since many will raise an eybrow, especially those who know what he taught and did or let others do to women.No one is suggesting that Muhammad was a Phil Donahue. But he made plenty of statements that make it clear he was in favor of granting women greater rights than they had. .
i know enough about islam to know that for every issue that the koran tackled, it is the last word for muslims. like it is not the last word on whether or not women should recieved education since the koran did not specifically comment on that issue. but when it comes to inheritance there is no way around the koranic law that daughters can only get half of what sons get. in that issue the koran is the last word.Idon’t know enough about Isalm to really answer this. But I will anyway. I don’t think it is the Islamic scripture that works as a static binding “last word” on women’s rights. I think it is the Islamic culture.
i can understand your point but at that time it was the normal teaching…nowadays a woman can question this and say she has the same right because she as well needs the money, if not to make a family, well to open a business…but well you get the sociolgocal idea behind it.^ I know that. In theory this koranic law isnt specifically anti-woman. But in practice it leads to discrimination of women.
Ha! Please check out Reliance of the Traveller. It is a handbook od Sharia Law written by islamic scholars for the everyday muslim. Amoung other things it states that men can legally beat their wives, have full sexual dominion over their wives bodies with or without thier consent, and that a woman is worth only half of a man.I read something very interesting today that paints quite a different picture of Muhammad then I’ve seen discussed here.
Muhammmed is acknowledged historically as a strong advocate of women’s rights for his time. In a society that was violently patriarchal, Muhammed was in favor for choice and rights for women. Such a position was contrary to the then common abuses of women in tribal society.
“All people are equal, as equal as the teeth of a comb. There is no claim of merit of an Arab over a non-Arab, or of a white over a black person, or of a male over a female. He who honors women is honorable, he who insults them is lowly and mean.” - Muhammmad.
“He who has a female child and does not insult her and does not prefer his sons over her, will be ushered by God into paradise.” - Muhammad.
One of the last words he said before he died: “I urge you to treat women kindly. They are a trust. Be in awe of God’s trust.”
Additionally, the Quran states that sex is to take place in marriage only. This rule effectively stamped out prostitiution, which was rampant during Muhammad’s time.
Before Islam, women were treated as property. Islam established rules that granted women the right to initiate divorce, and a trust fund established before marriage in the woman’s name so that she would have some money in case of divroce. Woimen were also allowed to inherit under islamic law. Islam gave Women the right to own property 1300 years before Western culture established it as a right.
Admittedly, as Ana Matt has stated, Islam seems to have strayed from Muhammad’s stand on behalf of women.
Anyway, all of this I got from Matthew Fox’s book “One River, Many Wells.”
it was refreshing to read something positive aobut Muhammad and women.
or she will be charged with adultry as happened in Iran awhile back. [/QUOTE said:and stoned to death…which has happened many times in Iran in recent years.
I don’t think Matthew Fox has anything to do with Islam. Please provide the quotes from the Quran and the Hadith.I read something very interesting today that paints quite a different picture of Muhammad then I’ve seen discussed here.
Muhammmed is acknowledged historically as a strong advocate of women’s rights for his time. In a society that was violently patriarchal, Muhammed was in favor for choice and rights for women. Such a position was contrary to the then common abuses of women in tribal society.
“All people are equal, as equal as the teeth of a comb. There is no claim of merit of an Arab over a non-Arab, or of a white over a black person, or of a male over a female. He who honors women is honorable, he who insults them is lowly and mean.” - Muhammmad.
“He who has a female child and does not insult her and does not prefer his sons over her, will be ushered by God into paradise.” - Muhammad.
One of the last words he said before he died: “I urge you to treat women kindly. They are a trust. Be in awe of God’s trust.”
Additionally, the Quran states that sex is to take place in marriage only. This rule effectively stamped out prostitiution, which was rampant during Muhammad’s time.
Before Islam, women were treated as property. Islam established rules that granted women the right to initiate divorce, and a trust fund established before marriage in the woman’s name so that she would have some money in case of divroce. Woimen were also allowed to inherit under islamic law. Islam gave Women the right to own property 1300 years before Western culture established it as a right.
Admittedly, as Ana Matt has stated, Islam seems to have strayed from Muhammad’s stand on behalf of women.
Anyway, all of this I got from Matthew Fox’s book “One River, Many Wells.”
it was refreshing to read something positive aobut Muhammad and women.
Nor does your OP.Post No. 4 is not quoting Muhammad or the Quran.
I haven’t checked all the messages, but up to this point you have yet to prove the authenticity of your Mohammedan quotes.Your links don’t really disprove the asssertion that Muhammad advocated for increased rights for woman. For example while one of your links talks about how men were entitled to twice the inheritance of women, before Muhammad, women weren’t entitled to any inheritance.
No one is suggesting that Muhammad was a Phil Donahue. But he made plenty of statements that make it clear he was in favor of granting women greater rights than they had. It is my understanding that these quotes are often used by women muslims who are seeking equality today.
And that was my impression when I read your original post.Idon’t know enough about Isalm…
Unfortunately this statement is inconsistent with the facts of Khatidja’s life.In all fairness, Mohammad did raise the status of women in ancient arabia, but it was still far from the ideals of modern gender equality. .
Are you sure Valke2?Your links don’t really disprove the asssertion that Muhammad advocated for increased rights for woman. For example while one of your links talks about how men were entitled to twice the inheritance of women, before Muhammad, women weren’t entitled to any inheritance.
Not sure about this either, since the Quran dictates the following:THere is a difference, which I have not disputed, between what the Qu’ran provides for women and what Islamic law provides for women. I do not dispute that the reality is that under Islamic law, women are not treated as the Qu’ran sugggests or requires them to be treated.
The Qu’ran affirms religious and moral equality for women. Islamic law does not. Some muslims will argue that these differences are supported by and are a correct interpetation of the Qu’ran. Some muslims will say they are not.
I am not familiar with the details of Mohammad’s first wife. Please enlighten us.Unfortunately this statement is inconsistent with the facts of Khatidja’s life.